Panda Corys beating each other up?

[catxx]

So I have a relatively new 130L I've been working on the last 2 months. It currently houses 4 Panda Corys and 4 Kuhli Loaches. That's it. And lots of plants.

I just had a sit down in front of the tank to find one Panda missing almost all his tail, another with nibbles out of his and a third with a crescent moon bite-shape out of his dorsal fin. The forth, and the original Cory as I had 1 and added 3 more about 3-4 weeks ago, is unharmed. Has the original, largest, been asserting his authority? Has anyone else had this with their Corys?

The torn fins have no blood marks and no black ends, in fact the one with the loss of most of his tail looks like it's already regrowing.

I should be picking up 3 Plecos on Tuesday (2 King Tigers and an L201) which should distract the Corys anyway.

[PeterUK]

My first immediate thought was that maybe you have had something come in on the plants and is munching on the cory's, I have had dragonfly larvae and water beetles come in on plants before.
My second though is that ammonia is burning the fins.
Has the tank been cycled properly ?

[mummymonkey]

I've owned hundreds of

Corydoras panda

and never seen even a suggestion of aggression.

[catxx]

no bugs or anything other than a few hijacking ramshorn snails and there's no fin damage at all on the Kuhli Loaches. The tank's filter media was cloned from another tank, it's got a great hunk of old filter media in the new filter too. The fish had been fine and healthy in the tank up until I noticed this yesterday, had them for a couple of weeks.

however, i've done a second water change today (they had one yesterday also) and have whipped out the carbon and popped in some anti-bacterial meds. hopefully that will help. will do another water change tomorrow.

[andywoolloo]

i have never had any corys harm each other, I have had pandas and sterbai and peppered.

good deal on the water changes. Unknown if you needed to add meds tho.

Did you post your A NI NA ph and temp? feeding? substrate? they are very susceptible to NA's.

any strange rough deco they may be getting hurt on?

[catxx]

here's the tank:
the substrate is very fine dark gravel.

i'll do a full water test in a sec. I added medication as one of the cory's tails last night had a few blood spots, gone now but done a second treatment today. no water change today but will do one tomorrow before the plecos are added to the tank. sadly there's no delaying the pleco's arrival. been planned to pick up from the breeder for some time and his schedule is tight.

feeding is currently half a sinking catfish wafer. didn't feed last night though. temp is about 76F.

edit:
Nitrates normal at around 15ppm. Will test ammonia when I seek out the Tetra Test instructions as I've lost mine...

[nj2tou]

I don't know much about loaches at all, but could they be doing it? I had a panda that had a torn fin a couple of weeks ago and couldn't figure out why either. I thought he might have gotten injured on a piece of decoration, (they get crazy during spawning and sometimes feeding frenzy and fly in and out of the plants and decorations) but the next day more of his tail was gone and he died the day after that.

Don't know what caused it either. All my other fish (and I have a lot in the tank) are fine.

[andywoolloo]

i would do 50% water changes a day till you can test that water.
I have never kept a loach so i am unsure if he/they are responsible, I am leaning towards a water issue. like i do.

seriously tho. I also like to keep my NA's lower for corys, and other fish, but really watch it when a cory is in there. I try for 5 ppm.

[catxx]

I don't have enough buckets or back strength to do 50% water changes at the mo. Done a smaller water change today and just found another cory with a more shredded dorsal fin than yesterday. It's so frustrating! There's still one Cory with immaculate fins, only 3 with tatty ones, and the fins on all the Kuhli's are fine too. The edges of the damaged fins show no sign of that tell-tale black crustiness of fin rot nor any fluffy fungus or anything like that.

GAH!

Have added the Plecos today, had to sadly, and will do a further smaller partial water change tomorrow.

Tested ammonia (about 2 hours after small water change) and it's at 0.

[Richard B]

A long hose with a fitting for a tap negates the need for buckets & lifting (something like a python: purchased or homemade)

[Bas Pels]

@ waterchange - try a long hose. I have 31 tanks, and only 1 needs waterchanges using buckets - because it is too close to the floor

[catxx]

(I also have my boyfriend whinging about water bills too as we're on a meter)

How do you do dechlorinator with a python system? it would mean trailing a hose right through the living room from the kitchen, I'd need a 10ft hose I think.

[Bas Pels]

Our water does not contain chlorine , so I can't tell

As far as I know, if desinfection is needed - which is far from always the case, it is done with ozone in NL. Ozone is far less toxic than chlorine. But personally I have water from the soil, which does not need to be desinfected - even better

[MatsP]

Python users normally add the dechlorinator to the tank first. And 30m of garden hose from your local Wickes or B&Q shouldn't set you back much more than £20 - it gets more expensive if you go for the "nicer" hoses from the LFS, but still not too bad.

I fill my tanks with a long hose from my RO storage, and have a long hose that reaches the outside drain directly, so only my sons tank uses buckets (as it's upstairs, and I don't actually see the point, as it's only one [large] bucket each water change).

--
Mats

[andywoolloo]

yes I use a python also on all my tanks except my one small ten gal betta tank.

I add the dechlor (I use Prime) as the water first goes in, I dump the proper amount into the water where the python is adding water to the tank.

remember to keep the new fresh water as close to the same temp as the water already in the tank.


You can google homemade or DIY pythons probably.

[catxx]

Thanks, I'll look into this. With regard to the temperature, I have a combi-boiler so no worries about hot water coming from a storage tank, do you just mix at the tap with a thermometer to get the right temperature first?

[MatsP]

Thanks, I'll look into this. With regard to the temperature, I have a combi-boiler so no worries about hot water coming from a storage tank, do you just mix at the tap with a thermometer to get the right temperature first?

I'd mix at the tap, and get it slighly lower - about 1-2'C lower will not cause any problem and it helps ensure the oxygen level doesn't drop quite as much as it may if you put in hotter water. Make sure you check the temperature, as if you draw a lot of water, you may find that the temperature goes up or down as the boiler switches on/off.

--
Mats

[catxx]

I'm not sure I really trust my sink tap, it likes to go from luke warm to burning boiling hot in an instant, then my boiler goes OMGZZNOOO and locks out, plunging it back to ice cold. and so on. washing up is oh so fun! might have to stick to buckets and spare heaters and the other half's back instead!

[MatsP]

I suggested to someone else that one way to avoid "lifting" the water is to put a (possibly quite big) bucket upstairs [assuming the aquarium is downstairs], and using siphon to drain the water from upstairs into the tank. Obviously, this requires a decent length hose to fill/empty the bucket, but it's "lift-free" (other than getting the EMPTY bucket upstairs, but that should be doable for most people). This obviously doesn't work with a one-story house/flat. It's probably also a good idea to get a tap or similar to be able to control/stop the flow - and if you want to be REALLY fancy, you drill the bucket and put a hose-barb and perhaps a tap, rather than siphoning over the edge of the tub - but that is pure luxury!

It would perhaps be a good idea to have some sort of hook or similar (gaffer tape?) to ensure the hose doesn't fall out - not that it's really a big issue, but it's a pain if you have to go back upstairs to put the hose back in, and then try to start the siphon again.

By the way, I'm glad I don't live in St. Albans - I'd be forever taking a trip into the MA branch there, and I'd have even more month left when the money is finished...

--
Mats

[catxx]

mat, I'm going to have to read your answer a few times, physics was never my strong point haha!

and I know about MA, and the fact is I work in central london with Wholesale Tropicals and ADC in easy reach. And Wildwoods isn't a very long drive from home either. It's terrible >_< my poor non-fishy boyfriend! He's put his foot down and I'm limited to 3 tanks now. boooo.