Multipunctatus "breathing" hard?

[scolba]

Ok, i have another problem....my multipunctatus looks like he is really breathing hard. His mouth is even moving when he is breathing.

Does this have to do with the water conditions? I don't feel my filter on the tank really is adequate, so i am going to get a new one today, but in the mean time, i added another powerfilter and put it on the front, to try to help. what else could this be?? none of the other fish seem to have any issues....any ideas???

Thanks!!!

[scolba]

well....he died. From reading on the internet about other fish breathing hard, it seems he was probably stressed out. I'm guessing from keeping him by himself as the only multi in my tank, and along with the ocellifer.....

does this sound right? I know you guys said that I need to keep the multi's in at least a group of 3...but is there anything else that i need to look at in the tank that might have caused some of the problems? I had a Penguin 330 filter (it came with the tank when i got it) and a undergravel filter run by a powerhead under half the tank. I really wasn't happy with that, so I now have a Eheim Classic and still have the undergravel filter. I do 10-25% water changes/vacume every two weeks or so.

So what I would like to know from you guys, is what else can I do to prevent this in the future? I have been testing the water, but ran out of some of the chemicals and haven't picked up more yet. Are there some other things i can do to keep the fish healthy? I really don't want to loose another cat....

thanks guys!
scott

[buzz763]

i have been keeping fish for 10 years and have had all kinds of problems. most of them came from the people who work at these stores. bad advice is the most common. what it all boils down to is good filtration. get a new undergravel system, run it with top quality powerheads. this is your biological filtration. then buy a good quality cannister filter, i run eheim 2028's to keep the water polished and the water moving on the top of the aquarium this helps all the wastes to o2 exchange. very important. also you want to get a natural gravel about 3" deep,i use a brand called red flint it's the same gravel water treatment plants use to filter water. no red or blue poly coated crap! i run this same set-up on my 220 gallon aquarium with fish i have had since my first trip to the store to buy a 30 gallon aquarium. i have three fish that are 10 years old. i hope this info will help you.

[fishysmell]

rapid breathing in catfish is often caused by parasites

and i work at a lfs store and i asure you i have some pretty good advice..

and i would not recomend undergravel filters for tons of reasons........
they get clogged....
catfish like to burrow in gravel, sometimes getting stuck in undergravels and of corse dieing.....
they do not get the crap out,the rocks collect the crap and have to break it down which takes a while and produces toxins.....
plus the filter plate or gravel itself does not get atmospheroic air, maybe slight aireation, if any at all,
this enviroment only allows so much benefical bacteria to grow,
tiny ammounts, 100 to 200 times smaller then what a single bio wheel can hold.....

canister filters are also weak in biological filtration.....


anyways


i would treat ur tank with an anti parasiticle......
a parisite explains the breathing rate,
and explains the quick death....

what else was the fish doing so i can be exactly sure

[fishysmell]

rapid breathing in catfish is often caused by parasites

and i work at a lfs store and i asure you i have some pretty good advice..

and i would not recomend undergravel filters for tons of reasons........
they get clogged....
catfish like to burrow in gravel, sometimes getting stuck in undergravels and of corse dieing.....
they do not get the crap out,the rocks collect the crap and have to break it down which takes a while and produces toxins.....
plus the filter plate or gravel itself does not get atmospheroic air, maybe slight aireation, if any at all,
this enviroment only allows so much benefical bacteria to grow,
tiny ammounts, 100 to 200 times smaller then what a single bio wheel can hold.....

canister filters are also weak in biological filtration.....


anyways


i would treat ur tank with an anti parasiticle......
a parisite explains the breathing rate,
and explains the quick death....

what else was the fish doing so i can be exactly sure

[scolba]

well, if i didn't know better, the fish looked like he was blind. he would be sitting on the bottom, kind of in the front of the tank (which was unusual for him). He would also be listing slightly (leaning to one side). Then when he swam away, it would be very slow, and then it looked like he was running into rocks and plants, as if he couldn't see where he was going...

the reason i picked up an eheim canister filter (2213) is mainly because Drs Foster and Smith have the classic line of biological filtration listed as "extremely effective". I was looking into a sump, but decided that it was a bit more money than i wanted to spend at that time, and figured anything would be better than the penguin bio-wheel (which the other fish have been living with for 4+ months).

I plan on getting the redflint gravel for a few reasons...I let my girlfriend talk me into the colored gravel, and i don't like it anymore. Also, my uncle lives up in Agusta, WI, which is just a few miles from Eau Claire (where Red Flint gravel is from) and i can personally attest to the water quality up there. It is wonderful! So I figure, since I'm planning on keeping the undergravel as an added precaution and for extra circulation, I may as well use that! Even if only helps slightly, or is all in my head, thats ok. Every little bit helps!

Thanks, guys! I appreciate all the info! Keep it coming though! The more i can learn, the better!

[buzz763]

the other reply you received suggests treatment with medicine and does not address what caused the problem to begin with. undergravel filters will become plugged if you don't vacuum them out once a month, do this with your regular water changes. adding benificial bacteria after water changes will help your tank also.
people claiming to work at stores do what some seventeen year old manager trained them to do. how often do you go to a store and see multiple tanks with dead fish in them.
i learned this hobby through trial and error, i would not give advice i didn't think would help.

[scolba]

ok....in further trying to diagnose this tank issue i got going here, i now have a pleco that is darting up to the top of the tank, and then right back down. Now there are some cichlid pelets up there, so i suppose he could be going for those. Is that right or is this leaning more to a water condition. Am I just ultra paranoid now?

[buzz763]

this might be normal behavior, my cory's and my other cats seem to do it after eating. so it may be normal. don't know why otherwise, could be low 02 levels and gulping air at the top? don't know if plecos do that? where do the rest of your fish hang out in the tank, are they high in the tank towards the top?

[MatsP]

Plecos will go for "air" when there isn't enough dissolved oxygen in the water. Two apparent things to check for in this case is the NO2 (Nitrite) level and CO2. If you have a CO2 unit, turn it off. Nitrite will affect the fish's ability to take up oxygene from the water, so it's a definite possibility.

You may also want to add either a air-stone or a water-circulation pump (with or without filtering attached). Either of these will increase the water circulation and thus increase the disolved oxygen.

This is just speculation, and I can't really say what's wrong, I'm just guessing.

--
Mats

[scolba]

before i went to bed last night, i added an air pump to the power head that is running the under gravel filter, and they haven't gone up for air yet this morning. so maybe that was it, or maybe they were just going for the pellets...

either way, thanks again guys!