Surprise Baby Synos!

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 13 Dec 2011, 01:12

Long story - but I rescued 2 baby Synodontis Catfish while taking down a 125g tank. 2" of water, no filtration or heat for 6 days. While I was emptying the remaining water I saw them! No idea who their parents are (I had 2 Angelicus, 1 Bruchardi, 2 fake Grannies and a Decorus) - I gave away my adult Catfish last month! They must have been hatching since then ... surprise surprise!

http://fb.flixlab.com/watch/0sl31iw4vpd ... cqwvhosau9

Wow! They're doing well! About 3/8" right now!

Sandee | http://sandeeland.com/fishcam
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Maccus · Post by **Maccus** » 13 Dec 2011, 03:18

Congrats...I share your excitement in finding them. Do raise them and keep giving us updates.

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 13 Dec 2011, 04:24

Oh they're not going anywhere! I recently moved 11 of my 18 tanks (another long story). I kept one FW fish, my 12" Buttikoferi) - gave away / sold 2+ 125g tanks full of Synos and Cichlids! My Granny sale was posted earlier ...

Anyway - I have a real sweet spot for baby anything! I'll obviously need to setup a grow-out tank. For now, they're happy in the only tank I had left in inventory (uugg, Fluval Edge).

Here's a still pix - very difficult to take a shot, quick little guys! They look like Multis - but I never ever had Multis in that tanks! Ideas?

Sandee | http://sandeeland.com/fishcam
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Post by **Birger** » 13 Dec 2011, 04:35

Well that is pretty cool.

Going by the list above and the color I would say it is possible you have a couple of little angelica there.

Birger

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 13 Dec 2011, 04:39

One would think ... but they were among the first to go - could there have been eggs for over a month???

Compared to cichlid fry, they're only 2 weeks old ...

I can see their little catfish whiskers ... fully defined. Just amazing.

Sandee | http://sandeeland.com/fishcam
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Post by **Birger** » 13 Dec 2011, 06:32

A few eggs probably got trapped somewhere the fish could not get them, then probably hatched around the same time you cleaned the fish out or shortly after.

They have had to make do on their own after hatching so growth is not as fast as if you had been feeding.

Birger

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 18 Dec 2011, 04:02

Progress Report: ... what is it they say ... cats have 9 lives? Well, these little guys have used up 3 so far! I didn't see them for a few days - figured they just crawled into a crack on the one rock in their tank. Nope. They made it thru the sponge on the filter intake, passed the impeller, must have dropped between the media ... and I found them swimming at the very bottom!

They're very very slightly larger ... but still too tiny to get a good shot.

Next update soon!

Sandee | http://sandeeland.com/fishcam
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Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 18 Dec 2011, 05:46

Sorta look like Brichardi now!

Sandee | http://sandeeland.com/fishcam
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Post by **Birger** » 18 Dec 2011, 06:22

Sorta look like Brichardi now!

Can't see much in these pictures, it is too out of focus...fairly tough to do with only

1 Bruchardi,

Birger

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 18 Dec 2011, 15:33

I have the webcam on the tank - they're hanging out in the corner! Say hello!

http://www.sandeeland.com/fishcam/

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 19 Dec 2011, 09:49

if it's brichardi-like it'll be a hybrid for sure, since there was only 1 adult brichardi in there

it might have crossbred with the decorus...

it's quite unique though, to breed these without hormone injections.

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 19 Dec 2011, 18:00

I'm sick over the fact there may have been more ... and I just didn't know. Doing my best to see these 2 mature and live happy little lives! Rare indeed.

Sandee | http://sandeeland.com/fishcam
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Maccus · Post by **Maccus** » 21 Dec 2011, 05:31

I'm jealious enough even with two, mine have always refused to breed. Despite that I have a "breeding group" of six of the same kind.

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 21 Dec 2011, 06:49

It really is fascinating. I had 2 125g tanks full of Cichlids and Synos - I had plenty of Cichlid babies, but this is a first for me! I sold my Grannies, broke down each tank, and now this ... something tells me I'll be starting up another FW tank soon! LOL ... mind you, after giving away a 75g tank last month, I just bought another one for a turtle I adopted - so much for paring down!

Sandee | http://sandeeland.com/fishcam
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Maccus · Post by **Maccus** » 22 Dec 2011, 04:53

I understand downsizing must be done and choices must be made. Personally something drastic has to happen for me to give away synos or certain plecos. Even with the fighting, I was thinking...Hmm, can I get them a larger tank?...

Scleropages · Post by **Scleropages** » 22 Dec 2011, 18:00

Hey, Sandee. Congrats on your surprising find. Keep us posted as to how the babies look when they begin to mature. Based on the list of Synos you said were in the tank, I'm going to have to agree with Birger. They are most likely baby S. angelica... which would be pretty awesome.

I've got a trio (2 females and 1 male) in a 125gal tank with some adult Uaru, clown loaches, and odessa barbs. I'm planning on setting up a 150 gal rubbermaid stocking tank when resources will allow to try to breed the S. angelica as I don't think the conditions in my tank are ideal for survival of the eggs and fry.

I'm curious to know the conditions in the tank you found the fry in. What temp, pH, filtration, and substrate did you maintain? What types of water changes did you do? I have spoken with some people who've bred some of the riverine species of Synodontis and the consensus seems to be that gravel/sand substrate doesn't work well for breeding. They've mostly had success with dirt/mud or yarn substrate.

