Plecos for low temps

[gage]

Hey guys, I'm looking into a pleco for a tank containing Gymnogeophagus gymnogenys "quilero", a very non-aggressive SA cichlid, my problem is the tank goes down as lot as 65F up to around 75F (a 3 month cool down at 65F). Now, is there a pleco out there that prefers this temperature range? Preferably from Uruguay like my Gymno's, but that really doesn't have any relevance on my decision.

Would also be nice if they ate a bit of Algae, but wasn't dangerous to feed them pellets, so an Omnivore that eats a bit of algae.

The tank is 36"x21"x18" (LxWxH) and 59g. So something around 6", 8" max would be nice, though as long as a potentially 6" Gymno can;t eat them size doesn't matter.

[PlecoCrazy]

Apparently many Histonus are from that area
http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... ay#p158621

If you click the distribution area of under many of the histonus species you will find many Loricariidae that should fair well with your Geo's

[MatsP]

Using the Cat-eLog search facility, we find the following from the Uruguay river:
Here

You can use the temperature settings in the http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/search.php - but as you see if you look at the list above, the temperatures are not registered for a large number of species, so whilst it's feasible to find something that covers that range, you may not find more than a few of the potential candidates. Unfortunately, finding good temperature data for the less common fish is quite difficult.

Medium sized plecos would be for example the Ancistrus and Rineloricaria.

However, this is not a commonly exported region, so you may need to search around to find someone that imports fish from southern parts of South America, rather than the more common Amazon/Orinoco regions.

I'm sure Bas Pels is going to be around sooner or later on this subject as well.

--
Mats

[gage]

I wonder if I were to talk to Felipe Cantera if he could help me, he is the only importer of fish from the area that I am aware of.

on a second thought, I'm going to scrap the idea of fish from the same river (Arroyo Yerbalito to be exact) and just go with temperature appropriate fish, likely a school of Corydoras paleatus and a few Rineloricaria fallax.

Is there a way to sex the Rineloricaria?

Thanks
Gage

[gage]

How would a group of Chaetostoma do? should be fine eh?

[MatsP]

How would a group of Chaetostoma do? should be fine eh?

They like a lot of water movement, which may not go down that great with the Gymnogeophagus. But also, the Chaetostoma from the northern parts of South America will expect pretty constant temperature - even if they like lower temperatures, it's not the same as a southern species which will have a warm summer and cooler winter. Chaetostoma often come from high altitude streams (and streams that run down from even higher altitude, and still are pretty cool), but there is little difference in temperature through the year, as there is little change between "winter" and "summer".

But yes, it's possible with the right setup.

--
Mats

[gage]

Good to know, that you for the info! I was a tad ignorant to the fact of fluctuations being just as important as temperature, this could be difficult.

maybe the key is to PM Felipe and see if there are any plecos from this exact river.

[sunfish]

Even though the Cichlids may not be agressive, I would advise against keeping Rineloricaria (or any other whiptail or twig) together with eartheaters. I've had a "left-over" whiptail in with my young Geophagus "Red Head". Until one day I saw it being carried around by one of the Cichlids. It had accidentally been picked up by the feeding red head. It was very quickly realeased (unharmed), and I transferred it to another tank, so that would not happen again.

Bigger plecs work OK. I got L177 and L205 in with mine, and there's no problem. I don't know about the Gymnos, but my Geos are VERY greedy, when it comes to food. I'm not sure whether Corys (or carnivorous plecs) will get enough food.

For a large cool water tank all I can think of is Scleromystax barbatus, my absolute favourite.

[gage]

Hey, do you think either of those plecos will thrive in water as low as 65F, maybe even 60F? The Gymnogeophagus gymnogenys "quilero" need cool temps like this for about 3 months.

[MatsP]

L177 absolutely not - they do best in temperatures above 28'C/82'F.
L205 is unlikely to like low temperatures.

If you can find some common bristlenoses

Ancistrus cf_cirrhosus

you may find that they are OK with lower temperatures - although I'm not guaranteeing that either - however, (some may criticize this) they are commonly available, tank-bred, relatively inexpensive fish, so no great loss if it fails. I'd rather loose one of these than an exotic, high-value, L-number pleco, and from my personal experience (from ignorance), I kept one in a cold water tank, and it is still with me over 5 years later and spawned not so long ago - much happier at the 25-27'C that I'm keeping her, but still survived an unheated tank in English winter.

--
Mats

[gage]

Thats what I thought.

ok, not plecos for this tank, I'm not going to put one in there if it shouldn't naturally live in cold temperatures.

Thanks

Gage.

[Mike_Noren]

18 celsius is no problem for common ancistrus. Actually I'd say most species except the very most high-tropical ones will handle that just fine, e.g. common pleco.

