Help : ) Getting canister and giving my bn plec company

[moonbunny]

Hello everyone,

I could really use some help and I couldn't think of anyone better as my beloved bn pleco, Minnie, dearly needs some friends and I dearly need to buy a fluval canister genaration 5 to do a better filtering job than my Aquaclear HOB 70 Anybody up for a few questions?

Alright, my Minnie girl hasn't always been alone. She was adopted (I'm guessing...) about 5 years ago with her sister Bibbie and they've enjoyed several oto friends over the years. Bibbie passed away a couple months ago (normally I would've done *everything* sooner than now, but bad health's gotten worse, i.e just had a bone marrow biopsy last friday, lots of I.V. treatments mean having to keep my hands out of tank water as much as possible...without too many details, I don't have the energy I once had for anything, but I love Minnie too much to give her up just because I'm going through some things--she deserves the best...she's a catfish, afterall )

So, here's what I'm thinking: Minnie lives in a 20L (approx. 16.5 gal. with a minimum of substrate/decor.) I'm thinking of switching out the Aquaclear for the Fluval 105 (would that be enough/too much filtration for plecs?) I don't have the space for a larger tank, unfortunately, or I'd give it to her over any need of mine I don't know a lick about how to set up a tank most ergonomically so that the filter works most efficiently....yet, is very pleco-friendly...so, suggestions there would be greatly appreciated, too. Question 3: My Minnie needs friends. I'd like her to have, a minimum, of 1 more bn pleco such as herself (it makes her so very happy,) but cats benefit *so* from having company. Given these constraints, dear fish friends, which companions would you choose (why) and what do you think about the filter, a 25 or a 40 gal (it seems obvious, but I'm just checking... )

Your advice will be taken to heart (both Minnie's and my own )
In so much kindness!
Bunny

P.S. I nearly forgot...Minnie has a soft spot for little fish, she takes them "under-fin" as if they were her fry or pet fish Thank You!

[L number Banana]

Hi Bunny,
How about otos again or maybe some small corys? Panda Corys are terribly cute and have interesting behaviors in small groups. They also tend to wink at you, which of course only makes one smile

Not sure about the filter issue though, I'll leave that one to the experts, I'm still a newbie in that department.

Take care, both you and Minnie

[krazyGeoff]

Hi Bunny,
I use Aquaclear HOB filters, and Fluval x05 filters, and have lots of Plecs.
I think that either of the filters you mentioned would be just fine on your tank, especially since it looks like you will have minimal fish.
I have had the HOB's so the intake is as far to the left of the tank, or as far to the right, or in the middle. It does not seem to make a difference to the plec's.
I have the filter in the middle of my long tanks.

The only thing that I would mention, which may make a difference to you is that I find the HOB filters far far easier to maintian.
You just lift off the top, and away you go. The canister filters, you need to pull out from where it has been tucked away, unclip the locking clips, etc etc.

I am unsure if you would get more media in a HOB 70 or a 105? Of course the 105 will be quieter too.

Cheers

Geoff

[MatsP]

I used to have a TetraTec EX700 on a 70 liter tank - which is about the size of a 20L (20 US gal should make it about 76 liter). It does 700 liter an hour (so just over 175 gal per hour), which is about half again on a the 480 liter (approx 120 gal per hour) an hour of the Fluval 105 filer.

Works fine for plecos and such. It may not be great for fish like Betta's and Goldfish.

--
Mats

[apistomaster]

It is hard to beat the ease of maintenance of the AquaClear series of filters. I do disagree with their size recommendations.
It is almost always best to use the next size up or more from their recommendations. For example, if the AquaClear is to be the sole filter for your 20L, then I would buy the Model 70. I use the Model 50 on a 10 gal tank or in conjunction with another filter on a 20L. Model 50 is just under powered for a 20 L, imo. I never use carbon. AquaClears are good because the essential media materials are virtually everlasting. I say shame on any filter design that makes use of proprietary filter cartridges.

