Hagen CO2 Unit

pauljameslane · Post by **pauljameslane** » 11 Jan 2005, 21:49

Hi has anyone had any experience using on of these systems and if it is any good?

Can be found on http://urmstonaquatics.com/plants_co2.html

Rocket · Post by **Rocket** » 11 Jan 2005, 22:58

Hi Paul
I got one of the Hagen CO2 units about two months ago and have found it to work fairly well. The problem I have is that it's in a 180 litre tank and the max capacity for the unit is between 50 and 70 litres. Having said this it has improved my plants slightly in the fact that I have less dead leaves appearing. The plants also have a stronger colour. I have young banana plants growing on in this tank, which seem to have benefited from the unit. Also when you look at the price of a proper CO2 system it is reasonably priced.

Hope this helps

Rocket

dstringf · Post by **dstringf** » 11 Jan 2005, 23:24

Rocket wrote: I got one of the Hagen CO2 units about two months ago and have found it to work fairly well.

Any idea how it compares to a DIY sugar/yeast reactor? From what I've read of the unit, it basically works exactly the same way.. just prettier than a 2 litre bottle sitting on the floor next to the tank.

WhitePine · Post by **WhitePine** » 12 Jan 2005, 04:43

My LFS uses it on one of their tanks... and It seems to work pretty well. I use a Milwaukee co2 set up that is run with a ph controller. My plants go crazy...
http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8819.

I also frequent aquatic plant websites and some people use multiple Hagen units on one tank. Most seem to work really well. I just am not into mixing suger and what not. Check out this link http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=20

Good luck.

tritan · Post by **tritan** » 06 Feb 2005, 18:42

Your first link is dead. I am wondering on how you make the co2 canister?? Any instructions on how to make one? How often do you fertilize? I am new to plants and looking for more resources. I had 3 banna plants. I fertizlied one tablet every 2 wks. They grew like crazy forming big stems on the surface that opened up like lily pads then died out suddenly. What is the life span of this plant? Did I do somthing wrong? Are they fragile?

WhitePine · Post by **WhitePine** » 14 Feb 2005, 20:36

Check out these sites.

http://www.qsl.net/w2wdx/aquaria/diyco2.html

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/index.php?

They should have most of your answers.

Cheers.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 20 Feb 2005, 20:17

This unit worked great in a 29 gallon tank until a Cherry Barb got stuck in the back of the diffuser and couldn't get out! Luckily, I was home. I got the little guy out and immediately removed the diffuser from my tank. I called Hagen and asked them about it. They swore they've never heard of such a problem. I looked into it a little further. The Hagen diffuser is unique in the way it is mounted. There are 4 suction cups on the back, not 2 on the side. This leaves an opening for a torpedo shaped fish to get in. I tried the Jungle brand one that uses tablets, but it didn't work well for me. Even without CO2, I had a Radican Sword just jump to the top of the 75 gal.tank.

panaque · Post by **panaque** » 25 Mar 2005, 17:33

I have two of the Hagens on a 120l tank and they work very well for me. They work the same as a diy bottle set up but without the dangers of leakage and exploding bottles. The diffuser that cames with it also pretty effective (but needs regular cleaning to stay that way). You don't need to buy expensive sachets of 'activator' and 'stabiliser' once the original supply has run out because they are just yeast and baking powder. I use cheap bakers yeast and because my tap water is rock hard anyway I don't bother with the baking powder. Each refill gives me 4 weeks of CO2 and by refilling one 2 weeks after the other the CO2 content of my water is pretty constant.

WolverineFan · Post by **WolverineFan** » 25 Mar 2005, 19:16

Hey Panaque, How in the world do you get your system to last 4 weeks?!?!?! I can barely get mine to last 1. I use a recipe off of plantedtank.com where I fill with sugar to the mark and dissolve 1/4 tsp of yeast in warm water and fill to the second mark. Mine goes gang busters for 4-5 days and then drops off to nothing after 7.

Josh_Mcfadden · Post by **Josh_Mcfadden** » 26 Mar 2005, 04:08

Mine works well for me also. I have found that the mixture lasts quite a long time. And it is also reasonabley priced compared to a larger much more expensive unit.

metallhd · Post by **metallhd** » 26 Mar 2005, 07:35

If I may, what I have not seen mentioned here is that for CO2 to be really effective the lighting must be adequate also, to the point that the plants can actually use it. All the nice Amano tanks you see have brilliant lights - see Oliver Knott's site for some examples of really nice planted tanks at plantella.com. They also require fertilizer at such a point to have sustained growth, all in all it's a delicate balance avoiding explosive algae growth also.

Concensus would point to about 1 watt/litre or so, 3-4 watts per gallon . .

I have only light on my 10-gallon tank, almost 5 watts/gallon, no fertilizer and no CO2 with vigorous growth always and fortunately almost no algae, some hair algae but nothing excessive. My 33-gallon has about 125 watts but I have an algae problem after over-fertilizing - from all the research I have done and from my own experience, once it's there it's very tough to get rid of - it's only kept under any control by pruning and again no fertilizer, and for the time being no CO2.

Plants include java moss, java fern, water hyacinth, and crypts - I got rid of the hygro becuase it was just out of control . . .

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 26 Mar 2005, 15:50

I noticed a new CO2 canister-type from Red Sea. I saw it in one of the catalogs, but I can't even find it on the Red Sea web site. You're supposed to be able to interconnect it with an electronic timer and a powerhead, so you can shut it off at night. It's supposed to be good up to 40 gallons and last for one month, like some of the others, but I've kinda heard this before! I'm not sure what to do.

