plcos & cory's for a 300 gal. tank?

huk chun chu · Post by **huk chun chu** » 01 Oct 2006, 19:07

I am setting up a 300 gal. tank which will be heavily planted & stocked mainly with Discus & other compatibles. What type of plecos & cory's can be added to this tank & how many of ea.?

RogerMcAllen · Post by **RogerMcAllen** » 01 Oct 2006, 22:50

What are the tank dimensions?

If the tank is well wooded, the any of the panaques should do well.

As far as cories, anything should be fine. A good general rule is at least 6 of each species. I currently have a 6' x 1.5' tank with a mix of 14 trilineatus and schwartzi, and this seems to be a pretty good number (but I may get a few more up to 20 or so). I don't like to leave a few lonly cories at the shop, so I usually just find something I like and buy them all, unless I can leave 6 or more at the shop.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 02 Oct 2006, 12:22

I just posted on . They are nice colours, and go well with the high temps that Discus tends to like. A decent bunch of them would be a nice, relatively colourfull addition. [There are other corys that tolerate temps in the 30'C/mid-80'F range, but most prefer temps below 25'C/mid-70'F - if you search for "Cory Discus" you'd probably find a bunch of posts on the subject of Corys suitable for Discus tanks].

As for pleco's, many things are possible - depends on personal preference what you want - a few large ones or several small ones? Any kind or something that eats algae? Price range?

Some examples:
Large ones:
Any species that you can get hold of would do.

Smaller ones:
- is one of the ones that grow fairly large too.
.

Algae eaters:

I've only linked to genera, as they tend to be fairly similar within the different genera, and it's easier if you have a wider choice when you go to your LFS to choose. [If I tell you that you should buy , and your LFS doesn't have that one, you may not choose another Peckoltia sp. because I was very specific].

--
Mats

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 02 Oct 2006, 20:45

I have been a discus person for a long time and I've been through many combinations of Corys and Loricarids in planted display tanks. Over time a combination that I find works well are as follows:
Corydoras sterbai per Matt, colorful and warm water tolerant, it is perhaps the very best cory choice.
Algae eaters: Sturisoma and it's relative Surisoichthys(spelled wrong) are spectacular appearing, cleans glass and plant leaves. They won't damage plants neither by scraping the leaves too hard or breaking the leaves under their own weight and again tolerate the warm water but oxygen levels must be high. Despite what many think, discus enjoy strong currents as long as they are set up to have areas cancelling them out to provide some calmer areas.
Plecos that I consider legtimate substitutes or complementary to your corys are the Hypancistrus, Peckoltia and Panaque species. They are great bottom cleaners in there own right. Do not keep any of the large plecos with discus! L66 King Tigers are as big as you should go, basically 5inches or less is what you want. They all like the same foods your discus and will never try to attach themselves to the sides of discus.
I have only one planted discus community tank because for breeding and rearing the baby discus I only use bare bottom tanks with a potted Amazon Sword plant for a touch of green. My planted tank is a 100 gallon system and I have 10 wild caught Heckel Discus, 12 Nannostomus trifasciatus pencil fish, a trio of Apistogramma agassizii, 6 Crenicichla compressiceps dwarf green pike cichlids, 6 Sturisoma nigirostrum, 7 P. maccus clown plecos and 8 Hypancstrus L66 King Tiger pleco. The plecos do everything a Corydorus can do and are more showy. I generally find Corys not to do all that well over time in a discus tank so I use the Hypancistrus instead. This is what I have found to be a sustainable community over a long period of time. Even the Corydoras sterbai usually do better if they can be kept at 80dF rather than the 84 to 86dF I keep discus at. This is the result of my 40 years as a discus breeder and hard core aquarist. Good luck and enjoy your discus show tank.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 03 Oct 2006, 11:22

Larry mentions the fish that I thought of after I finished my post: and - they are good algae cleaners indeed.

I don't think a well-fed large pleco is going to cause a problem with Discus - but keeping it well-fed and keeping the water clean enough for the rather sensitive Discus may be a problem... So choosing a few more of the smaller fish is probably the safer option.