I would recommend a Fluval 205 over the 105 because of the same problems I have with manufacturers' performance claims.
Canister filters are among the best of all designs for display tanks but as also someone with some limitations on how much I can do, I think they may be more difficult for you to clean but perhaps not. Fluvals are easier to clean than the Eheim Classics I use. They do not need to be cleaned frequently and that is especially true if you size it up to the 205. Again, I don't use carbon. So in my canister filters, I add more bio-media. Regular water changes do more good and cost much less than using carbon. I have a Fluval 404 I refurbished that I have not used yet but my friends like them. I have been a loyal Ehiem customer ever since I bought my first one in 1968. The Eheim Classics are more difficult canisters to clean than the Fluvals.

A group of Otocinclus would be a nice addition and good tank mates for your pet Bushy Nose Pleco. I would get 5 to 7 of them because they do best when kept in groups. Just 1 or 2 will act less interested in life. You could also add a school of Tetras and 4-5 Pencil Fish to add some color and activity.

[moonbunny]

Wow! It's been a crazy search looking for tankmates for Minnie.

I was loving the idea of at least 1 more bn pleco to keep Minnie company and panda corys...but to no avail : ) There seems to be a real dearth of catfish in AZ presently (although I've seen bronze & albino corys as well as upside down catfish...and the only shop selling bn plecos are selling young fish for over $14.99 each--eek!) Even otos are a challenge to find (I wonder what's going on...) And I've thought about ordering from online (oh, the selection!)but, it's 110 deg. every day and the mailbox---all metal--is like playing Operation to get the mail--easily over 160-180 deg., they couldn't survive, it's insane...(well, cars heat up to over 160 degrees and kids who fall down on asphalt playgrounds have burnt their hands, so I'm thinking that finding fish by mail might not be an option until November or so...bummer...) ***So, I'm thinking of posting in the wanted sections here, at Pleco Fanatics and Badman's and see what happens.

Cannister filter shopping has gone...amuck? They're all too big to tuck behind the fridge...but they're *so* nice! Recently suggested: an internal filter by Hagen/Fluval in their "Plus" series. I've been told they're actutually really efficient...could that be true (for my little 20 L?) Someone told me it's like having an in-tank cannister...they clean the filter and do the big tank vac/break down only 3 times per year. I would *LOVE* if anybody here could chime in on internal filters vs cannisters, etc

Craziest part? I'm going to try getting both Minnie's tank (and new filter) as well as the quarantine tank set up this weekend (before going back to 9 more weeks of I.V. treatments, so I can keep my hands out of the tank(s).) With luck, it might even be nice to get a few of her new roommates in the QT tank so they'll be ready to transition in 4-6 weeks

I'm open for suggestions... (It's more like, "I'd love to hear from you!")

Thanks so much!
Bunny

[MatsP]

Let's start with "mailorder fish" - it doesn't come in a plastic lined brown envelope along your usual bills and advertising for things you didn't want to buy ever - they do come in well insulated polystyrene boxes, so should be OK to travel even to Arizona - and it's normally delivered as a courier service, so they will come to your door with a box and a piece of paper for you to sign that you've received it. Most companies use the "overnight before noon" service [which _YOU_ pay
for, of course]. Some also use "airport-to-airport" courier service, which means that you pick up the box of fish at the airport rather than having a man from some courier company deliver it to your door.

All internal filters are more maintenance than external ones. I have used two fluval filters. They clog up quite quickly for me (but I have lots of messy fish). On the same tank that I used a Fluval 4+ (aproximately a US 55g tank, but laying the other way around to get more floor-space), I now have a TetraTec EX1200. Instead of cleaning the filter almost every week, I clean the filter 3-4 times a year. If you have small numbers of not-so-messy fish, then you may be able to get away with cleaning a fluval 2+ about once every three weeks or so. Any less than that and it will probably clog up enough to almost stop working.

I don't generally do much "tearing down to clean" of tanks. I do however vacuum out a good amount of water, and use big external filters on almost all of my tanks.

--
Mats

[apistomaster]

All internal canister filters clog rapidly and require frequent cleaning.

