Sexing L66....sure fire??

[AndyAps.com]

hi, does anyone have a sure fire way of sexing L66 King Tiger Pleco???
I bought 2 large specimens about a month ago and keep them in a 12 gallon breeder. i bought the 2 with the most sexual dimorphism between them so im sure i have a pair, however going by normal hypancistrus sexing rules, they seem to have swapped roles. ok here goes........
Fish 1 is about 6 inch, broad across the "shoulders" and has very heavy odontal growth on the cheeks and on the pectoral fins and is also very hairy on the base of the tail (cadual penduncle). Fish 2 is 5.5inch, has a more pointed head shape and very little cheek odontodes and none on the pectoral fins and zero body hair. under normal rules i figured i had bought a male(1) and a female(2) however......
i have "aqualog all L-numbers" and in their it states for L66 "the sex with the plumper body will develop a hairy appearance on the cadual penduncle, ie the female" this confused me a lil so i introduced 3 caves into the tank, Fish 2(no odontodes) has taken up residence in a cave and doesnt venture far. Fish 1 takes refuge under various bits of driftwood etc. Basically appearence suggests 1=male and 2=female, however behaviour and "aqualog" suggest 1=female and 2=male
I know this is really confusin and appreciate your time for readin but PLEASE.......Does anyone know how to sex them for sure???
Id luv to know so i can breed them lol
Thanks
Andy

Pictures below are of Fish number 1- note the odontal growth. cant get a good pic of fish 2 yet.

[Jon]

Male. Definitely.

[AndyAps.com]

58 views and noone can offer any advice??

Jon thanks for replying and going on normal hypancistrus rules i would say that its also definatley a male, however thats not what aqualog says and thats not how they are behaving.
any thoughts?

[AndyAps.com]

Ok i have possibly solved this, I have just dug deep in the bookshelf and found my original copy of Datz which holds a pic of an L66 with massive odontal growth and says

"Adult males L66 along with many ancistrines can be distinguished by heavy odontal growth"
So that solves it. although it also means the Aqualog isnt quite correct although it does mention that females have heavy growth when in courtship dress.............oh well yet again info is pulled from all over to solve my own problem lol
Thanks again everyone?

[Jon]

Even the presumed heavy growth of gravid females is not nearly enough to match that of the male shown in the pics above.

This pic was taken right after this female had spawned. Note that even here, the pectoral odontodes could not possibly match those of a well conditioned male.

[Ian M]

I have the same problem. I bought what I thought was a Male and a female, and am now worried I have 2 males as my 'female' now has taken up residence in a cave and my male prefers to make caves under slate and bits of wood!

Pictures of my 'pair' can be seen here

http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/albu ... pic_id=694

1 is a male im fairly sure of that now not sure about 2.

Ian

[Jon]

I have found that it is easier to use pap/side shot sexing in larger hypancistrines such as these. I assume those pictures are of the fish as they appeared when you first purchased them. How do they look now?

[AndyAps.com]

Ian, John, Thanks for your replies.

I think, after doing some more research that females in breeding condition should show odontal growth which is concentrated around the cadual penduncle and possibly cheeks but not the pectorals. Like john says the males show very heavy cheek and pectoral odontodes and also overall body "hair".
with this in mind i'm still not sure if i have a very mature male and an immature male............but that said why would the immature male get first pick of the caves and the very mature(=dominant?) male reside under bogwood when there are other caves available?

i have searched net high and low but cant seem to uncover any usefull breeding articles on L66........

[AndyAps.com]

Ian, John, Thanks for your replies.

I think, after doing some more research that females in breeding condition should show odontal growth which is concentrated around the cadual penduncle and possibly cheeks but not the pectorals. Like john says the males show very heavy cheek and pectoral odontodes and also overall body "hair".
with this in mind i'm still not sure if i have a very mature male and an immature male............but that said why would the immature male get first pick of the caves and the very mature(=dominant?) male reside under bogwood when there are other caves available?

i have searched net high and low but cant seem to uncover any usefull breeding articles on L66........

John i will try to get some side shots of both fish maybe tommorrow