Breeding Pictus

Beersnob · Post by **Beersnob** » 21 Sep 2005, 03:48

Just curious if the breeding of Pictus cats is hard or if it is relatively easy...What do i need to do to make them HAppy!

Thanks,

Scott

Dave Rinaldo · Post by **Dave Rinaldo** » 21 Sep 2005, 04:17

Cat-eLog says: Breeding unreported

Pimelodus pictus

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 21 Sep 2005, 08:29

It seems that they aren't easily bred in aquaria. This could be many different causes. One that comes to mind would be that they are group spawners, and that you need to have a sufficiently large group [and the right conditions regarding temperature/conductivity drops, feeding, etc] to get them to spawn. But I have no scientific evidence that this is the way it works, just a guess based on the fact that they are social fish.

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Mats

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 21 Sep 2005, 09:20

I did a google search on "Spawning Pimelodus Pictus", and it didn't come up with anything useful at all. "Spawning Pimelodus" comes up with a fair bunch of material, but nothing really specific. Most of the finds are on Pimelodus Maculatus, and they are referring to it as a "Migratory spawner", which means that it moves from one place to another to spawn. This is far from unusual behaviour, but it makes spawning in aquaria very difficult, as you not only only have to simulate the right time of year [dry-season transitioning to rainy-season], but also the surroundings of the fish would need to change.

I didn't find anything that says this is the behaviour of Pimelodus Pictus, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's behaviour is similar [but it could be different too].

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Mats

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 21 Sep 2005, 11:00

It seems someone pulled it off though!

usually pictus are about 6-10 cm when imported; but I see miniature pictus popping up for some weeks now; really tiny ones the size of a medium Corydoras, about 3-4 cm in length.....

they look fine in all aspects, no hybrids that's for sure, just very small and young baby pictus......

maybe they went at it with hormones in either South Anerica or -god forbid- Singapore?

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 21 Sep 2005, 11:36

Of course, if someone put enough effort (and hormone treatment) they probably can get them to breed.

But isn't it also possible that they are wild-caught smaller ones? Why would they have to be captive bred just because they are smaller? [Not saying that you're wrong here, just asking if you have any other indication that they are captive bred other than the fact that they are small].

I've seen a few smaller ones in my local shop too, although a bit bigger than what you described.

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Mats

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 21 Sep 2005, 12:34

I'm seeing pictus for decades now and these are definitely smaller than any I've ever seen anywhere.....

they're almost the size of baby petricola's from the LFS, so they might even be smaller than 3 cm......about 1" or so?

I have never seen any pictus this size before; and also, they're all the same size and the numbers are high!
I can easily remember seeing pictus in any store, usually between 6-20 at the most; these come in at far larger numbers, 30-50 even in stores that usually carry few non-Corydoras, non-Lnumber cats.

so they must be dirtcheap as well.
I'll see what I can find out, but my instinct tells me someone's going at it with hormones, exatly like the many baby Syno's we see over here (not counting hybrids, but decorus, nigrita, robbianus, eupterus etc), or (wich is worse) baby Tigershovels, baby Redtails etc

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 21 Sep 2005, 12:57

That certainly sounds like captive bred ones.

By the way, is it possible that it's the Czech's at it again?

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Mats

suezbele · Post by **suezbele** » 21 Sep 2005, 13:04

I have been to an online fish store (sorry, don"t remember which one) that actualy list their pictus as bred. i'll try to see if i can find it again and post a link
sue

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 21 Sep 2005, 13:30

By the way, is it possible that it's the Czech's at it again?

somehow I don't think so; apart from their size and age they look fine to me; definitely pictus, healthy and no trash.

DeepFriedIctalurus · Post by **DeepFriedIctalurus** » 21 Sep 2005, 19:17

Considering the fact that almost every store that has fish stocks pictus, I would assume they're merely collecting smaller & smaller fish to keep up with the demand. It's a bit discouraging since the typical $5-9 pricetag never changes. Other evidence that they're not being farmed is the fact that many appear to be quite different forms, clearly from a variety of locales.

I'd love to hear about any evidence of "pictus farming" regardless..

roughbuckincwgrl · Post by **roughbuckincwgrl** » 21 Sep 2005, 19:22

I have a pair of pictus in my tank and although the female was been full of eggs and has laid them they were never fertalized and then eaten. I know that some people have been successful in breeding them but it is extremely rare because everything has to be perfect.

DeepFriedIctalurus · Post by **DeepFriedIctalurus** » 21 Sep 2005, 19:44

roughbuckincwgrl wrote:I have a pair of pictus in my tank and although the female was been full of eggs and has laid them they were never fertalized and then eaten. I know that some people have been successful in breeding them but it is extremely rare because everything has to be perfect.

Did you actually see the eggs yourself, or did the supposed female just loser her big belly?

I'm curious because I've never even heard of this occurring before.

roughbuckincwgrl · Post by **roughbuckincwgrl** » 22 Sep 2005, 05:07

no there where a couple of eggs in their cave but after about 3 days they were gone and I just assumed that the other fish ate them.

aquaholic · Post by **aquaholic** » 07 Oct 2005, 13:58

There seems to be a bit of resistance to hormone bred fish in this thread. Seems to me that hormone induced breeding of healthy pure breed fish should be encouraged, not discriminated against. At very least it takes pressure of the wild populations. Natural breeding of captive fish in confined gene pools or careful selective breeding is far more damaging IMHO. The debate of course will depend from what perspective or outcome we (you) are trying to achieve. Hormone induced breeding it's not as simple or easy as most people think.

Just my 2.2 cents

Mike_Noren · Post by **Mike_Noren** » 07 Oct 2005, 15:11

Don't think that hormone-induced breeding is somehow non-selective: it is equal to passively selecting for the fish not having normal breeding behaviour.
It's doubtful if you could pick a less suitable breeding strategy if you breed for conservation purposes; if you breed for the trade then of course it doesn't really matter.