I have a box full of Duetto 100 filters which I used more when I was raising mostly Killiefish because I would often use shallow water and these filters may be used in water as shallow as 3 inches. I still use one sometimes in my 4.5 gal tanks which I use as breeding or treatment tanks where there are a few fish which like strong currents.

Look on www.aquabid.com for cheap bushy nose plecos. You may discover seller very near by. I find it difficult to believe there aren't several local BN breeders and I really don't understand why they are so over priced in your LFS. The young specimens of common BN are rarely more than $6 each here and believe me, Clarkston, WA is barely connected to the greater USA fish universe.

As Mat explained, it is pretty safe to send BN through the mail. You should always be home when you have a fish order coming so they shouldn't be exposed to unusually high temperatures. The time that matters most is how long the fish will be in the daily mail delivery truck. It is always nice if you receive your mail in the morning rather than being on the end of a delivery route. Aren't they air conditioned in Phoenix? It gets hot here in the summer, 115*F is not unusual. Yet I still ship and receive fish without problems via USPS Express or even Priority mail when I don't have something rare or expensive involved.

[moonbunny]

You're both absolutely right--both about the fish by mail and avoiding the in-tank filters--Thank You! (The calico bn's at Aquabid are *adorable*! Now I just have to figure out which sellers to trust and the best way to pay.)

I've now entered the "In for a penny, in for a pound" mode, lol! With the decision to definitely have a canister I needed to find a good stand to put it on for the 20L and in searching, I couldn't find a stand alone, they're usually part of a package deal to pick up second-hand...which has a secondary benefit ...I've found that I can afford more "real estate" this way, too! The price of a stand, new, just the stand is about $100 *minimum* (or about 61 pounds, hopefully that's close to being right... ,) but, buying second hand I might be able to pick up a tank between 55-70 G (208.45 - 265.3 L)--which includes the stand, canopy (usually,) filters, heaters, decor and sometimes even fish! One lead I found yesterday said she noticed the cord on the filter she had is frayed, so the company's sending her a brand new one (Marineland Magnum 300 series--maybe not the best, but it's new...) One I found tonight (to follow up on tomorrow) includes an Eheim filter and powerhead. So, since buying a Rena XP3 new would run about $185 ( 112.85 pounds,) I might be able to get the whole kit-and-kaboodle for roughly less than the price of the filter alone. And being that this is going to be the last setup I'll buy, I figure that maybe with the increased water volume water changes/vacs, I should be able to safely (with a low bioload) go to only 3 times per year for maintenance. (Am I deluding myself, or am I kind of on the right track?) Also, outside of ensuring that a tank holds water and all the parts work, can anybody think of anything I need to ask, check on or keep in mind before buying from an individual v.s. factory-pristine from a petshop? Should I ask anything such as the health of the fish, i.e. the health of the tank (as my Minnie would be moving in and I don't want anything to happen to her,) or if any harsh chemicals or pesticides have been used around the tank(s)? (I only ask b/c one person today said her tank has been in storage and, being in AZ, nearly everyone sprays somewhere to help fend off scorpions, black widdows and brown recluse spiders.)

You guys are my mentors (and Minnie's champions!)

(Now I just have to keep trying to find ways of explaining to the family how fewer fish in a larger tank is honestly *enormously less work/upkeep* because of the bioload to water/filtration ratio. All they see is, big tank, tons more work when I'm not feeling well already and will be worse before the month is through. What I'm trying to do, though, is get all my ducks in a row to make and keep life a little more easy going until things level off health-wise.)

Thanks again--I'll write back as soon as I know more (I'm really hoping to score a tank this weekend before the next treatment on Monday.

b.t.w. Have you guys heard about Purigen? The marine biologist at ThatFishPlace told me about it being tons better than carbon, and it's rechargable. Just curious...

p.s. MatsP--Read your article and love it![/b] It's up on the refrigerator by Minnie's tank. Can't wait to read part 2. I love how Planet Catfish shows that you've written an article whenever you post and links to it as well as showing how many hits you've received. I wrote one for Badman's ("True Tank Volume...") but this is *such* a nice idea to physically link the work(s) contributed with the authority

[MatsP]

I do not use Purigen or anything like it. I also do not use Carbon in any of my tanks unless there is a specific need (e.g. to remove medication).

