Sand from Rio Xingu?

fakiren · Post by **fakiren** » 21 Nov 2006, 20:40

Since i adore my Gold nugget, i want to get sand from rio xingu for my aquarium, anyone could have any clue from where i could obtain that, without flying over there myself?

Best Regards,

kev · Post by **kev** » 22 Nov 2006, 10:30

i have never come across anyone or anywhere that sell's sand from the Xingu. I think you might be chasing a lost cause with this one. Shame you never asked for it 2 year's ago i could have brought you some back

well atleast a jar full.

Kev

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 22 Nov 2006, 11:43

Sand is prety cheap material and heavy, so transporting it across from one side of the world to another would probably make it VERY expensive. And if someone started harvesting sand from Rio Xingu, I'd worry very much about the fish in the river...

By the way, a lot of Rio Xingu is bed-rock with lots of cracks and some stones, rather than sand.

As a moderator, I'd also like to point out that you should add your location to your profile (top right of the screen). That way, if someone knows where you can get Xingu sand in Canada, they could inform you, if you're from Canada, but avoid writing something that is completely useless for someone living in Norway, for example. [Your name suggest Scandinavian origin, but that's just a guess].

--
Mats

fakiren · Post by **fakiren** » 22 Nov 2006, 12:32

Thanks for you comments, added location.

I know if people started to sell sand from the xingu and it would be popular, it could be bad for the fishes there.

But as stated above, the transport would be costly, it weights alot more then fishes.

However, i would be prepared to pay whatever ship cost there is, since it will be cheaper then me flying down there myself, or to the store in Canada that sells it( and take up less of my time )

Best Regards,

kim m · Post by **kim m** » 22 Nov 2006, 13:14

Why is it so important with genuine Xingu-sand?

I am pretty shure the fish don't care at all

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 22 Nov 2006, 13:25

I completely agree, the fish wouldn't know the difference. The sand in most rivers is "essentially inert", i.e. doesn't react with water at all, so the sand itself doesn't have any taste or smell (other stuff that builds up in the sand, such as detritus or bacteria, would potentially smell, but that's another matter altogether).

Most aquatic shops will have a range of sand/gravel that is generally relatively local product, since it gets very expensive to bring sand across the globe. There are special sands that come from various places, like "black" sand isn't usually found in Swedish "rullstensÃ¥sar" (don't know the English word, but essentially banks of sand formed by the ice-age), so it would have to be imported from somewhere where the sand is naturally black.

--
Mats

fakiren · Post by **fakiren** » 22 Nov 2006, 14:19

I agree aswell, but my question still remains.

Perhaps someone knows someone that works with exporting rio xingu fishes, and have thier contact information?

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 22 Nov 2006, 14:34

I think that as we are becoming more aware of the potential problem of climate change, we should perhaps not wish to transport sand across the world when local stuff would be fine.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 22 Nov 2006, 15:04

I understand your point, since in the marine fishkeeping world, substrates are imported. But, I have to agree with the others. As long as you provide hiding places, suitable substrate and good water quality, your fish will be secure.

Amanda

fakiren · Post by **fakiren** » 22 Nov 2006, 18:37

I didnt come here to ask about the morals about bringing sand over half the world to my aquarium, i didnt even ask what you readers would think about it.

I asked, if anyone knew someone that might send it to me.

Either answer my question, or start a new thread about the morals and climate change that might be affected from me bringing in sand from another place.

But i assume, there will not be any answers about that.

So thanks for your information.

kev · Post by **kev** » 22 Nov 2006, 22:42

I think you will find that the Xingu is way more sand than bed-rock, true there is a lot of rock's in there but vast quantities of the river and surrounding bank's are sand.

Kev

grokefish · Post by **grokefish** » 23 Nov 2006, 00:30

You tell them fariken!
sorry to highjack this post.
Hey Kev, I put a post in ages ago asking if anyone had been to the rio Xingu, I can't remember if you replied, but could you tell me what colour this sand is? and the rocks?
Is it all cataracts and whitewater? I understand that it is a long river but just where you went will do.
Are you going there again soon I wanna go there, can I come?
I'll be your best friend!
I'm taking my football home!

Shaun · Post by **Shaun** » 23 Nov 2006, 00:41

I think that as we are becoming more aware of the potential problem of climate change, we should perhaps not wish to transport sand across the world when local stuff would be fine.

I'll sell you some genuine "Aussie sand" loved by Baryancistrus around the world. As soon as I get this copyright dealy sorted

Shaun

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 23 Nov 2006, 10:57

Didn't mean to antagonise.

We try to keep this forum as friendly as possible.

I just wanted to understand why it is so important to have real Xingu sand.

Post by **Shane** » 23 Nov 2006, 14:19

I just wanted to understand why it is so important to have real Xingu sand.

I can understand, especially if someone is into trying to recreate as accurate of a biotope as possible. I still pack around rocks and driftwood that I have collected in certain countries. I have driftwood and stones that I collected in the Orinoco and it makes me a bit happier to use them with Orinoco fishes. I imagine that some stones and driftwood from Africa will leave with me someday and for years to come my African fishes will be with decor collected from their environment.
-Shane

Post by **Janne** » 23 Nov 2006, 19:08

grokefish wrote:but could you tell me what colour this sand is? and the rocks?

fakiren wrote:Since i adore my Gold nugget, i want to get sand from rio xingu for my aquarium, anyone could have any clue from where i could obtain that, without flying over there myself?

