Possible Tiger Shovelnose Issues?

newt0524 · Post by **newt0524** » 14 Nov 2006, 14:35

Hey all

I think this is the folder to post this question in, if not let me know

I have had a tiger shovelnose for about 4 months now. He was about 3" when I got him and is now about 5" (length). I feed him about every 3 days on frozen bloodworms, say about the size of a finger tip to the nail.

I have noticed from looking at pictures of TSNs on this site that mine seems to be much more lightly coloured than others. Is this a sign of anything? Also, his growth seems to be under or slower than the growth of others on this site (about 2 inches in 4 months vs 1 to 2" a month in others. Is this sign of anything?

Now an even vaguer question, I keep his tank clean (75Gal right temporary / will be moving to a 300Gal in a couple of months) and filter it properly. All test levels of ammonia, nitrite and nitrate are right where they should be. Yet his gills seem pink or red from the outside. I know in other fish this is a sign of burnt or damaged gills. I had a look at some young ones at a local shop and didn't really notice the same thing (maybe lighting). Is this noraml for a TSN? should I be able to see a little red through his gills?

Am I just being paranoid or does he(barry) have problem?

Any Help is greatly appriciated.
Newt

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 14 Nov 2006, 14:43

Growth in fish is influenced by MANY factors, one of which is of course what and how often they are fed, but also water temperature and water quality, along with genetic factors (if you take a look at a classroom full of 7-year olds, you'll see what I mean - why should fish be dramaticaly different?)

I would also recommend that you feed a more varied diet than ONLY bloodworms. It's good food, but just like humans, fish should eat a variety of different food items during their life.

I'd like to ask a few questions to clarify your water quality tests:
1. Can you give numbers for the Ammonia, nitrite and nitrate tests?
2. Have you verified that your tests are correct (for example check that your results match what your LFS measures on the same thing)?
3. It's very likely that if you have a sudden feeding frenzy, the good bacteria that handles the ammonia to nitrate conversion are not coping with the volume of ammonia immediately - thus you'd get a spike on ammonia and nitrite shortly after a feeding session... Try testing say 2-4 hours after a feed.

Note: I haven't kept TSN, nor do I have any intention of doing so (as I'm unable to afford/fit a tank suitable for the adult size of this fish).

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Mats

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 14 Nov 2006, 14:53

Red gills are usually a sign that they are working as they should.

However If you suspect something is wrong, try to take some good quality pics and post them here.

I do agree with Mats that a more varied diet is a good idea. Have you tried shrimp and cockle?

Do bear in mind that this fish will outgrow the 300g at some point.

newt0524 · Post by **newt0524** » 14 Nov 2006, 15:17

hey

I know it will outgrow the 300 in a couple years. It will be a temporary solution until ?. Hopefully (probably) have the means and space to build the 900 Gal I have been planning. That will house a Walking Catfish, a pacu and the TSN.

will try to grab some pics and post them of the TSN.

as far as the levels go, the actual readings are:

Ammonia 0.1 mg/L
Nitrites 0.1 mg/L
Nitrates 35 mg/L
Temperature about 80-82 (depending on room temp)
Ph about 7.4
Alkalinity 250 mg/L
Slightly hard water
I have not tested for chlorine to be honest, I think that the PH test reveals that? Yes or No?

I am not quite sure what you mean by compare them against LFS.

The feeding frenzy idea is a good point, I will measure it right after feeding (2-3 hours) and see what I get. I am pretty dilligent about vaccumming and water changes, so if the feeding frenzy is the case, I guess I should clean up just after feeding?

newt

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 14 Nov 2006, 15:25

35 mg/l nitrate: Is that at the beginning or end of your water change cycle (or at the middle of it?) It's an acceptable value at the end of a water change cycle, but if it's the starting point for anothe cycle, it would probably rise above the "acceptable".

Does 0.1 on the ammonia and nitrite mean "the lowest my test will show", or actually that it's above the lowest? If it's showing anything above the lowest, your biological filtration is not working well enough. I would also recommend that you measure these a few times at different times after feeding, to make sure that they don't spike too high.

By compare with LFS (Local Fish Shop), I mean take a water sample to your LFS and let them test it, and check the number they get. If the LFS gets the same (or at least somewhere close-by) to your measurement, all is fine. If the values are not close, you've got to figure out who is right, which can be an interesting challenge...

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Mats