And yes, for the same size and number of fish, the bigger the tank, the less work it is. You still of course need to change some proportion of water, and you may find that you need to replace a bit more water in a bigger tank - but you can probably leave it a bit longer between changes of water.

--
Mats

[apistomaster]

I have been using Purigen routinely in one of my wild Discus tanks for over 5 years. It is a much more selective chemical filtration media than activated carbon. I have a wet/dry filter with a large sump. This has made a good place for the PhosBan Reactor I use to hold the Purigen. Some modifications were necessary to the reactor such as adding fine aquarium felt media to retain the small Purigen particles.
I used this set uo in my Heckel Discus tank until I recently sold my 10 Heckels. It is almost impossible to breed Heckels so I moved on to Blue/Brown and soon, Red Spotted Greens, both of which I have bred in the past.
Purigen can sometimes help make the small difference in getting some catfish to spawn perhaps by raising the water's Re-Dox potential.
High Redox is a fair indicator of high water quality. It seems to be nearly infinitely rechargeable so that makes it's cost more reasonable than cruder activated carbon.

[moonbunny]

O.k. sagacious ones... : ) (in advance, please pardon me for not listing this under the Equipment forum) Here is a phrase I've mentioned too many times to count (but really do mean it this time)...I'm looking to buy my final aquarium (and set-up.) It began as a search for a canister for Minnie, stretched into looking for a stand and now it seems it's easier (and, weirdly, less expensive) to buy an entire system used than one filter (I was looking between the Rena XP 2 or 3) new. I have it narrowed down to 2 tanks, etc. and I'm just hoping you might have time to pop in and give me your opinions on either or both--which you'd choose and why--before going to see them (I'm due to see the second one listed below at 2pm on Sunday.) My goal: Having a large enough aquarium (with good enough filtration) to only really have to pull maintenance 3-4 per year max; a good filter, min. The ideal is to have a catfish-centered tank (as I'm completely besotted by bn plecos, it's terrible )--I'd just like Minnie to have at least 3-4 more of her own kind (whatever varriation,) from there it's all open, though, as to anyone else joining the tank (the ideal is a low bioload that's still comfortable/sociable enough for the fish.)

So, here are the two contenders, both sitting at $200 ( about £122), with possibly a tiny bit of wiggle-room price-wise on the second tank (mainly due to the stand being 10 yrs old and having scratches on the front.) Both were orig. saltwater set-ups, the first tank below has been converted to freshwater now, however.

Tank #1:
Size: 75 G (284.25 L) Although it measures 36" (91.44 cm) wide x 24" (60.96cm) deep x 20" ( 50.8 cm) tall--would that be closer to a 65 G (246.35 L)?

Saltwater converted to Freshwater

Filter: Emperor 400 (aprox. 5 years old)

Stand/Canopy: Both--oak, with 2 doors above to access lighting and (possibly...) 2 below for supplies (original to tank set-up--**the stand, hood, tank and lighting system are about 5 yrs old.)

Lights: For Saltwater, extensive. 250 w 10,000k metal halide and two 96 w power compact lighting system, including 3 new actinic power compact bulbs "that sell for like $50 each." (Bulbs on hood, less than a year old.)

Extras: A JBEO water heater, small air pump with stone, gravel (all about 4 months old,) a few (anemic : ) ) freshwater plants and fish: 2 spotted cats, 1 red eye tetra, 2 white clouds, 2 rainbow platys, 1 faintail guppy, 1 longfin zebra danio.

Reason for Sale?: Just too much to keep up with kids hands going in and out all day.