I cut down the lighting in the 75 gallon, and the plants are growing better! 4 watts per gallon must've been too much. The algae growth has slowed down and the cats have come out to play all day. I cut the wattage down in the 10 gallon tank also. The same thing. I've left the 29 gallon tank the same. Stagnant growth and a lot of algae. Fish hiding until the lights go out.

leiarius pictus · Post by **leiarius pictus** » 26 Mar 2005, 19:24

what sense is there in growing plants at all without SOME thought to
carbon? you can have all of the lighting,sterilizers,nitrate sponges or poly filters you want but you HAVE TO USE SOMETHING TO ADDRESS THE NEED FOR CARBON .
Flourish excel is our personal favorite, our plants go so CRAZY that we have to find people to take the prunings.
It's
not cheap (we know we're moving w/in a year or so, so setting up co2 for all of our six planted tanks is not feasible where we are) but it's surely
a damn sight better than what we used to do: throwing out algae covered plants weekly and having to renovate gravel ... toxic gravel, far too frequently.Add to it all the cost of weekly 50% h2o changes and the cost of excell goes down again; we change H2O only 2x's per month,have little or no algae,healthy plants not to mention that our regular Saturday mornings working on our tanks are EVER SO MUCH MORE PLEASANT now,finding folks to take your excess plants is far more fun than throwing them out !!!
we buy 64 oz for $20.00 US through Foster-Smith and it supplies carbon to one of our 55 gallon tanks for more than two months.
our latest tank uses the Red Sea co2 generator and undergravel heater but to plant one plant w/out thought to co2 is just dumb.

I know,'cause I've been there- done that.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 27 Mar 2005, 18:12

I have a Chaestoma in the 75 gallon tank. Chaestoma require heavy-duty aeration. If I put an expensive CO2 system in the tank, I'd be wasting money. The Chaestoma's requirements come ahead of the plant's requirements. At this point, I only have very hearty, quick growers. I no longer keep "delicate" plants. It's not worth it.

Everybody has his or her own preferences. To make assessments after 7 postings is rather harsh. There's no need to get upset. It's nothing personal. Not all of us are rocket scientists. I buy things at good prices when I see them. When it comes to plants, some things are trial and error. I would think it's a little difficult to pass such judgements on someone else's tanks when you don't know the circumstances.

PS, Excel can cause excess hair algae growth. Seachem confirmed this. I'm just getting rid of it.

WolverineFan · Post by **WolverineFan** » 28 Mar 2005, 02:49

If you go to Seachem's site you will find that they say just the opposite. Excel actually helps get rid of hair algae.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 28 Mar 2005, 16:27

I correct myself, Wolverine. But I had to read it 20 times before I could understand it. The person also stated that the "slight" algae problem returned. I e-mailed them for a clarification. I will let you know the results. I've pretty much stopped purchasing additives with a few exceptions.

I've noticed that if I keep a feeding diary, some algaes disappear. When I had good draperies installed, this helped with other algaes. RO water helps, too. I'm just down to the nuisance stuff. This guy surprises me by eating it!

I love Otos, too.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 28 Mar 2005, 21:58

I got a form-letter response from Seachem. It was a sales pitch for their test kits.

panaque · Post by **panaque** » 30 Mar 2005, 11:52

WolverineFan wrote:Hey Panaque, How in the world do you get your system to last 4 weeks?!?!?! I can barely get mine to last 1. I use a recipe off of plantedtank.com where I fill with sugar to the mark and dissolve 1/4 tsp of yeast in warm water and fill to the second mark. Mine goes gang busters for 4-5 days and then drops off to nothing after 7.

Reducing the amount of yeast could help. In the end I think it's a trade-off between the rate of CO2 production and how long it keeps it up for. Yours might produce the same amount of CO2 in a week as mine does in 4 weeks. Not necessarily a bad thing if you don't mind refilling it more often. I've become cautious about using too much yeast to boost production since I once overdid it and the mixture started to foam and made its way through the tube into the tank. Very messy.
Experimentation is the key. Much depends on the strain of yeast you use and the ambient temperature so what works for others may not work for you.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 30 Mar 2005, 14:13

What kind of yeast do you use? There are so many options these days.

panaque · Post by **panaque** » 30 Mar 2005, 14:36

Bronzefry wrote:What kind of yeast do you use? There are so many options these days.

I just use bog standard baking yeast. The kind that needs to be reactivated in water. I've also used the fast acting stuff for bread machines but that never lasted for more than a week for me (but maybe that's because I used too much). Some people prefer brewer's yeast or champagne yeast. These are more alcohol tolerant so in theory you could make the mixture last longer with these by increasing the amount of sugar. I stick to baking yeast. It's cheap and does the trick.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 30 Mar 2005, 22:34

The expiration date has a lot to do with how long yeast lasts. Some stores are better than others at rotating their stock. You hit it with all the different yeasts! It's a minefield. There used to be a cake yeast and packet yeast. I saw the Red Sea unit in a catalog once, but when I called the store, they haven't gotten it in yet. The Red Sea unit is good up to 40 gallons for 30 days in a moderately planted tank. It's supposed to have an interface of some kind so that you can hook it up to a timer and an air pump. This is different. I'll keep an eye out for it.