L066 the shyest Pleco?

Easystreet · Post by **Easystreet** » 28 Aug 2007, 20:16

Hello,

I have a 48x12x16 40 gallon stocked for about a month now. I have 12 Penguin Tetra's 2 Apistogramma's and 3 L066's. The tetra's and Apistogramma's are all doing fine. The L066's are hidden just about all the time. At first they were all together all the time. Now one has taken up space under a log in the middle of the tank. The other two are on the left end of the tank by the filter intake with a rock in between them.

If I can't get a good look at them how do I know if they are eating or not. At first I fed them after the other fish and they would come out and nibble a little then scurry away. Now they no longer come out. I switched to feeding them at night and for a couple days I noticed the food was gone when I got up. Then the 3rd day I noticed it was still there in the morning.

How often do I feed these guys. They almost never seem hungry. What should I feed them? It seems anything I try the other fish eat before the pleco's know its there.

What would you do if you had very very shy pleco's?

Jason

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 28 Aug 2007, 20:58

Strange as it may sound, but if you add more hiding places, the fish will be more visible. It's the fact that they then feel safe, because there are some good hiding spaces close by, rather than in the corner of the tank...

--
Mats

Easystreet · Post by **Easystreet** » 29 Aug 2007, 01:39

Ahh I see. I definately do not have a ton of hiding places for them. The ones I do they like hiding outside the intend hiding place.

I need to find some of these round river rocks. I have a ton in my front yard. I attempted to use them and I soaked them in a bleach/water solution overnight and they start to change a rust color. I scrubbed the heck out of them but didnt seem to work. So I basically felt they were not good to use.

Thanks MatsP I will work on giving em more hiding places.

Jason

bslindgren · Post by **bslindgren** » 29 Aug 2007, 03:14

I have three BN plecos, which I thought were all the common BN, but Silurus thought the females are A. triradiatus. The male hasn't been out for months, and I don't have a great picture of him, so I think he may be either A. triradiatus or A. sp.(3). He used to come out at feeding, but now he is only out at night, and you'll only spot him if you approach really carefully. I have started giving them zucchini and one of the females really goes to town on that. She tends to be out a lot anyway, while the other female is a bit more shy. So there may be both species, sex and individual differences in 'shyness'. Mats' suggestion makes sense, though.

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 29 Aug 2007, 09:45

Temperature may also be a issue.

The L066 come from very warm well oxygenated waters, and require the same at home to keep their metabolism up to speed.

I would provide a water temp of about 27C-30C.

Lower temperatures can make them sluggish and not hungry.

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 29 Aug 2007, 17:11

They also come out more if there are more of them.

I kept 12 in a 75 gal. with discus and they came out a lot. They were also being kept at 28-30C and loved live black worms. Lots of fish will come out for live foods quicker than prepared foods.

Easystreet · Post by **Easystreet** » 29 Aug 2007, 19:53

My water is a little cooler. Mine is at 25.5C - 26.1C (78F-79F). Would the Apistogramma cacatuoides and the Penguin Tetra's be ok in 27C water?

I have tried to keep the water well oxygenated. I have the return from the canister filter pointed up slightly to disturb the water. I have a whisper 100 air pump. It has to outlets which are each pumping air to an air stone. I have one in each corner. I also have and Under Gravel Jet system attached to a sponge filter. 300gph with 3 "jets".

My water Parameters are ok. But my water is now in the cloudy stage of the cycle. I cleaned the canister filter and the sponge filter last weekend as part of its monthly cleaning but it did little to stop the cloudy water. The water began to get cloudy about 2 weeks ago. From what I have read this is normal. Is this correct?

I suck up poop and change 10(25%)gallons of water once a week and clean the filters once a month. Is this an acceptable level of maintenance? Should I do the water changes twice weekly?

The Apistogramma cacatuoides have bred twice so far. No survivors from the first batch of fry and they just laid eggs again last night. The tetra's have almost doubled in size in the last month. Everybody seems ok. I just worry about the pleco's. They are the reason I set up an SA tank. I love those little guys. I just want them to be happy.

Jason

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 29 Aug 2007, 20:21

Would the Apistogramma cacatuoides and the Penguin Tetra's be ok in 27C water?

Yes they would be fine. I would go for 28C.

How long has the tank been set up?

What is your lighting like?