Pics:





Tank #2:
Size: 55 G (208.45 L) Measuring 52" (132.8 cm) high (I think that's incl. the stand) x 51" (129.54 cm) wide x 16 3/4" (42.545 cm) deep

Presently Saltwater (no creatures living in there, though)

Filter: Eheim classic "215" (I'm guessing it's the 2215 and I just heard wrong, it happens )
(3 years old, good working order, isn't presently run with carbon.) See it here at ThatFishPlace: http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/prod/211164/product.web

Stand/Canopy: Both--Bought used about 10 yrs ago, some scratches on the front.

Lights: A 36" light for saltwater tanks is in the canopy

Extras: Never any leaks, never allowed to set dry. A few micro-scratches visile only when it's being cleaned. Includes: Heater, salt, crushed coral (it appears to be about 3" deep,) a salinity tester, etc.

Reason for Sale?: Moving to California.

Pics:

I've done a bit of math and realize the lights for the first tank are worth a bit if they're in good condition, but the 3 year old Eheim is a big value in and of itself as it's been kept well (likely, it'll just need some new media.)

Are there any problems changing over from a Saltwater to a Freshwater set-up?

I appreciate your help greatly. This is a big chunk of change to me.

(Photos belong to the sellers')

[apistomaster]

You will never regret choosing that 75 gal set up.
Even if you don't decide to use the metal halide for now it in itself is worth buying this kit.
I don't like the filter much but it is OK. You may also search other forums for used aquarium equipment and add a large canister filter in the future. Might look at what is being listed on www.aquabid.com once in awhile to get a feel for what a good price is for the filter you have in mind so you will be a better informed purchaser.

The popular USA 55 gal is one of the worst designs possible for a tank of that volume. Even my 40 gal breeder tanks hold more fish than a 55 due to their greater surface area. Surface area is precious for the carrying capacity per volume and greater bottom surface is very helpful when it comes to populating a tank with somewhat territorial bottom fish like the plecos.
Gross surface area of the 55 gal is 576 square inches.
40 gal breeder area 18 X 36 inches= 648 sq. in.
75 gal 18 X 48 inches= 864 sq. in.
'Nuff said?

[moonbunny]

Just the kind of sage advice I was hoping for

I've been racking my brain trying to guess at so much, such as...I know the formula for buying used tanks (generally $1/G if in good shape, 50-cents/ G if in not-so-good shape,) but it just feels like guesswork trying to estimate & get a handle on buying-used prices (if I can ever figure it out, somehow, I'm going to poll a lot of wise people like yourself, folks on Badmans, Pleco Fanatics, stores and maybe even some of the nano tank greats *and then write an article* and submit it to anyone who'll run with it just so other's aren't stuck in the same prediciment---lol, but true! Just as soon as I can get it all together : ) ) LOL, I've been trying to do story problems as convoluted as this, no kidding:

"If a similar stand and canopy might sell new today for roughly $300, and the man who has it now bought it from someone second-hand, and it's 10 years old, and it has scratches across the front, and now he wants to sell it to me second-hand once again...then what would a reasonable price be given it's condition (and other things packaged with it?) Besides, how solid is a 10 year old stand for a 55 G tank?" (The seller kept telling me the set-up's worth the $200 alone based on the 3 year old Eheim--how fast *do* Eheims depreciate? And would the deal have been worth it were it a 75 and not the 55 G tank?)

It's been maddening

Here's the thing, though...Do you think, by it's measurements, that it is a true 75 G? (Also, I've tried doing the math on the lighting new--could it honestly be worth close to $1,000 new? I'm just trying to make sure it offsets the future canister filter purchase cost...that was my initial hope, just finding a good little canister filter )

And...(the kickers)...

...I need a system that, seriously, I only clean 3-4 times/year (that's the whole reason for buying larger--my health's exhausting. It honestly takes me about 5-6 hours to clean a 20L with just one fish in it. I know, it sounds ridiculous, but it's been this way for a year or more and with the allergy + I.V.s + wicked RA treatment that'll lower my immunity, I *really* need a set-up that'll fit the bill. Can this be accomplished with a very low bioload and 1 (or 2) HOB filters, or would I really need a canister to get those kinds of results? (Filters I have on hand at present are two Aquaclear 70s--300gph and an Aquaclear for a 10 G (and some messed up looking Penguin filters.)

