Another Mysterious Plague Hitting the Panaque tank

mokmu · Post by **mokmu** » 19 Aug 2003, 17:27

I have lost a number of pl*cs during the last 2-3 months now. So here is the list:

L27 (3")- 3 months
L90C Peru (6")=2 months ago
Common Bristlenose(adult) =a month ago
P. Albomaculatus - last week (I feel bad since I just learnt that not a lot of people have this fish in my country)
Just yesterday another L90c

Tank has been established since a year back. Substrate cleaning and water change is done every other day. Filter cleaning once a week. Water parameters are fine Nitrite=0, nitrate 3-5, ph 7, ammonia=0.

Other inhabitants, L27 Goldline, L27a, L204, L90c small, a tiger peckoltia (don't know the exact specie), L191, L27 (long snout, redfinned).

Symptoms: Two-Three weeks before the death, the fish are a bit slower than usual and they don't hide as often but hide when I try to put my hand in the tank. Mostly they are seen perching on top of the driftwood or on the glass. Later on they are found in the corners of the tanks near the filter out take. As the days go by, they are really lethargic and don't move as much even when they are touched. Death is close by and they don't move at all. All this time there seems to be nothing wrong with their appearance, no marks or discolorations. When I find them dead, stomachs are usually fine but the eyes are already sunken. It seemed to me like they were being poisoned slowly.

I originally though that it was my main filter since I occassionally (although not regularly) clean the bottom and middle filters. Once a week, the top filters floss are maintained. I changed the whole middle filter just a month a ago yet deaths still occured. Just today, I thought of removing this driftwood that I placed over 4 months ago. Beyond that time, I even had that tank overstocked because my other tank had cracked and I needed to have it fixed and cycled all over again. After the broken tank was cycled and fixed, I moved the other pl*cs to that tank and maintained a "purely" panaque or wood eating pl*c tank. I found this really cool looking drftwood roots at the LFS and stuffed it in the tank and even added another powerhead to simulate more current through the snag.

So far, I have taken that new driftwood out and cleaned out the middle flters that are rarely maintained. I can't think of anything else. I am really lost. Any ideas on what causes or caused this? Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

Regards,
Mike D.

STINGRAY · Post by **STINGRAY** » 19 Aug 2003, 19:13

Apart from disease in the form of internal worms etc, I think the tank breaking may hold the key. Did you reseal the tank yourself, and if so what sealant did you use? It sounds to me like a fungicidal based sealant as been used. Thus poisoning your fish. Are there any other fish in the tank other than cats?Regds Darren.

S. Allen · Post by **S. Allen** » 19 Aug 2003, 23:16

heh, and haven't panaques been known to chew the extra bead of sealant on tanks at times?

mokmu · Post by **mokmu** » 20 Aug 2003, 15:55

The Panaque tank in question right now was never broken. Sorry about the confusion. I have two tanks of the same size --- a panaque tank and a pseuda tank. The flooring on the pseuda tank was the one that broke. I had to move all my pseudas and vampires to the panaque tank when the pseuda tank broke. At one point I had close to 25 pl*cs in one tank with the panaques and the pseudas together. That was I think early this year or late last year. I have moved the pseudas back to their tank since.

No I never fix my own tanks. I have the LFS to do that for me.

Apart from all that has been discussed, it completely boggles the mind as to why these deaths have happened the past months.

Regards,
Mike D.

STINGRAY · Post by **STINGRAY** » 20 Aug 2003, 21:12

Do you use a water purifier?

Easy · Post by **Easy** » 21 Aug 2003, 00:56

Has the water been aged? Or was it taken directly from the faucet? I lost an arowana 5 years ago when I directly filled 25% of my tank with water from the faucet...chlorine must have been a lot at that time. Within an hour, it's eyes sunk and it died...

If this was the case, it might have been a slower process on your tank.

Plec0maniac · Post by **Plec0maniac** » 23 Aug 2003, 03:54

it myght be bacteria from ur gravel.. thats why I dont recommend gravel with plecs..

S. Allen · Post by **S. Allen** » 23 Aug 2003, 06:15

I've kept plecos over gravel for years and never had any problems, as have many other people here... It's not the substrate, it's how you maintain the tank, unless we're talking extremes like glass shards or something. Gravel, as long as not overly sharp, is fine with plecos, as is sand or bare bottomed.

I don't know what is causing the infection, but I think it's incorrect to blame the gravel.

mokmu · Post by **mokmu** » 23 Aug 2003, 06:22

All my tanks have gravel and sand in them. Why is it that only the Panaque tank is bring hit by this mysterious plague? The hypan, zebra, lanceo, pseuda tanks have not seen any problems at all --- none.

Funny, why people do not have gravel nor sand at all in their tanks. It occurs naturally in the pl*cs environmet. Probably we should remove all the gravel and sand from the Amazon as well.

Plec0maniac · Post by **Plec0maniac** » 26 Aug 2003, 04:21

dont get me wrong guys.. There might be more possibility of bad bacteria building up n thick gravel, specially wen ur using undergravel filter...

Easy · Post by **Easy** » 26 Aug 2003, 04:51

I do prefer using substrate...coz' an established substrate would provide benefits to the enclosed ecosystem. The gravel issue would be a case to case basis as it depends on how u clean or maintain ur tank. It also adds to the aesthetic look of the aquarium...I tend to avoid using a bare-bottom tank as it gives an impression that ur doing a laboratory experiment instead of providing a home for ur fish...just some personal insights.

S. Allen · Post by **S. Allen** » 27 Aug 2003, 00:56

I'm not against bare bottomed tanks, exactly... I have one that I'm keeping currently, and there are fish that it seems to be almost a neccesity for, at least from what I've read certain small-eyed stingrays do poorly in anything but a bare bottomed tank, but... I can't confirm this as I've never kept them nor known anyone who has. My tank is bare bottomed because it makes cleaning easier, and the sponge prefilters were needing daily rinsings to keep the sand from blocking flow entirely. I think bare bottomed tanks are fine... I just think saying that tanks with things on the bottom can be just as nice. Every time I hear about discus needing bare-bottomed tanks it makes me want to pull at my hair and scream obscenities... but then of course I'd be like my neighbor and that wouldn't be any good.