Hoplo catfish and wormer?

[Fisutar10]

I have hoplo catfish which do not tolerate flubendazole and they became sick every time when I use wormer which contain flubendazole (Camacell).

What treatment for worm and flukes You have used to hoplo catfish and they tolerate it?

[plecoloachfish]

Not just my hoplos then, what happened when your hoplos had the wormer, loss of balance, floating upside down etc?
I used Kusuri wormer (also containing flubendazole) on mine and 2 of them died and the other two are not well at all.
http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =6&t=41322

[Fisutar10]

Here is my story:

I've been successfully using your Camacell product for deworming my aquarium fishes, including angel fishes, plecos, loaches, barbs, bristlenoses, gouramies, other catfishes and so on. Even small fry of plecos, guppies and bristlenoses have been in the tanks when applying Camacell with no problems occurring. My friend has also been using Camacell on tetras, various Synodontis catfishes and plecos with good results and no contraindications.

However, it seems that Hoplos (Megalechis thoracata/personata) can in fact be quite sensitive to Camacell.

Here is a report what has happened to me lately. I had two adult Hoplo cats and I had to deworm the tank in which they were. When Camacell had been in the tank for few days, my Hoplos started to behave very abnormally. The male was very pale, almost white, and was also very angry towards the female and afraid at the same time. It swam against the tank glasses. It also breathed very fast and strongly (aeration is not an issue in my tanks and the other fishes in the tank were not showing any symptoms of insufficient oxygen levels; the other water parameters were also as usual, no ammonia or nitrites). The male Hoplo also tried to escape from the tank. His balance was gone and he was occasionally up side down or sideways on the other side. His swimming was very difficult and after a short while his heart was beating very fast and he was exhausted. Two days later the female started to have the same symptoms. Naturally they had no appetite.

I took them into a separate hospital tank with fresh water and administrated Sera Baktopur direct (nifurpirinol, againts bacteria) just in case if they happened to have some internal inflammation or other secondary problems cause by bacteria. The Hoplos were in a very bad condition for a week but recovered eventually.

All the other fishes in the tank with Camacell very perfectly fine.

I recalled that I saw the Hoplos tasting Camacell tablets directly when I started the medication so I thought that maybe they had an overdose because of this and decided to dissolve the camacell tablets in a separate container first the next time I have to apply Camacell.
Well, later I had to deworm the tank in which the Hoplos were again and dissolved Camacell well before administrating it. Unfortunately, it did not help at all and I lost my male Hoplo.

I sweared that I do not deworm any tank with Hoplo cats anymore. But then I saw Camallanus worms in angelfish and I had to deworm the whole tank with 4 little hoplos also in the same tank. I dared not to use Sera Nematol because its instructions warn "may induce problems with scaless fish". And I live in Finland where levamisole and other such alternative medicines seem not to be available. So I had to use Camacell for two 5 days cures... And again after few days the Hoplos are showing the same symptoms and I have to take the Hoplos away from the tank and just hope that they do not have those horrible Camallanus worms in them and that they will recover.
I do not overdose, I change water before and after, there are no other medicines in the tank, only regular aquarium plant fertilizers are used (no Easy Carbo or Seachem Excel "liquid carbon dioxide" is used), and aeration is not a problem.

So I wonder if some fish species are allergic to flubendazole or other ingredients in Camacell? Can it be that Hoplos have, e.g., a gene mutation which causes that they do not have an enzyme that breaks down flubendazole?

HS Camacell have 3 times more flubendazole than Kusuri wormer and Camacell have two other component.
Vaikuttavat aineet/tabletti:

One tabs to 50 liter water:
12,5 mg diflubentsuroni, 341 mg pyrantelitartraatti, 17,6 mg flubendatsoli.

I tried Kururi wormer later and I had same effect but later....so I think that it must be flubendazole which is problem to hoplos.

I am not sure if Tremazol (praziquntel) is also problem....

[plecoloachfish]

Pleased its not just me having problems with hoplos and wormer products, similar circumstance, all other fish fine hoplos dead or close to death, no balance, swimming heavily effected until eventually they die, I'm sending my pack back to kusuri and will also direct them to this post.

[Fisutar10]

Thanks:). It is important that hoplo catfish do not get flubendazole. But I live in Finland and we can not use levimasole. What we can use if hoplos are in tank and there is worms? And do hoplos tolerate levimasole?

[plecoloachfish]

Cant be sure, I would like to know if anyone else has had I'll effects or not from flubendazole based products though with their hoplo's

[apistomaster]

Flubendazole and praziquantel are very safe when used as directed.
I have observed distressed respiration of fish exposed to an extreme overdose of flubendazole.
In this instance they used about 25 times too much.

[Fisutar10]

Flubendazole and praziquantel are very safe when used as directed.
I have observed distressed respiration of fish exposed to an extreme overdose of flubendazole.
In this instance they used about 25 times too much.

Do You have used them to Hoplos catfish? It it here the main point. All other species tolerate it very well, but I have had problems with hoplos ja flubendazole.

[plecoloachfish]

I followed the instructions to the letter on exact measurements so the only way they would have overdosed would be if they have an extremely low tollerance to the drug, other fish were fine in the tank so why would it segregate that species and not the others too.

[Fisutar10]

I found one more sad experience Camacell and hoplos. It is in Finnish discussion forum, in Aqua-Web.
http://aqua-web.fi/forum/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=230321
I translate it to english here.
"At last, I found a similar experienced! I lost a year ago, adult several years old hoplos with Camacell, after a course of Camacell. Or, in fact, at the time I thought the reason was Unicell medicine because obviously it is a bit of overdose and poisoning symptoms began immediately, but only armor. Nervous system symptoms, floating upside down, etc. Later, bleeding from the mouth and the region went white. Mm. Of these symptoms. Last fall I lost my new hoplos when I was again used Camacell medicine . But the symptoms did not start until the week, just when you had to carry out water changes. Symptoms similar but not as dramatic.
A long line of aquarium business no one had ever heard of such ..."