Dreaded Camallanus Worms

[gedtranter]

Damn, double damn. My five Apistos plus one of my Farlowella (at least) have Camallanus worms hanging out of them. I'm assuming all Farlowella have the worms too by default and I've spent the evening doing research on the net.

I have a clued up fish vet near here who I'll talk with re some treatments first thing tomorrow. I'm reading about Levamisole and Flubendazole, hopefully they aren't banned here as most references come from the US and these two seem to be the go. I've done searches on here too.

I think they must have come in on the Farlowella as I've had the Apistos for 18 months with absolutely no prior symptoms.

Any additional hints or tips from anybody with experience in treatment?

[MatsP]

I haven't had this type of worm, but I would definitely say Flubendazole would be my first choice. It is effective against the worms, and appear harmless to the fish. I'd ask the Vet if he/she can get Flubendazole (or one of it's variants) - and bear in mind that you treat it in water, not in the fish, so you may need rather a lot compared to treating a cat or dog.

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Mats

[gedtranter]

Yeah I've read a few things and that's what I like, treating the water not any food. The Farlowella fry have been in the main tank all the time. Would they have worms already at 20mm in size, should they be taken out for treatment? I don't want to take them out and find later that they are infected, I want to stop this whole thing here and learn from it.

[MatsP]

I don't think there is any harm in treating the fry. As I've read it, you need to overdose by about 30x before the fish starts to suffer, so normal dose should be fine for fry - and if they are infected, it will help!

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Mats

[MatsP]

Some interesting (relating to Australia legal drugs, etc) here:
http://www.perthcichlid.com.au/forum/in ... opic=13885

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Mats

[gedtranter]

I'm glad you thought that about the fry, that was my conclusion too. Hopefully I can get Levamisole tomorrow, we'll see.

[Martin S]

FYI I treated my tank with Flubendazole when i had fry, and they survived with no problems, Only thing you need to be wary of is that it will kill all snails, which can obviously have a detrimental effect on the water!
Good luck
Martin

[gedtranter]

Thanks Martin I don't have a heavy snail load at the moment which is good, can you remember what dosage rates you used?

[MatsP]

The Flubendazole powder is almost certainly mixed with some neutral "filler-outer" substance to make it easier to dose. Since there are different concentrations of the active ingredient, it is hardly meaningful to discuss how much powder of brand X goes in the tank, when you have brand Y powder - it may be two or three times stronger, or maybe half as strong. Follow the instructions on the pack.

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Mats

[gedtranter]

Good point Matsp, I'm waiting on a call back from the vets - spoke to them this morning things seem positive as they are well into their fish, I'll see what they say.

[Barbie]

Treating for Camallanus is not a fun proposition. Flubendazole has to be used at double dosage, if not higher, in order to make it effective and then you have to treat again after 2 weeks. I've then treated again at 4 weeks, just to be safe. I used Flubenol and I used a teaspoon to 125 gallons as the standard "dose". This is MUCH easier on the fish, but I'm not positive it's a good "permanent" solution.

Levamisole on the other hand seems to be very effective with two doses, but also MUCH harder on the fish themselves, IME. We're currently unable to find Levamisole in the US without much frustration, so hopefully you'll have more luck!

Barbie

[gedtranter]

I've got hold of some Levamisole HCL, Flubendazole doesn't seem to be readily available here. It's been added to a spare tank with one of my female Apistos who has worms showing, we'll see how she goes over the next 24hrs and then decide to try one of the Farlowella. If they all come through I'll dose the whole tank. Started on 2mg/l Levamisole per what I've been reading, this is also the same figure that the vet came up with. Fingers crossed.

[gedtranter]

For the record, 2mg/l Levamisole bath in the tank and the Farlowella and fry plus the Apistos are all ok. I'll do a water change tonight after 24hrs, add carbon and repeat a couple more times over the next few weeks. I had to use a 8.48mg/l Levamisole de-wormer syrup that's designed for birds and dose accordingly to get the required 2mg/l as that's all I could get around here. I tested it first on one Farlowella and one Apisto in a spare tank to make sure. Worms were dropping from the Apisto within a couple of hours.

[gedtranter]

Update. Well here's a lesson learnt the hard way. Never add anything with syrup in it to a warm aquarium as the end result is likely to be a fermenting mess, mine certainly was. The tank has been totally stripped down and the fish now reside in two spare tanks.

I decided to treat with the wormer syrup as it was pretty much all I could find. I decided to treat the tank as I wanted to zap what was already in there instead of being paranoid that when I reintroduced the fish they would just get infected again. Plus, trying to catch the fish would mean half stripping the tank anyway.

Big water changes after 24 hrs and 48 hrs didn't do anything, the damage was already done. It wasn't too noticeable until 48hrs when the plants were covered in a gooey mess and the Twigs had their noses out of the water.

I figure it's important to post and learn from mistakes (not just posting the good bits) and this certainly was a big mistake.

I think the medicine worked though.

[MatsP]

Ah, good point, and I never really thought that was what you were going to do. Here, the worming medication is often sold in either tablet or powder form (I'm sure you can get syrup as well), so I didn't consider you'd use syrup.

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Mats

[gedtranter]

The fish are ok including the fry - at least I get to set up another tank from scratch.

[Daragh]

I got those dreaded worms in a tank with wild Leopoldi angels, there were also apistos and endlers (wild angels did not eat the endlers or the fry!)

I made a video of the worms with a microscope, if you have already eaten it is safe to watch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKTqfvjOX6I

I used 2000 gallons supply of Flubernol 15 in 300 litre tank over 4 months and it had NO effect. The snails even survived. In the end I used Panacur for pigs, 1ml per 100 litres of water and it did the trick. Unfortunately there were 4 L066 adults in the tank, which never showed the worms, though I have no doubt they must have had them, and they reacted badly to the Panacur, they survived and seem fine now three / four months later but for weeks they looked poorly and sat around without eating and not retreating when I approached them - the angels show no ill effects at all.

Since then I found "Sera Med Professional Nematol" and bought a bottle, just in case. A friend had Callamanus worms in his tank and I gave him the bottle and he said it worked perfectly with no ill effects, so if you can get your hands on some I would try that.

Best of luck, they are not pleasant and not easy to get rid of.

Daragh