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That's a very interesting video. It strikes me that both are fighting (for that's what it is) because as far as I can see they're both females. Perhaps they're fighting over a hiding spot or as CFC has already noted, a "who's in charge" quarrel.
I'll certainly email you for the complete "works".
Don't tell me these two have to go too.... nice Metynnis btw; one of my all time favourite Characins.

Btw: one of the main intentions of this thread was to see who has which Auchenipterid, so we could more easily find eachother. The apparent deal between Grokefish and CFC has shown it may even be used for more

Marc - aarrgghh - not another hybid!!!

There are so many syno hybrids & although some look fantastic i personally would want true species, however, each to their own.

L.Oncinus seems a lot more scarce nowadays than in the past in the uk. When i spoke to the chap who had bred the s.granulosus earlier this year he did say that if specimens were available he wanted to have a go at breeding these to supply the demand that seems to be prevalent at the moment. I have offered to loan him my female but he has no existing stock & being part of a commercial breeder i would have thought they would have access to stocks if they were available.

A breeding program, yes pool our resources, but first to find some fish!

Liosomadoras onicus has indeed gotten very rare over recent years. As a newbie fishkeeper many years ago they were one of the first fish i fell in love with on sight, but as we only had a small community tank and my wife wanted to keep small pretty fish i was unable to keep one.
Now the fish keeping madness has fully set in and i have multiple tanks of large and small proportions i havent seen one for sale for years, only the false jaguars and those only from time to time.

Marc, I haven't chimed in as all the species I keep are currently listed...

Trachy. galeatus from Peru
Trachy. sp. Otorongo (at least I did a month or so ago, the last time I actually saw the fish!)
Tatia galaxias (true galaxias, from locale.) Still the same fish from the CatE-Log shots in 1998, imported in 1993. Unfortunately, I am down to a lone male.
Tatia intermedia
Centromochlus perugea
Liosomadoras morrowi
Auchenipterichthys coracoideus

That's about it for now.

pturley wrote:Marc, I haven't chimed in as all the species I keep are currently listed...

Hi Paul,
That doesn't matter; the issue is who has what and wants to share that information. The latter prevented me from asking you to join in, for I know you have Auchenipterichthys coracoideus. Didn't know about all the others though.

Here's the latest addition to the driftwood room.
They were sold as Auchenipterichthys thoracatus but are really A. coracoideus - right?
Of course they are extreme pale on the picture.

OK, how many of us have attempted breeding and how many have succeeded, I think it would be great if we could pool information and some how get a most probable formula for attempting. I have just moved house recently (I was living at my girlies while my house was finnished how, she put up with having my tanks in her house for 2 years is amazing)and am in the process of re-establishing my fishouse, or the laboratory as the kids call it, and am right up for dedicating it to this idea. There seems to be alot of people breeding or attempting to breed 'plecs' and cory's and they seem to have developed a formula for many of them but I find it very difficult to find information on breeding auchenipterids, and doradids for that matter. I Started a thread on doradids a while ago and recieved no information, which either means no one is doing it, it is extremely difficult or it can't be done.
I personally am a bit worried about the lack of jaguar cats available, when I was a kid my LFS usually had one in each tank, so they have either gone out of favour (and L numbers seem to be the favorite at the moment) which I find hard to believe of such a stunning fish, or they have been overfished/habitat destroyed.
I'm gonna pull out the plugs and call in favours to get hold of some now.
You hear about fish reintroduction in other fields that have been carried out by hobbyists and it would be a shame if that terrible day came and we could do nothing about it.
Marc the Metynnis are stunning now really defined patern and red fins, I'll send you a picture if you wan't, I had these for free off a mate!!
What do you guys think?

I have witness copulations in all species listed in the post above except for the "sp Otorongo" (as I only have one) and the L. morrowi as I am not 100% certain that is what I saw, but I have never found eggs.

I have also kept and witnessed copulations in Trachylichthys decaradius as well.

The main factor IMHO in all of these copulations was FOODS and FEEDING. For me, most all witnessed copulations occured after prolonged feedings with either live insects or other nutrition dense foods (earthworm based blender mix).

There are several easily cultured prey insects that can be used as foods. Currently, I am culturing meal-worms (have forever!), Superworms (Zoophobios sps.) and a colony of Blatta lateralis(a small, tropical roach species)

BTW: don't tell my wife! She freaked out a year or so ago when she found the large colony of "death-head" roaches I had going. The conversation was something like this...

"What honey, why does hundreds of 3"-4" long roaches make you squeemish?"

I might have chance of picking up some Tatia galaxias in a few weeks...are they a hardy species, or is there something I should be aware of?

daniel60 wrote:They were sold as Auchenipterichthys thoracatus but are really A. coracoideus - right?

Right. How many have you got?

kim m wrote:I might have chance of picking up some Tatia galaxias in a few weeks...are they a hardy species, or is there something I should be aware of?

Nothing wrong with them. Do so!

kim m wrote:

I might have chance of picking up some Tatia galaxias in a few weeks...are they a hardy species, or is there something I should be aware of?

Just that they are likely not T. galaxias unless they are being imported from either Venezuela or Colombia.

I have seen lots of Tatia imported as "galaxias" coming in from Peru but T. galaxias are not from here so the ID is questionable at best.

All Aucheniperids are particularly susceptable to "ich" and other parasitic skin infections. When you first get them, keep them warm (85F) for a couple weeks to help them settle in, this helps to prevent a possible outbreak should they be exposed/stressed in transit.