...Speaking of bioload...the cats, tetra, platys, guppy that come with the tank--really, no problem; white clouds and danio--a bit higher producers of ammonia and waste. Essentially, though, this is Minnie's tank and I'd really like to add a few bn plecos in for her to schoal with. What number of fish would you suggest--both in bn plecos and overall--to keep the bioload to a pretty serious, low-maintenance minimum--cleaning only 3-4 times/year (that's the big one)? Also, speaking of cats and territory, do you have any suggetions re: number or bn plecos (or other cats,) even regarding ratio of males to females? And, a little off subject, should I consider providing a part of the tank that has sand? (I forget if I've asked that one before.) Oh, also (and I'm guessing this one's a stretch...) but can you think of any fish--particularly cats--that are super-friendly, come to the glass to see you, etc.? I really miss that (it's one thing to have mostly nocturnal fish, but I do miss a friendly/appreciative waggle.)

...Also, as this tank will be in the sunniest room in the house, should part of it be shaded (besides the usual tubes/furniture?)

...There's also the possibility of new carpeting in the house coming this Fall and I don't want *any* possibility of screwing it up from an aquarium on my shoulders. Can anyone think of some fail-safes to put into place?

...For water changes, would you still go siphon and buckets? (If so, I'm thinking of getting a small second-hand kids' wagon to help me out, lol.)

...Now, for the dumbest question of them all: I've only ever had fluorescent lights for the tanks. I've heard big, good things about metal halides, but they've always been so out of my reach that I really haven't looked into them. What's their appeal and are they expensive to upkeep?

One more giant question, I promise Is there anything you can think of that, should I see it when I go to look at this tank, I should just say thank you and politely walk away (warning signs, etc.?)

I'm really so glad to know about the 75 vs the 55. Another ad was for a 55 with an open-style, one-shelf stand that the owner is getting a brand-new replacement Marineland Magnum 350 for. *Any* kind of canister sounds nice right now, I hope you can understand...I'm just trying to make sure that the trade-off for the larger 75 G will keep the tank as clean (for as long) as a 55 with a canister. (Crazy, I know, but so very much appreciated )

I just made nice, moist, chocolate chip cookies the night before last and wish I could send you guys some-You more than deserve them!

I promise, once this whole thing's done and together, you guys are getting the first pics!

[MatsP]

It is very difficult to put a price on things in general, and used equipment makes it even harder, because beside the basic value of the item, you have to account for the condition of the pieces, the expected age they will endure, etc.

Eheim is good in the sense that they:
1) do not change models very often.
2) keep producing spares for a long time.

As to prices for the tank itself, it's pretty much the same for all tanks. However, it comes with a stand and a hood. Just like if you buy, say, a Chevrolet or a Cadillac, you get pretty much the same car, but for quite different money. Buying/selling a used Chevy would also be different from selling a used Cadillac - they would loose value in different ways.

And finally, used items are always worth "as much as someone is willing to pay".

As to "I need a system which only needs cleaning 3-4 times a year", I think you need to reconsider fishkeeeping as a hobby. With an external filter, you will only need to clean the filter a few times a year. But you will have to replace the water in the tank from time to time - about 20% once a week, give or take. Hang over backs filters and internal filters carry less media so they will need cleaning more often.

The tank size you calculated for the 75G tank is wrong - I just calculated 91.44 * 60.96 * 50.8 / 1000 = 283.1685 = 74.5 gallon. Of course, the ACTUAL volume in the tank is less than that, because there is a gap at the top of 1-2" for "splash margin", as well as the thickness of the glass reducing the internal size. So, if we assume half-inch glass and 1" splash margin, the practical volume is close to 65 gallon. This is ALWAYS the case with any tank...

I don't know of any direct "if you see this, walk away".

I'm sorry I probably haven't answered all your questions and may have answered something you didn't actually ask..

--
Mats

[moonbunny]

I'm thankful for the advice. Even unexpected advice can be elucidating and is appreciated That's why I'm here.