[Bas Pels]

Just returned from Uruguay

The problem is, both Brasil and Argentina don't export fish from this region (in fact, it is forbidden) and in Uruguay only 1 person exports - who rather spends his time with tourists catching fishes (quess what I was doing there?) than exporting them.

Other south American countries are too warm (lowland) or can not face the summer temperatures (high land, such as Chaetostoma)

In Uruguay you can find catfish everywhere, Rhineloricaria, Corydoras, plecos (although I did not see any Hypostomus this time, I did see them before) Hisonotus, Otocinclus, Ancistrus, you just name it

The problem is, the importers (especially these in North America) are mostly after cichlids, so these should be influenced

I myself brought, amongst others, 2 Ancistrus females, to breed with, but assuming this to go succesfully, you will still not benefit from that, as I myself am Europe-based

[MatsP]

I myself brought, amongst others, 2 Ancistrus females, to breed with

Surely you also got a male? Two females is not enough you know ;)

Do you have an ID, and if so, is it in the Cat-eLog? If not, please try to get some photos...

--
Mats

[Bas Pels]

I was on their location earlier, and I do have some (6) males

As far as I know, no Ancistrus from Arroyo Aquas Blancas in Uruguay (I'll get GPS data later) are described

[MatsP]

I was on their location earlier, and I do have some (6) males

As far as I know, no Ancistrus from Arroyo Aquas Blancas in Uruguay (I'll get GPS data later) are described

using my plastic-replica Crystal ball, I see a future of Ancistrus sp. arroyo in the Cat-eLog.

--
Mats

[sunfish]

Hey, do you think either of those plecos will thrive in water as low as 65F, maybe even 60F? The Gymnogeophagus gymnogenys "quilero" need cool temps like this for about 3 months.

Absolutely not. I should have added that my Geos need very warm water (around 84F), so I chose plecos that do well in warm water. What I meant to say way that (larger) plecos work well with eartheaters. I really don't know what species will do well in your tank as I've never had such cold water.

[Bas Pels]

Almost everywhere in Uruquay one finds Rhineloricaria - unless there is another bottom dwelling loricarid, and cichlids - Gymnogeophagus, Australoheros and Crenicichla - are there as well

Gymnogeophagus, just like Rhineloricaria, seeks out unplanted areas. Therefore I'm fairly certain they are able to cope with each other, and I never ever saw any kind of trouble between fish of these genera

Generally speaking, in a certain habitat, a fish will have to cope with all fishes it encounters there. Apart from predator - prey relations, all fishes from a certain habitat make up a good combination for a tank

[gage]

Hey, do you think either of those plecos will thrive in water as low as 65F, maybe even 60F? The Gymnogeophagus gymnogenys "quilero" need cool temps like this for about 3 months.

Absolutely not. I should have added that my Geos need very warm water (around 84F), so I chose plecos that do well in warm water. What I meant to say way that (larger) plecos work well with eartheaters. I really don't know what species will do well in your tank as I've never had such cold water.

Thats what I figured, Orange heads need rather warm temps, 76-78 being minimum.
Thanks.

[gage]

Almost everywhere in Uruquay one finds Rhineloricaria - unless there is another bottom dwelling loricarid, and c*****ds - Gymnogeophagus, Australoheros and Crenicichla - are there as well

Gymnogeophagus, just like Rhineloricaria, seeks out unplanted areas. Therefore I'm fairly certain they are able to cope with each other, and I never ever saw any kind of trouble between fish of these genera

Generally speaking, in a certain habitat, a fish will have to cope with all fishes it encounters there. Apart from predator - prey relations, all fishes from a certain habitat make up a good combination for a tank

They search for unplanted area's? Bizarre, most fish enjoy plants.

[Bas Pels]

I think this is because between the plants you willo encounter Crenicichla and perhaps Hoplias seeks the plants out as well

Further, Australoheros are not kind fishes, these might kick them out of the plants as well

I'm not a fishpsychologist, I only tell where I found them

But you are right, I did not expect this either, in fact it had to be pointed out to me before I noticed it myself

[gage]

Definitely a bizarre find, and sounds quite interesting.

Your theories do make sense, I know if I were a Gymno I wouldn't want to mess with the Creni's lol.

What species of Crenicichla were there? anything small? say, less then 6" that I could get my mits on? lol.

[Bas Pels]

I think there is 1 Crenicichla which gets to 15 cm - or even smaller. However, I don't care at all for Crenicichla, UI would not know a Cr scotti from a Cr vittatus, and can't tell you more.

[AleGer]

I have 4 Ancistrus cf cirhosus. They were living in 50 l tank for some time. The tank was with out heater and it was situated ta the windowsill. So the temperature in winter was 15-18 C (59-65F). They lived quite well. Even they were spawning in 18C (65 F).
So I think Ancistrus cf cirhosus is a good idea:)