Maccus · Post by **Maccus** » 22 Dec 2011, 18:37

This is news to me. Please elaborate on the mud or yarn substrate. I've never even heard of yarn substrate.

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 24 Dec 2011, 03:28

Great to hear your comments, and very cool that we're all sharing in the excitement ... I'll get into the details of the tank soon, in the meantime, here's a video progress report! You can start to see them more clearly now!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkVJZrpSlk4

pleco_breeder · Post by **pleco_breeder** » 24 Dec 2011, 05:40

Video says "private"

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 24 Dec 2011, 14:22

Sorry! It's public now! Pls try again!

Sandee | http://sandeeland.com/fishcam
Sent from my iPhone!

YouTube · Post by **Jools** » 24 Dec 2011, 14:29

Yeah, this is not a common occurrence at all, so well done. Look forward to updates on their progress - in about 6 months we should have a better idea about ID. Little is know about what the various species of look like at this size, so it's a waiting game that we're all interested in! What we could do in the meantime is have a look at pics of all the different Synos in the tank to make sure those IDs are all correct?

Cheers,

Jools

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 25 Dec 2011, 02:06

Sadly, I hadn’t taken many shots lately, due to my big move – but I did take this one last one, for no reason other than to show the guy buying the tank (that it held water). Who knew, I had Syno babies lurking about!

As you can see, it’s a standard 125g tank with crushed coral. I kept the temperature (while it was up and running) between 80 and 82 degrees. My Ph was in the high 7s. The water quality was very consistent, not much variation. Filtration included 2 Eheim 2217s. When I found them, the water had been standing for about 5 days, no heat no filtration. UUgg.

Over the past 5 years, in this particular tank, I kept mainly my more aggressive Cichlids, and those Synos that weren’t behaving in my mild tank (also a 125g, the tank where I kept my Grannies). Some pix below - these guys may be the parents: Angelicus and Brichardi (not the Multi, I had moved him out of that tank since the pix was taken). Or, it could have been the 2 Angelicus in that tank - but I had sold one a month+ prior. OR, they could have all been *having fun* and lady cat just mated with the fellow with the nicest smile - who knows. But, I'm posting some random pix of the occupants of that tank (from years ago). You'll also notice the *fake* Granulosus(es) I had, they were also given away early, so I'm pretty sure they weren't part of the mix.

Either way – in 6 months, we should see exactly *who* they are … hoping they’ll continue to mature in the small tank they’re in now. Since my move, I’ve downsized from 18 tanks to 6, plus a new Terrapin tank – that’s 7 and the baby Syno tank … totaling 8. The number of tanks are growing again!  BTW, I’m reluctant to actually tell you what I have the babies in … but they seem to be doing ok for now. The WERE in a breeding net, in my 125g Buttikoferi tank – but one jumped out and was LOST until I nearly vacuumed him up (glad I found him, but OMG!). Then, I fired up a 6g Fluval Edge – they were both in there all happy – until they were GONE! Got sucked up thru an opening in the pre-filter, thru the filter, and found under the impeller! Well, that’s 3 of their catfish *9 lives* … they seem safe now (new, secure pre-filter). I’ll be setting up a 20gL soon as a grow out tank …

Maccus · Post by **Maccus** » 25 Dec 2011, 05:38

Interesting. Only thing of note in that to me is the temp. I've never kept mine that high. If I got baby synos, I 'd hope they could have my extra fifty five gal.

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 25 Dec 2011, 19:26

... 20g, 55g, 125g - yes, bigger tanks in the future!

Scleropages · Post by **Scleropages** » 26 Dec 2011, 02:05

Thanks for the info, Sandee. If you don't mind me asking, can you describe how you did water changes on the tank? (i.e.-how often?, what % of water did you change?, filled with tap water?, any other particulars?) Thanks again!

Richard B · Post by **Richard B** » 26 Dec 2011, 22:03

Were there also petricola & Lucipinnis in the tank at one point? Looks like it from the pix.Depending on when these were removed, lucipinnis could be a possibility but maybe angelica which is what i'm hoping for - the decora looks too small.

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 26 Dec 2011, 22:37

Never ever. Those pix were of Synos in my mild tank. Gotta be Brichardi mix ... 'she' was the last one to go.

Regarding my water changes - every week, 20%. Tap water with conditioner. Nothing special. Spirulina flake. Mysis every so often as a treat.

Lastly, stupid of me not to pay closer attention. But glad they look healthy and are growing quickly ...

Sandee | Sent from my iPhone!

Scleropages · Post by **Scleropages** » 27 Dec 2011, 16:46

Thanks, Sandee. Best of luck raising those little critters. Keep us posted as they mature--we especially like pics!

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 28 Dec 2011, 03:01

Scleropages wrote:Thanks, Sandee. Best of luck raising those little critters. Keep us posted as they mature--we especially like pics!

And I love taking pictures! Will do!

Sandee · Post by **Sandee** » 29 Dec 2011, 02:31

I just shot this HD video - except for when it does an auto-focus, you can REALLY see some detail on these 2 little guys. The tank bottom is bare, so you'll see a reflection - but that's actually helpful. You can clearly see their white barbels, eyes and fins. Big bellys as they just ate and were pretty playful ...