A have no idea where they are imported from, but I'll ask when I see them. If they are from Peru, what could they be if not T. galaxias? T. aulopygia?

Tatia intermedia: Several hundreds of youngsters, the oldest ones four weeks old.
Tatia perugiae: Fry, but I didn't manage (or try hard enough) to keep them alive.
Trachelyopterichthys taeniatus: Witnessed copulation.
Tatia aulopygia, Auchenipterichthys coracoideus: Nothing - yet.
Don't really know why my T. intermedia keeps spawning. I don't do extra water changes in their tank, they don't get special food (just frozen artemia and blackworms, plus small NLS pellets). But a species tank seems to be a good idea.

Marc van Arc wrote:Right. How many have you got?

10. They don't seem as shy as the others, but I guess that can change...
I would really like the next Auchenipterid to be a little larger.

kim m wrote:If they are from Peru, what could they be if not T. galaxias? T. aulopygia?

According to CoF, there are 3 Tatias native to Peru:
T. intermedia; T. perugiae & T. gyrina.
T. aulopygia is widely spread, but apparently not in Peru.

pturley wrote:All Aucheniperids are particularly susceptable to "ich" and other parasitic skin infections.

Paul,
I can't say I have the same experiences with regard to the above. I'd rather say they're very hardy, even when bought directly from the plane (at the wholesaler's; straight from the box without quarantine). However, this is of course not recommended.

Something completely different: these meal worms you spoke about; are those the ones that become flies??

No not flies, beetles. Tenobrio molitor

Correction: Tenebrio!

My experiences with tatia do coorespond to Paul's observations. They are indeed hardy fishes, but should ich be introduced into the system, all hell breaks loose.

Current stock mating attempts:
Liosomadoras oncinus: no (2 females)
Trachelyopterus fisheri: no
Trachelyopterus galeatus yes
Trachelyopterus sp. `guyana: no (2 males)
Auchenipterichthys coracoideus: no (too young)
Tatia perugiae: yes
Tatia intermedia: no (too young
Trachelyichthys exilis: no (ditto)

Fishes I used to have long ago:
Auchenipterichthys coracoideus: yes
Auchenipterichthys punctatus: yes
Pseudauchenipterus nodosus: yes
Liosomadoras oncinus: no
Tatia intermedia: yes
Tatia aulopygia: no
Ageneiosus magoi: yes
Trachelyichthys exilis: no
Trachelyopterus coriaceus: yes

Never(!) seen any eggs, let alone fry.... Perhaps because all these Auchenipterids were in the same tanks together?
And why eat flakes when there are freshly laid eggs on the menu?

Marc van Arc wrote:And why eat flakes when there are freshly laid eggs on the menu?

Maybe because the eggs don't seem to taste very good?

daniel60 wrote:Maybe because the eggs don't seem to taste very good?

Daniel,
I don't quite understand this remark. Could you explain pls?

Marc van Arc wrote:I don't quite understand this remark. Could you explain pls?

I'll try. The Tatia intermedia eggs had gelatinous covers, as you can see in a picture in a previous post. Maybe the covers makes the eggs less tasty.
The latest eggs in the tank was left untouched by the adult fish - 8 Tatia, 3 Scleromystax, 2 Pseudohemiodon - for more than two days. The eggs weren't hidden or protected by the female. Then the covers dissolved - and the fry disappeared.

Okay, I see. My thoughts were - taken into consideration that the parents would't eat their own eggs - species like Liosomadoras, Trachelyopterus and Ageneiosus wouldn't stop at other species' eggs. That would relatively be easy as Auchenipterids don't guard their eggs. It's just a matter of scavenging in the dark until one finds some unexpected protein.....
But it might as well be that there haven't been any eggs at all

Hi Marc,

Marc van Arc wrote:
Walter, I saw pictures of T. anduzei and it's definitely NOT your fish. Check this link http://www.auburn.edu/academic/science_ ... ndex1.html

checked the link ;)
I got a new video DVD some days ago - from German Andreas Stelzig, Michael Böttner et al. : "Ventuari - Expedition zum Flu� der Rochen" (Ventuari - expedition to the river of stingrays): http://www.aqua-media.de/am_frames.html
They show (in a picture slide show of captured species) Trachelyopterichthys anduzei.
It doesn't look similar to the ones on the link you gave (maybe the pictures of Marc Sabaj show young specimen?). The T. anduzei in this movie more look like T. taeniatus, but more corpulent, plump...

Of course the Sabaj pictures are the more serious reference...

Hi,

I keep 5 or 6 Tatia perugiae and since yesterday 4 Trachelyopterichthys taeniatus, from Walter.
Some pictures:

interesting fish and rare. fully mature? what's the length of your fish?

"Germany" is a big place. can you tell us where you got these cats? LFS lokation?

not that I'm getting Auchenipterids (I'll leave those to Marc and other enthousiasts), but an importer or LFS that carries rarities like these is likely to carry other unusual fish as well......

Hi Sid,

fully mature?

I think...

what's the length of your fish?

Between 15 and 17 cm. Currently measured for you!

"Germany" is a big place. can you tell us where you got these cats? LFS lokation?

I must refresh my profil. I live since some years in Austria - sorry...

They come from http://www.transfish.de , near Munich.

Regards,
Oliver

Just checked; alas, you must be a shopkeeper or someone with a very good connection.
those people don't sell to customers; only to shopkeepers/salespersons.

ah well, I tried

Yes - you need a trade certificate, or must study/work on a university, as Walter.
It´s a wholesaler.