Help Please!

Post by **Silurus** » 19 Mar 2006, 17:38

The white spots are just the laterosensory pores on the lateral line system. Nothing to worry about.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 19 Mar 2006, 21:29

Got the water tested...

Ammonia = 0
Nitrite = 10 EEK!
Nitrate = 40
Ph = 8.4
Alkalinity = 40
Hardness = 150
Chlorine/Chloramine = 0 (I guess we don't have much in our water.)

Activity level is still good. He is looking better. Camera is still charging.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 20 Mar 2006, 02:29

I don't think he's looking any worse. In fact his head looks a little better. I'm not giving up yet!

Hey could someone answer my question about these little dust particle looking wormy things? They are about 1/16" long, white and they hang out on the sides of the tank. Are they harmful? How do I get rid of them? Do I want to get rid of them? They are so small the camera won't pick them up.

Sandtiger · Post by **Sandtiger** » 20 Mar 2006, 07:14

Glad to hear your not getting an ammonia reading, that is critical. Next to go is nitrite and then the tank will be established. He does look a bit better as well.

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 20 Mar 2006, 09:51

The white spots are just the laterosensory pores on the lateral line system. Nothing to worry about.

I was refering to the white spots on the head.

He is looking a lot better though.

The water test results are very good. When the nitrites are at the 0, your tank should be fully cycled.

However, be careful that these readings aren't just low because you've been changing lots of water. They will need to remain at 0 once he's better and the water isn't being changed every day.

I would continue to change 25% every day until he's better.

When nitrite is zero, don't change any water for three days, and have the water re-tested. This should tell you if the tank is cycled.

When can I feed him again? He's looking hungry!

Resist the temptation to feed him, it will drive the nitrite back up (which you've worked so hard to reduce). These fish will go weeks without foods with no problems.

You should feed him when the nitrite is 0, and the sores have gone.

I don't know what the "wormy" things are. Probably harmless.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 21 Mar 2006, 00:44

I GOT DECHLORINATOR!!!!! My neighbor found some!

I'm going to do a 10 gallon water change tonight as opposed to the 5 gallons I've been doing for the past 3 days. I don't want to shock him too much or mess up the other water parameters. He get's really weird after I add the water to the tank. Very listless and almost stoned looking. He's fine when I'm taking the water out. He just hides for about 5 minutes after I'm done and then he's just cautious. In the morning he's been really active! I want to see how he does with 10 gallons before I go any larger. Honestly, I've been worrying about him most after I add the water. If he weathers the 10 tonight, I'll do 15 tomorrow.

My camera is dead again.

LOL
His head looks really good and the swelling is gone! The red spot on his head isn't "weeping" anymore. His activity level is great (after he gets used to the fresh water) The hazy white film is going away. His fins are looking better. However, he is "yawning" a lot, but that's from the nitrite levels, right? He's been "hanging" too (mostly after I add the water) He'll hang for about 5 minutes and then snap out of it and start swimming again. Then hang again...

I treated with Melafix again this morning when I added the fresh water.

I'm going to go do his water change now...

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 21 Mar 2006, 09:40

The odd behaviour is probably down to a combination of chlorine and nitrite.

Now you have dechlorinator, you can change loads of water

.

Try to do 15g a day minimum.

To avoid shocking him, get the new water to the same temperature by adding some hot water.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 21 Mar 2006, 12:03

Still improving!!!

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 21 Mar 2006, 17:05

Good, what you're doing is the right thing. Keep changing 15g or so per day, until you see no nitrite. Then leave the water changing for three days, and check for nitrite again. If there's no nitrite, you start changing water every week, as much as you need to keep the nitrate under, say, 50 ppm (preferrably 25 ppm, but that can be hard).

--
Mats

Sandtiger · Post by **Sandtiger** » 22 Mar 2006, 06:18

racoll wrote:
The white spots are just the laterosensory pores on the lateral line system. Nothing to worry about.
I was refering to the white spots on the head.

So was he ;)

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 22 Mar 2006, 11:34

Silurus wrote:The white spots are just the laterosensory pores on the lateral line system. Nothing to worry about.

racoll wrote:I was refering to the white spots on the head.

Some of what was seen in the pictures, on the top of his head, was where the lesions WERE, there were pieces of skin flaking off. There was soft tissue bulging through the sores and it also looked like it was weeping fluid.