Reality and I are on familiar terms, I'm only seeking answers beyond the obvious It's just that when I sign on to a life--a person, an animal, a plant or any other thing, I'm dedicated through and through to whatever end may come to pass. So, ultimately, I'm just seeking a simply elegant solution (as Occam might say,) wherein Minnie, here at home, has the best quality of life, quality of water/tank, quality of company and anything else she might need (when I dedicated myself to her, I planned on 15 years, give or take--how could I possibly offer her any less?) Sure, life changes, but I'd rather whatever's going on in my life to be a background to her happiness. So, somehow I need a solution that will work for both of us. And that's why I'm here --another fish site could offer advice, but I thought it best to check on the matters of a bn catfish with people who understand catfish

It sounds as though an external filter is the superior option for water quality and a larger tank volume (my math's coming out with the "55" having approx. 100" more surface area than the "75", yet less actual tank volume.) RE: the measurements of the "75," I'm just going on those measurements given in the ad and as it's a standard and not custom tank, trying to assess the discrepency (it's good to know of someone else who's also as precise as to adjust for the "True Tank Volume") Anyway, possibilities must exist Maybe a set-up with a sweeping powerhead seated 3-4" from the bottom of the tank and a fairly high capacity canister filter would take up and clean through the "sweepings" as a marine biologist recently suggested to me. I'm sure there are lots of good ideas out there. I'm married to neither larger tank as an absolute solution and I'm open to any solutions that will work[/color]. Maybe an answer would come in the form of something like a Magnum H.O.T. canister filtering the pre-existing 20 L, that's an option, but however good it is, I turn to everyone here at Planet Catfish to chime in. With all the technology that exists, there must be something that will allow Minnie at least one other bn pleco friend and possibly a couple, a few smaller friends, and still work within my limitations. Possibilities fuel hope--which both Minnie and I need just now There have been so many good ideas here already, it's likely just a matter of synthesising them.

Believe me, people close to me have given me "the talk" about giving everything up while weathering this health (which will, to some extent, worsen over the next few decades, waxing and waning with treatments)--it's unfortunate that pessimism has attempted to eclipse pragmatism and love, and I just don't see a real solution in giving up (it'd just be surrendering before a real answer has a chance to come to light.) So...

I encourage all of you here at Planet Catfish that if you might have a solution, something crazy enough that it just might work, to post me, or reply here.

So far it looks like the ideas are:

Increased tank volume + the best/highest filtration possible (a cannister might be good)

And yes, for the same size and number of fish, the bigger the tank, the less work it is. You still of course need to change some proportion of water, and you may find that you need to replace a bit more water in a bigger tank - but you can probably leave it a bit longer between changes of water.

Purigen, while working in a different way from carbon, offers unique values and reproductive benefits for more sensitive species as well as distinct financial benefits for the fishkeeper (and it's re-chargeable)

The halide lighting kit is worth the $200 + in and of itself

Internal filters are a bust

It's possible to mail order fantastic fish at great prices despite triple-digit heat

***With so much positive information, it may just be a matter of finding a way to make water changes (either a bit less frequent) and/or easier. So, if we can, let's set our minds to that (and if enough people are confident in the value of increasing tank volume, I'll try that, too )

This will all work out well--it's only a matter of focusing on what's possible rather than impossible

I look forward to hearing back from anyone who cares to write (I'll check back in in about 10 hours.)
Thanks!

[MatsP]

I must confess that some of my tanks probably could do with a bit more frequent cleaning of the substrate than what I do. Particularly the one with my three

Panaque maccus

in it, it's often quite grubby. I think this is less important to the fish than clean water. As long as the fish appear happy. Obviously, if the tank is on display in your "front room" and many people come to visit, it may be important to the owner, but the fish probably doesn't care that much.

A large powerhead mounted at low level will cause more of the dirt to be circulated, as will fish that frequently dig/stir the substrate (e.g. Corys).

--
Mats

[krazyGeoff]

Hi Bunny,
My LFS offers a "water change service".