To send sand by air fraight will be extremely expensive because there will be at least 3-4 flights out from the area of Rio xingu before it reach Sweden...I really think it will be cheaper to buy your own ticket and take the sand with you. I am not sure either the authoritys in Brasil will allowe you to take sand from the river, you need at least a permission from IBAMA to show at the custom.

Janne

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 23 Nov 2006, 19:36

I probably will regret posting this but even reefers , in the end, have to admit the impossibility of duplicating a biotope exactly in a closed system aquarium. Compromises are necessary to even come close to simulating a given biotope.

Post by **Shane** » 23 Nov 2006, 21:11

have to admit the impossibility of duplicating a biotope exactly in a closed system aquarium.

That is certainly true because all aquatic (esp. when talking about freshwater) habitats are dynamic. An aquarium is a static environment. Even the hardcore biotope fan is not changing their water hardness, current, O2 levels, light levels, pH, and temperature daily to reflect what is happening in a certain one mile stretch of the Xingu. That said, an aquarist can certainly aim for a "snap shot" of a particular environment at a particular time of the year. Having sand from a specific river is certainly not necessary and one can always approximate with local materials. I still empathize with what fakiren wants to achieve.
-Shane

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 23 Nov 2006, 22:24

I certainly do too. I just do the best I can. I'm trying to breed Heckel Discus and they make demands.Just what the trigger(s)are is elusive since all other wild discus are so much more cooperative and parallels are hard to draw. Somehow, I doubt if my sand or lack thereof will be a factor. I have many P. altum friends trying to find the keys to breeding them and we liberally trade ideas. Fortunately, however challenging plecos may be to breed, they still yield to our efforts with relative ease. Often it turns out to be something totally unexpected and a very "unnatural" setup works fine. You just never know until you meet with success.
Large river systems have incalcuable microenvironments with species evolving into specialization for each. A source of never ending challenges are presented to we aquarists, undoubtly one of the reasons so many of us find this a hobby of never ending fascination.

grokefish · Post by **grokefish** » 24 Nov 2006, 00:02

Reefers as in ganga smokers?
Sitting there stoned staring at their fish tank...
I can see how that would do your head in if it wasn't just right

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 24 Nov 2006, 02:13

There are many rivers one can float into the sea of inspiration. Some are more light hearted(or light headed) than others.

kev · Post by **kev** » 02 Dec 2006, 18:56

grokefish wrote:You tell them fariken!
sorry to highjack this post.
Hey Kev, I put a post in ages ago asking if anyone had been to the rio Xingu, I can't remember if you replied, but could you tell me what colour this sand is? and the rocks?
Is it all cataracts and whitewater? I understand that it is a long river but just where you went will do.
Are you going there again soon I wanna go there, can I come?
I'll be your best friend!
I'm taking my football home!

sorry its took me a while to get back to you mate, ive started a thread herehttp://forums.waterwolves.com/index.php?showtopic=109055&st=0&gopid=1014457&
im gona be posting load's of Xingu pic's there, i know its about Leopoldi's but you find Leo's and gold nugget's in the same place's.

Kev

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 02 Dec 2006, 23:58

Hi Kevin,
Are you also in touch with The Angel Fish Study Group(TASG) on http://www.finarama.com? I have wild Peruvian Scalares and lost a bad batch of Leopoldi sold to me on line. To maintain relevancy I just want to say that I keep many species of Hypancistrus and Peckoltia with them that are from the Xingu.

kev · Post by **kev** » 03 Dec 2006, 09:31

i have not looked at that site mate but im going too

.

i only keep Xingu fishes with Leo's, well i did until my big Leo ate a 3" L47 and a 5" nugget

.

Kev

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 03 Dec 2006, 17:26

Hi Kevin.
If you are into wild angels as much as I, you will really enjoy the folks and information exchangeed. The air gets a little thin there because the discussions are among some of the best fish keepers. The Holy Grail is breeding Altums. I have a thread on there, among others, on Pterophyllum leopoldi.
There are even some catfish people there.

kev · Post by **kev** » 03 Dec 2006, 19:57

total crossed wire's here mate, im talkin about Potamotrygon Leopoldi stingray's

, but i do keep Altum's, love them.

Kev

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 03 Dec 2006, 20:44

MonsterFishKeepers should have been a clue, eh? My limited space makes me necessarily keep fish a little smaller than P. leopoldi. An envious fish you have collected. No lack of interest, just room.
Altums, particularly breeding them is receiving a concerted effort. I am using Heckels as my own personal impossible project.

f3mg · Post by **f3mg** » 03 Dec 2006, 23:29

Hi,

Not really Xingu sand, but the closest (geographically) I can think of is Rio Negro Sand from ADA.
You also have 3 other choices from them:

Keep in mind, as everyone told here, they are extremely expensive... for sand.

Besides that, I have no idea if Xingu is close to Rio Negro from a "sand perspective", since I've only once been in Rio Negro and never in Xingu.

Regards,

Francisco

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 04 Dec 2006, 11:52

Considering that Rio Negro flows north to south into the Amazon (from the Venezuelan mountain range) and Rio Xingu flows south to north much further east, I expect that the sand is actually quite different - I don't KNOW, but that would be my inclination.

--
Mats

fakiren · Post by **fakiren** » 05 Dec 2006, 02:55

Great, thanks everyone for the replys.

I have still not found anyone supplying xingu sand, and it might not possible i guess. Im planning a xingu trip myself to collect some, and of course experiance the xingu.

BTW anyone got any photos with sand from the xingu?