I am not a marine photographer and my camera is a bit old. I don't know how people get good pictures of their aquariums without using flash. I'm sure there were plenty of times when this poor fish was laying around in there thinking "What the #@!$%! I'm sick and that flash is annoying!"

Anyway, he is doing MUCH better now. He's behaving like he was when he was in the 20 gallon tank. He is not twitching as often as he was, the flicking as stopped, and I didn't catch him "yawning" yesterday. He weathered the 10 gallon change really well and so I did 15 gallons last night. I am still treating with Melafix and adding Stability to the tank when I change his water. I will continue to change the water until all symptoms are gone.

I want to thank everyone on this board who has helped me through this. Without you people, I would have lost him.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 22 Mar 2006, 11:44

LindaVamp wrote:I am not a marine photographer and my camera is a bit old. I don't know how people get good pictures of their aquariums without using flash. I'm sure there were plenty of times when this poor fish was laying around in there thinking "What the #@!$%! I'm sick and that flash is annoying!"

Best way is to use an external flash that is positioned above the tank. Some professional/prosumers use two flashes linked together to get more diverse light. But it's definitely a good idea to have a proper flash on the camera!

Anyway, he is doing MUCH better now. He's behaving like he was when he was in the 20 gallon tank. He is not twitching as often as he was, the flicking as stopped, and I didn't catch him "yawning" yesterday. He weathered the 10 gallon change really well and so I did 15 gallons last night. I am still treating with Melafix and adding Stability to the tank when I change his water. I will continue to change the water until all symptoms are gone.

I want to thank everyone on this board who has helped me through this. Without you people, I would have lost him.

You should really test the water to determine when you need to stop changing water - although it certainly won't harm the fish to continue with the water changes past the point when you have the tank fully matured, you will still have to determine that the tank is matured somewhen, and the best way to do that is to test for nitrite - if there's no nitrite (and no ammonia) the tank is matured and biological filtration is working. At this point, the fish will be fine with weekly water changes, as long as you don't overfeed or have the tank stocked with far too many fish...

--
Mats

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 22 Mar 2006, 12:48

I'm going up tonight to have the water tested. I have a feeling that I'm almost there.

He's doing great this morning. He keeps coming to the top looking for food, but he's not finding any. There is a little discoloration (brownish/yellowish) on his belly. Is this a symptom of nitrite poisoning?

This was taken a couple days ago. The spot is slightly larger now. Almost fills the area I have drawn.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 22 Mar 2006, 13:10

It looks like some sort of ulcer. Probably going to heal if you keep changing the water.

--
Mats

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 23 Mar 2006, 01:29

Anyone want to see a happy catfish?!?!?!

Do you want to see what you helped make happen?

Chlorine/Chloramine = 0 Ummm he's moving too fast... nothing but tail for that one!

Ammonia = 0

Nitrate = 20

Hardness = 75

Alkalinity = 0

Ph = 6.8

NITRITE = 0!!!!

I fed him tonight and he was thrilled!!!
I am taking a break from changing the water. I will take the water up and get it tested again on Friday to make sure everything is staying how it should be. I am going to continue the Melafix until the filmy haze is gone.
As you can see in the pictures, he is doing MUCH better! He is still flicking and twitching a little bit. He is no longer "hanging". There appear to be no more open wounds. Appetite is ravenous!
((((Hugs)))) to everyone who helped!
Your support and generous offers are much appreciated!

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 23 Mar 2006, 08:49

EXCELLENT!

Sounds like your tank's on the right track. Try a tiny bit of food, and get the water tested as often as possible.

The O alkalinity isn't quite right. Try and get a few handfuls of coral sand or crushed coral or aragonite or marble chips from the fish store. They should give some to you for free.

Put this in a stocking and hang it in the water. This should raise the alkalinity and pH a bit.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 04 Apr 2006, 00:54

Just thought I'd give an update.
He's still here! I've done weekly water changes and his water params are good. Everything falls in the normal range. I finally was able to get an accurate picture of how he's looking.

The white film doesn't seem to be going away.

He is still twitching every now and then and flicking against the gravel periodically.

His activity level is normal. He is no longer "hanging"

His fins are still quite tattered looking. Will they grow back? Will he ever be jet black like he was before, or is he going to have scarring from the lesions?

Also, we have developed a trust factor.

He is taking food from my fingers!

I am in the process of setting up his old 30 gallon tank again... any ideas for it?