Plecs like very dim lighting.

Easystreet · Post by **Easystreet** » 29 Aug 2007, 22:33

Thanks for the reply.

The tank has been set up for over 2 months now. It has had occupants for a little over 1 month. The lighting is something I have played a little with. I have two 24" hoods covering the 48" long tank. Each hood contains 1 20w florescent bulb. I bought some Tropical Sun 15w bulbs but they turned the tank a yellowish green and I noticed no change in the pleco's behavior so I went back to the 20w more white bulbs.

Open to suggestions or recommendations on a good bulb to use to give these guys a more natural atmosphere. The lights are on a 12 hour cycle. 12 on / 12 off.

Thanks again,
Jason

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 30 Aug 2007, 07:48

Floating plants are a good way to dim the light, as is a light tannin stain to the water.

Long branches of bogwood reaching up to the surface also helps, along with a dark substrate.

Do you have any photos of the tank?, so we can give you a few aquascaping tips.

What are your ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH readings?
I am a bit concerned about the cloudy water.

Luka · Post by **Luka** » 30 Aug 2007, 10:30

The problem with cloudy water might be caused by the filters. You shoudn´t clean them so often. Expecially when the tank has been set up just for 2 months, the filters are not cycled properly.
Do the regular water changes as you do now, but you shouldn´t clean the canister filter more often than every 4-5 months (the sponge filter you can clean often, it depend how stocked your tank is).
I hope it will help you.

Easystreet · Post by **Easystreet** » 31 Aug 2007, 04:53

I took these photos tonight quickly. Sorry for the quality. You can see in them the cloudy water. Its a brownish haze.

When I cleaned the filter this past weekend the top polishing pad in the canister was solid brown colored it was appeared soiled. I have 4 trays. the Bottom tray has a coarse filter sponge to catch the poop with a 50 Micro pad on top with some bio balls on them. The second from the bottom is all bio balls, 3rd from the bottom is all bio balls, top most basket has a filter polishing pad that came with the filter and a 100 micron pad on it. I was thinking of adding more Eheim Ehfi synth to help polish the water this weekend. What do you think?

Here is the full tank.

Here is the corner where 2 of the 3 L66 hide.

Here is the middle where 1 hides behind the driftwood in the middle.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 31 Aug 2007, 09:56

I'm pretty sure the cloudy water is caused by cycling problems. Check carefully that you don't have any nitrite or ammonia. If you have, then change some water (up to about 50%, I would say).

--
Mats

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 31 Aug 2007, 18:51

If ammonia and nitrite test at safe levels your cloudy water is a candidate for a water clarifier. They are flocculating agents that help lump the fine fog of unattached bacteria enough that your filters will finish clearing the tank. Sometimes when an aquarium has this problem water changes actually tend to perpetuate the problem. This seems like part of "new tank syndrome."
The cloudiness will go away on it's own but a clarifier can speed things up. Once it clears normal water changes won't start the cloudiness back.

This is just one way of many. Water changes alone can solve it, too.

Easystreet · Post by **Easystreet** » 31 Aug 2007, 18:57

Something like this Apistomaster?

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/P ... 004+113906

- Jason

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 02 Sep 2007, 11:25

Easystreet,

I would add a continuous network of wood from one side of the tank to the other, with enough space behind it that the fish can travel from one end to the other without being seen.

I would also stack a bit of wood to make dark hidey holes.

Another alternative to wood is rocks, which may work out a lot cheaper.

You do have a backing on the tank?

Easystreet · Post by **Easystreet** » 04 Sep 2007, 18:55

Hey Recoll,

I have a black background on the tank now. I could definately put in a network of wood on the bottom of the tank. Not sure I have the resources to stack it very high though. Would probably be enough to do as you suggest and hide them from one end of the tank to the other.

I assume then I would feed them on the back side of the tank where they would most likely be hiding? Or on the front to make them come and get it?

Thanks for the reply.
Jason

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 05 Sep 2007, 09:21

I assume then I would feed them on the back side of the tank where they would most likely be hiding? Or on the front to make them come and get it?

I would feed at the back for a month or so until they are settled in their new surroundings, then feed at the front.

Do make sure all uneaten food is removed in the morning though. Always feed less than you think, and monitor water quality closely. A quarter of an algae wafer is more than enough.