Banjo Cat's - Sexing and Species

CatBrat · Post by **CatBrat** » 30 Mar 2007, 11:36

Hi all,
I have recently purchased 6 banjo cat's from a few of my LFS's. Soon I will be setting them up into their own Biotope tank in the hopes of getting them to breed for me one day, but for now they seem happy enough stirring up the silica sand in my discus tank.
Anyway, I was hoping that somebody would be able to give me a hand in sexing these guys (if it is even possible, lol)...

Here's my guess...
1.female
2.female
3.female
4.male
5.male
6.female
Are these Bunocephalus coracoideus?

Also, one of them appears to be a slightly different species. The guy at the LFS said the 'red' ones were males and the brown ones are females, but I'm pretty sure he was making it up

I was thinking Bunocephalus amazonicus, but the cat-e-log states a max size of 45mm, and this guy is already 95mm. What do you think...

Has anyone on here managed to breed these yet? I found one report, but it's in German, and I can't read that lol.
Any help would be much appreciated..
Cheers, Jake.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 30 Mar 2007, 12:34

I have no good idea on how to idnetify these fishes, but here's my thoughts on a theoretical basis:

There are couple of Bunocephalus species that aren't in the Cat-eLog. One possible candidate would be B. aleuropsis (based on the two facts that it's got an overlapping distribution range with C. coracoideus and is listed in CLOFFSCA as 91mm SL).

Sometimes, using logic works, sometimes not. I was unable to find any good images of this species, other than the "dead ones" on ACSI.

--
Mats

CatBrat · Post by **CatBrat** » 30 Mar 2007, 12:53

Thanks Mats.
I had a look at those pic's, but from what I can see the head of B. aleuropsis is a lot shorter, and rounder than that of my fish. Not sure whether that comes back to how the specimen was preserved/treated after capture, sexual dimorphism or what? But I, like you, don't have much of an idea about identifying them, lol.

What you say does seem pretty logical though, as to the catch locations.

Cheers, Jake.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 30 Mar 2007, 13:05

CatBrat wrote:Thanks Mats.
What you say does seem pretty logical though, as to the catch locations.

Cheers, Jake.

Well, catch-location is one of many keys to identifying a fish. But it's only really useful if you KNOW for sure where the fish was caught [ideally, that you were there when it was caught!], because exporters/importers and wholesalers (or even the LFS) may mix[1] fish into one batch, even if they are from different locations originally, at any point on the way to their home in our tank(s).

It is unlikely, however, that you got a fish from say French Guyana or Southern Brazil when most other (popular) fish come from Colombia or Northern Brazil...

[1] Because they really think they are the same species, because they "don't care" or because they know it's different, but can make more money selling one/a few odd fish as a something "known" than by trying to sell it under it's true name.

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Mats

Post by **Silurus** » 30 Mar 2007, 13:16

I think (3) and (4) are one species and all the rest are another (they are like my "B. amazonicus" in that they are way larger than the published maximum size).
As for breeding reports, have you looked at this?

CatBrat · Post by **CatBrat** » 31 Mar 2007, 03:22

It funny you say that because fish (3) and (4) are both from different shipments. Fish (1) nd (4)are from a shipment that came into NZ around this time last year, and (2),(3),(5), and (6)only came into NZ a few weeks ago.

Just out of interest are you judging this from the general head and body shape or what? Is there any way that we can pin point the exact species or is this just more so guess work? I should be able to get some better quality pictures if needed.

Do you think the other 4 are Bunocephalus coracoideus or another species again?

Cheers, Jake.

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 31 Mar 2007, 14:37

The red one is interesting. I have handled a few hundred banjos but haven't ever seen the red species.

CatBrat · Post by **CatBrat** » 01 Apr 2007, 10:30

Yea he is a very nice fish! Can anyone hazzard a guess at my questions in my previous post?

Cheers, Jake.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 01 Apr 2007, 17:20

Jake,
Some folks have managed to breed them, but not often. I heard that with this species, the female may have the eggs on her back in some manner. How? I haven't a clue. The more you watch these fish, you'll believe anything. At the moment, I have a male and female alone in a 15 gallon tank. The female has taken to building a mound of substrate and hiding in it. There are some bare spots in the tank. She pops out of the mound at night for food. Unreal!
Amanda

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 02 Apr 2007, 11:04

CatBrat wrote:It funny you say that because fish (3) and (4) are both from different shipments. Fish (1) nd (4)are from a shipment that came into NZ around this time last year, and (2),(3),(5), and (6)only came into NZ a few weeks ago.

It's not completely unusual for species that are similar and from the same country/region to be mixed up, particularly if they aren't very obviously differnet (like black fish with white spots and a brown fish with darker brown spots may stand out a bit more - but even those can be mixed togehter if they are for example!)

And of course, multiple shipments from the same distribution chain will probably have a similar mix of fish each time - becasue somewhere someone says "those go in tank number 53" for the different species.

Sorry, but I can't help further on any of the other questions.

--
Mats