--
Mats

huk chun chu · Post by **huk chun chu** » 03 Oct 2006, 12:39

The tank dimensions are 96in.L.x30in.W.x30in.H. I plan to have it heavily planted as well as plenty of wood. I do like the idea of 6 or more of each species. You have given me what looks like so many interesting choices.I am in favour of the smaller fish when it comes to pleco's. I started flipping through the recommended photos that MatsP has pointed out & I must say it is going to be a daunting task to pick what I want to add to this tank. I really appreciate all the advice I have been given. I have been in the hobby for 40 years & had no idea of the variety of fish in the pleco & cory families out there. The Discus probably limit my choices a bit,but I am still amazed at the possibilities.this could take a lot of time.

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 03 Oct 2006, 16:04

I don't have anything against the larger plecos except when it comes to keeping them in a planted and discus tanks. The algae eater types tend to chew through some sword plant leaved trying to clean the algae and their weight can break off the leaves. The other well documented habit they have of trying to explore the sides of large discus causes too much stress for the discus and occassionally damage the slime coat. They can uproot plants so I cconsider them to be like bulls in a china shop.
Those are my reasons for advising caution when considering larger plecos. A gold nugget is a little larger than I usually advise but one that is an exception to my rules. They seem to be ok so far as my own experience indicates and they are one of the most color plecos to consider keeping.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 03 Oct 2006, 16:16

Larry, the "bulldozer" effect is certainly an important one to consider in the combo of big pleco and plants - good point.

I do however think that "exploring the sides of discus" is caused by people not feeding the pleco sufficiently - particularly when it comes to the large commons that you see ever so often - they need something more than just algae and a few smidgeons of food dropping to the substrate - like half a courgette/zucchini every couple of days per fish... A former collegue of mine had a 75g tank which for all intents and purposes was a "glyptopericthys tank" - two G. gibbiceps and two G. joselimaianus. He fed them one whole courgette a every evening, and still had problems that he fish would eat occasionally his plants...

But there's certainly a whole heap of commonly available small species that are very suitable for Discus tank - and you can keep more of them in the same tank...

--
Mats

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 03 Oct 2006, 17:32

Hi Matt,
The main problem between the larger plecos and large discus is often related to food by way of pleco territoriality.
When both are trying to eat from the same "trough" the plecos will drive off the discus by latching on to their sides. This is something I have a lot of first hand experience in so all I can say is "Don't say I did'nt warn ya". Individual fish may not have this problem behavior but sooner or later you will see the problem and I just try to recommend that people just don't risk the discus for a pleco.
Ask this question on some other forums such as http://www.simplydiscus.com and you will be deluged by discus keepers unfortunate experiences. My advice is however based strictly on my own experience of being a discus breeder for 40 years and I have boiled down what fish I now consider discus safe.

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 03 Oct 2006, 18:17

Huk,
I wanted to add a litle more. Matt mentions Ancistrus and they are very good harmless algae eaters. I onlly have experience with the various morphs of the common Ancistrus species, the common bushy nose. They are very good fish for your planted discus tank. They prefer cooler water for breeding but as workers in the discus tank they do fine. There are some other Ancistrus that are more attractive but I lack any experience with them.
The other fish that is well worth a place in discus aquariums is Hypoptopoma thoracatum or H. gulare if you can find some. If you locate some buy as many as you can, perhaps a dozen, they are very good at cleaning algae from the plant leaves and are very interesting fish. A giant Otocinclus, if you will. I have found them to live for many years in planted discus tanks and are much more durable than the Otocinclus.

huk chun chu · Post by **huk chun chu** » 04 Oct 2006, 22:17

I am definately interested in all fish that would be compatible with discus in this tank. Sorry for my lack of knowledge with regards to proper names for many of the recommended fish, so could you please lead me in the right diretion so I may see a photo of the Hypoptopoma thoracatum or h. gulare & any other good tank mates for the discus.

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 05 Oct 2006, 01:04

Huk,
Just try the search function here on pc and it will take you to any of the catfish we've mentioned as suggestions for your new tank.

Dave Rinaldo · Post by **Dave Rinaldo** » 05 Oct 2006, 02:07

Here's what the Cat-elog has for Hypoptopoma spp.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 05 Oct 2006, 11:49

For anyone wanting to refer to a genus in the Cat-eLog directly, it's easy:

Code: Select all

[clog]Genusname[/clog]

. As an example

Code: Select all

[clog]Hypoptopma[/clog]

shows up as .

All of the fishes discussed above can be found under the Loricariidae and Callichtyidae families in the Cat-eLog - you can find them by selecting the "Scientific name by family" in the Cat-eLog menu above the first post on this page.

--
Mats