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I want to change my 30G from a BN breeding tank to a breeding tank for these. How many should i get to start a breeding group? And if £7 a good price for them a 2"? and finally what size do they start to breed at?

£7 each isn't bad. I think my local wants £9 each for about that size, and they are usually not expensive. They are slow-growing fish, and not the easiest to breed. Mine have laid eggs a couple of times, but never got further than that - few but large eggs. Mine were abour 2.5" SL when they bred - that's not to say they can't be bred a smaller size...

At that size, they are probably a bit difficult to sex, so you may want to buy quite a few (5-6) to make sure you have a good chance of getting at least one of each.

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Mats

MatsP wrote:£7 each isn't bad. I think my local wants £9 each for about that size, and they are usually not expensive. They are slow-growing fish, and not the easiest to breed. Mine have laid eggs a couple of times, but never got further than that - few but large eggs. Mine were abour 2.5" SL when they bred - that's not to say they can't be bred a smaller size...

At that size, they are probably a bit difficult to sex, so you may want to buy quite a few (5-6) to make sure you have a good chance of getting at least one of each.

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Mats

Do you think there worth trying to breed?
Ive got loads of BNs and struggling to get rid of them quicker than there breeding. It was good as a starter and to learn from but i want to try something a little harder now that is easier to sell on.

Depends on what you mean by "worth". You're almost certainly not going to get rich breeding them. You may be one of the first in England to breed them (at least in the Planet Catfish group).

If I were doing this, I'd pick something that is halfway between easy to breed and expensive - , or perhaps.

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Mats

MatsP wrote:Depends on what you mean by "worth". You're almost certainly not going to get rich breeding them. You may be one of the first in England to breed them (at least in the Planet Catfish group).

If I were doing this, I'd pick something that is halfway between easy to breed and expensive -

Sturisoma

,

Peckoltia

or

Hypancistrus

perhaps.

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Mats

What i mean was will i actually be able to sell them on and make some money back or is it going to be like BNs which im pretty much having to give away. Im not bothered about making a profit but i would like to make a little money to help pay for food ect.

Well, that's why I'm saying go for something that is relatively easy to breed, and easy to sell.

The problem with a fish that sells (at a relatively large size) in the shops for £7 is that the shop probably buys them at under £3 from their wholesaler. And they can decide when to buy those fish, how many to get, etc. I expect it will take a year to grow them to 2" where you can sell them for £3 each. But as I said, with the "benign neglect" method of breeding, mine have spawned (to my knowledge) twice, and never had any fry.

If you get some Sturisoma, for example, they can be sold at aroun half a year, and shops sell medium-sized ones for about £7 as well - and you can produce lots of them in a year if you look after them well. With the same approach to breeding as above, I've produced several dozen babies... I swapped some, sold some to the LFS and sold some privately here. Unfortunately, my wife gave away my breeding pair...

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Mats

Fair enough, Ill have a look into them then. Cheers.

Yeah i saw your post thats a real shame. Did you ever mange to find any of them?

Would S. festivum be a good choose?
My lfs had some in for £7.50 last time i was in.

if you're simply looking for something to breed to make money from I wouldn't go for Sturisoma. Although they can be bred quite readily (assuming you've got good quality breeders - which can be expensive to acquire), the fry are notoriously difficult to raise and the 6 months to get to a saleable size requires intensive husbandry.

Try some different Ancistrus e.g. A. claro or one of the starlight types (e.g. L183), or Hypancistrus e.g. L066, where the parents do a lot of the broodcare and youngsters can be left in the tank to eat pretty much whatever is around. There should be more demand for these species, as easy to breed as commons if you get good breeding stock.

You're not going to make much more money out of breeding any other loricariids unless you want to invest heavily in breeding stock, equipment and husbandry.

I've kept P. maccus for a few years now, and although I've bred other Panaqulous, can't get them to readily reproduce.

Good luck with your next venture,
Mark.

kizno1 wrote:Would S. festivum be a good choose?
My lfs had some in for £7.50 last time i was in.

They are probably the common - also listen to what Mark (CoryWally) says. I agree Sturisoma fry are difficult for the first several weeks - I don't find them too bad once you've got past the first 6-8 weeks or so, but until then, they are quite tricky - mine won't go looking for food, but Apistomaster says his does.

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Mats

I had the same as MatsP.
A lot of fry, but did not searched for the food.

CoryWally wrote:if you're simply looking for something to breed to make money from I wouldn't go for Sturisoma. Although they can be bred quite readily (assuming you've got good quality breeders - which can be expensive to acquire), the fry are notoriously difficult to raise and the 6 months to get to a saleable size requires intensive husbandry.

Try some different Ancistrus e.g. A. claro or one of the starlight types (e.g. L183), or Hypancistrus e.g. L066, where the parents do a lot of the broodcare and youngsters can be left in the tank to eat pretty much whatever is around. There should be more demand for these species, as easy to breed as commons if you get good breeding stock.

You're not going to make much more money out of breeding any other loricariids unless you want to invest heavily in breeding stock, equipment and husbandry.

I've kept P. maccus for a few years now, and although I've bred other Panaqulous, can't get them to readily reproduce.

Good luck with your next venture,
Mark.

Im not looking to breed them to make money i just want something that i will be able to sell on and wont get stuck with like i am with BN fry. I want something a little more challenging aswell.

The Sturisoma dont seem like they would be a good choose then. If i can find them i think i might go for the L066.

I think i'd stick with your original idea and try p. maccus, i have a breeding group and i get far more satisfaction from them than i do from my sturisoma. Neither are the easiest to get viable spawns/ fry from, but then thats the challenge

kizno1 wrote:If i can find them i think i might go for the L066.

Corywally was breeding L066 so have a word with him!

[Mod edit: Fix broken quote tag --Mats]

When i had mine breeding i had 15 adults mixed amle and female and it took about 3 to 4 months to get them settle and breeding. Of those adults i really only had 2 or 3 males that the ladies would spawn with. The babies were tricky to keep. I found that i just had to leave them in the cave and let them emerge from the cave on there own and grow up in the tank. Anyhting other than that would ensure a high death rate. Once i could see a few one inchers in the tank i would pull most of wood out and wrangle up the little guys and put them in a grow out tank. good luck
Plan on having a lot of flow and a lot of wood. These guys will dirt a tank quick and you will never see them but rest asured that if the conditions are right, at night with come zucini in there you will see it wiggling with little ones.

I had 21 adults in a 6x2x2 and after 18 months I pulled the tank down and wound up with this:






This is what was left after I removed all the adults.

I put a breeding report on another forum, if I can find it I will post it on here.

Sorry i hadnt noticed any posts.

scatz wrote:I think i'd stick with your original idea and try p. maccus, i have a breeding group and i get far more satisfaction from them than i do from my sturisoma. Neither are the easiest to get viable spawns/ fry from, but then thats the challenge

Hmm i think i might stick with the Maccus. It may take a while to raise them and be hard to breed but it will be worth it in the end IMO.

Firestorming wrote:I had 21 adults in a 6x2x2 and after 18 months I pulled the tank down and wound up with this:






This is what was left after I removed all the adults.

I put a breeding report on another forum, if I can find it I will post it on here.

Wow that alot of fry. What did they spawn in? what was you feeding them on?
Yeah if you can find it i would be quite interested in reading it.