Aquarium Leaf litter

whiteymoza · Post by **whiteymoza** » 23 Jun 2006, 15:12

I am thinking about setting up a small (10g) Blackwater aquarium with sand and leaf litter (oak) for the substrate and lots of Twigs and branches (also oak) is this ok? does anybody have any pictures tanks with this kind of substrate?
also apart from banjo cants, what other fish corys ect.. would be sutible for this environment?

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 23 Jun 2006, 17:45

Whiteymoza,
That's an awfully heavily popoulated 10 gal you have there. It's about right for a single pair of common BN plecs. Can you segregate the various species you really have your heart set on breeding? I would recommend at least a 20L per project. I am trying to breed L066 and I have 8 adults in a 75g they share with 10 Heckel Discus. This is just until I can sex a trio or 2 then I'll move the prospective breeders to a 20L set up river style, I am following a similar tact with my L333,L199's. I have some Sturisoma but they will get a 36"long 35g for 4 fish. I have a colony of BN in a long 20 with 2males and 6 females. They spawn regulary but egg clusters are often ejected and have to be hatched artificially. Sometimes I get a cluster of 100 eggs and have about a 95% hatch rate.
I think most would agree you are trying way to much for a 10g tank. Until you can spread them out don't even think about adding more fish. None are likely to spawn as you have it now. Good luck.
Larry Waybright

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 23 Jun 2006, 17:53

I think Whitemoyza has at least one other tank, from previous comments I've seen...

I've heard that oak-leaves are high in acids, so it may be an idea to use other leaves if you're in an area where the water is soft/acidic (or you use RO water).

Cory's would probably love rummaging around in the leaf-litter..

--
Mats

grokefish · Post by **grokefish** » 23 Jun 2006, 20:21

South american bumblebee catfish, any small dorads love the leaf litter.

whiteymoza · Post by **whiteymoza** » 24 Jun 2006, 08:01

Yes those are all mostly in individual tanks I have a fair few tanks going for a 17year old! But it keeps me out of trouble!.. Anyway does anybody have any pictures of leaves as substrate because I would very much like to see what it looks like..

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 24 Jun 2006, 18:24

whiteymoza
I made an errant assumption that all your fish were in a 10 gal. Sorry about that. Re: leaf litter is natural but it can degrade rapidly so it can be a lot of work maintaining optimum H2O quality. Sometimes it's worth it though for simulating natural conditions. I tried it with wild caught Apistogramma nissenji using dry Fall oak leaves,RO and pH 5.0. Their eggs fungused just as well as they did in my tapwater. Even so I'd try it again probably with trying to get Banjo Cats to do their thing. Sounds like you're doing fine.
Larry

whiteymoza · Post by **whiteymoza** » 24 Jun 2006, 18:39

Personally I just want a really natural looking tank I am never satisfyed with how my tanks look howver much anybody tells me otherwise.. I dont care if I can see the fish I just want a really natural tank where the fish are at thire happiest and most closely represented environment and Id love to try out a leaf litter, Acid pool, bank type aquarium

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » 24 Jun 2006, 19:38

whiteymoza,
You go for it. You'll gain insights by experimenting on ideas of your own that no one or no book can provide and they'll be all your own.
Larry

Deb · Post by **Deb** » 24 Jun 2006, 22:48

Yes, I agree. Just do it. You don't need to see pictures - the picture is in your mind. Gary Elson wrote something about two years ago. He obtained a very tiny, little known Rasbora species, which in the wild lived its whole life under leaf litter, hiding from predators. Gary set up a tank just for them with leaf litter, but sans predators. All of the instincts of these little fish told them to stay under the leaves, and they did for a long time. Then, one day he saw them out and about! His heart jumped with joy. It was so exciting to see them finally realize that they didn't have to hide anymore.

Whitey, just go for it and show us the pix when you get done.

Deborah

whiteymoza · Post by **whiteymoza** » 25 Jun 2006, 08:20

Ok But firstly I need to know ehat leaves to use I think Oak leaves may affffect the water quality too much!

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 25 Jun 2006, 10:30

I think Oak leaves may affffect the water quality too much!

Oak leaves are fine. So are beech. See this thread.

Fish such as Apistogramma live in this kind of habitat in the wild. They would thrive in such a tank provided the water is soft enough.

Cardinal tetras, apistos and corydoras would be an excellent mix over leaf litter.

The leaves do break down after a few months, so give it a good siphon once in a while. Also make sure you collect enough leaves in autumn to keep topping up the tank.

Also keep a close eye on water quality.

Here's a couple of pics of kribs and fry over leaf litter.

Deb · Post by **Deb** » 25 Jun 2006, 14:16

Whitey, the leaves used in the account of the Asian tank above were also oak, and I remember they were stored dry in trash bags, and replaced in the tank regularly. Of course the water will be affected - what else can you expect with decomposing materials? I suppose that water changes, siphoning, and changing the leaves will be the way to keep it healthy.

Racoll, your photos of your kribs are always so striking. The first one in your post here is so mellow, and artistic. Very evocative.

Deborah

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 25 Jun 2006, 14:50

Thanks deb

Sadly the male died this year. He was looking very old and tatty. The female is also looking very old now, but she remains healthy.

coryfan · Post by **coryfan** » 26 Jun 2006, 12:15

Hello!

This link might be an inspiration: http://www.aquadesign.pl/galeria_44SA.htm . After I have moved houses in July, I will try such a setup myself. Let me know, how you are getting on with your leaf litter tank.

Tobias