Of course nothing is free, but if you were able to "buy" yourself some water changes then this may open the door a bit more on the type and number of fishy friends you can keep.

Metal Halide lights are a must on reef tanks with SPS corals, and great on advanced fresh water planted aquariums. They produce heaps and heaps of heat, and the bulbs need to be replaced about every 12 months. The light they produce is very strong and good at penetrating water. Which is obviously great if you need it for plants and other photosynthetic organisims. - Otherwise it is really likely to be overkill, and you can most likely on sell it to a start up reef tank keeper, for about what you may end up paying for this whole setup.

Also remember that (from my experience) a Mr BN and a Mrs BN will have little BN's just by being in the same tank (it would appear).... That of course will mess with your "Sign on to a life philosophy" (that philosophy would explain why I paid $500.00 for dental surgery to the wild cat that now lives under our deck ), so I would get 1 or 2 female BN mates for Minnie. They will get about 4 inches long, fully grown, and on their own can produce a lot of waste.
I have 1 Golden BN and 6 cherry barbs (1 boy 5 girls) and 1 fighter in one tank, which is a real visual tank.

The fighter is now blue, and the BN is now Golden, but you get the idea. By the way this is the hardest tank to look after, because it only holds 20 litres, but has a good surface area. Water change would be the price to pay in this case.

What apistomaster said about surface area is gold!

Bigger is better....... go for the 75g.

PS love your use of font colour

[krazyGeoff]

Hi again,
I remember that I used to have a gravel vacumeless tank for a while, and had a dry hands water change as well. Well it wasn't dry hands for me but can be made dry hands easily.

The tank I had was a 90cm*45cm*45cm
Filtration was a Fluval 305 canister filter
It was 40% planted with low light plants, so just a flouressent light.

Inhabitants were 2 * 2.5-3 inch BN, 40 or so tetras, and 5 clown loaches.
The BN were the real waste makers.
The clown loaches were there to eat all the snails, but they also burrow about 1/2 inch into the substrate so they also prevent the bottom getting clogged up. Also they are sensitive to white spot, so they also act in a similar way to the canaries that used to be used by miners. If something is going wrong with the tank then the clown loaches will react very quickly, and then you can also. (Clown loaches do get big and live for a long time, but are very slow to grow.)
Also the NH3, NO2, NO3, pH get monitored and recorded at least every 2 weeks. Water change also every 2 weeks.
In addition to all this I had a small viaqua powerhead about 1/2 way up the tank, and it was pointed to the surface to give me surface adgitation.
I got a bit nervous carrying buckets of water around the lounge, with the cats running around and helping me out, so I needed to come up with a better and quicker way of doing the water change. I figured out that one of the other attachments that came with the powerhead would fit exactly into a normal garden hose.

Now a water change consisted of attaching the hose to the power head and poking it out he window. Then turn on the pump and stand on the deck watering the plants with the water from the aquarium. Every now and then (every 6 weeks or so) I would give the gravel a bit of a gental stir and the waste that came up could get sucked straight through the powerhead.
I was using the NO3 (NitrAte) readings to alert me to the fact that there was a bit much solid matter there. I was using a resin called Nitra Zorb with great success. It is rechargeable, so I would have two, and then just swap the old one out of the canister, and start recharging that one while the other one was at work.
You can make it "dry hands" by getting some of those disposable plastic gloves from the vet. The ones that go up to your armpits!
Also you need to keep an eye on the readings and be carefull with the food.
After 2 weeks the NitrAte levels would get around 60 ppm. It worked for me, until I got carried away with the Pleco addiction... With gravel vacuming (and 10 or so plecs) the levels are usually 10ppm and sometimes 20ppm as a comparison.
In terms of happy fish.... Before the Pleco addiction, if I put a male and female of most things in that tank, then I had babies....
The tank is here: http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/my_a ... krazyGeoff and is called Cat Tastrophie (the power head is not pointing at the top in that photo)
So I think that with carefull management and perhaps choosing some of your fish for function then you should be able to get what you want.
Cheers