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 04 Apr 2006, 10:23

It's always good to see the result when you give a helping hand. Looking better, isn't he.

Keep doing weekly water changes, that's never going to be a bad thing...

Fins almost always grow back, so I don't think you need to worry about that.

Taking food from your fingers is definitely a nice thing. Not a single of my catfish would do that - but then none of them are of a similar type of catfish as yours, so it's no big surprise - I have seen a picture somewhere of a Ancistrus taking food from someones fingers, so maybe I should just try it a bit more often...

As for your 30g tank, you want to find fish that stay reasonably small, less than 6" for sure (unless you want to move them later on, and I guess at least you know how NOT to do that now...

). This still gives you a HUGE choice - it's all about what _you_ want in this case. I've likened this with buying new curtains - everyone likes slightly different things. It's REALLY what YOU like here...

It's generally a good idea to figure out what fish will go well in the water that you get from the tap - unless you want to spend a small fortune on getting some water modification stuff to change the water to match what the fish likes. Of course, I'm keeping mostly soft/acidic water species in fairly hard/alkaline water, so I'm not following my own advice here...

One thing that definitely helps is to figure out one or two species that you like to keep. This choice will set the target for your temperature, decorations needed, water movement, etc, etc. Once you have picked your "target", you can then add fish that have same or similar criteria to live in. I think it would be a good idea to start a new topic for this 30g tank, as it's not really related to the health of your catfish... Speak-easy is probably the best place for that, but if you do some homework first to figure out what target species you want, then we can help with some additional information and hints/tips for suitable "mates". Adding your local water parameters (pH, hardness) would help to choose fish that will go well with your choice...

--
Mats

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 24 Apr 2006, 03:11

Am I due for another update? LOL

He's still hanging in there.

All lesions have healed but the white film is still there. His fins aren't looking any better, but they're not getting any worse either. He is more active than he was in the smaller tank. We're pretty much at a stand still with his recovery.

Does anyone know what the white filmy stuff is and how to get rid of it? The Melafix just isn't working. Should I go back to doing nightly water changes until it is gone or will that mess up his tank?

I'm just so happy that he is STILL here!!! I really thought we were going to lose him. I keep checking the previous pictures of him when he was really sick and I just can't believe he made it!

Azmeaiel · Post by **Azmeaiel** » 07 May 2006, 03:17

the white film is possibly scarring. on catfish it seems to take a while for ther colour pigment to grow back even when wounds are healed. On some injured black coloured fish it may take months.

Hope he stays well, you did a great job saving him.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 28 May 2006, 05:18

Here I am again! LOL

Well, guess what?
Don't anyone laugh....

I'm moving in about 2 months and have to move the stupid fish again! LOL
At least he is still alive... for now.

Still ugly. Still filmy looking. Fins are very tattered. :/ getting bigger. dumb fish.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 30 May 2006, 14:49

Shouldn't be too bad to move the fish.

When I moved my big tank (~100g), I used three plastic dustbins (the ones you keep outside for the dustman to collect the waste from) to transport the water - that was the least expensive big container for water I could find. I also used a big tub for the fish and several builders buckets for gravel and decorations. All went in a van in one go, then "assembly is reverse of disassembly", i.e. fill in gravel + decorations, water and finally the fish. Top up with water from the tap, just like you would when you do a water change.

This of course works if you're moving a short distance - if you're moving across the US by car, then you'd have a slihgtly different problem. A few hours is fine by the above method. If you're moving more than 24 hours, you'd probably be better off cycling the tank again.

It's obviously best if you can set up the tank as soon as you arrive in the new place - you can always mess with the furniture and stuff like that later...

--
Mats

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 07 Sep 2006, 03:26

*sigh* The move is over and guess what... HE'S MADE IT!!! My poor little delapidated, scarred up, fin mangled, fungus infected friend, Penny, has made it through the move! He was looking a little ill before the move... lots of floating around, tattered fins, faking death daily. We completely changed his water (well, all but 2 gallons of it) It's been a week since we moved him into the new house and he is doing very well. He's more active than he had been, his fins are growing back and I think the fungus is going away (if it is truely a fungus) Just wanted to let you all know that this stupid fish is still with us and doing better than he had been. I'll post pics of him as soon as I can find the box that the camera cord is packed in... LOL

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 07 Sep 2006, 12:31

Congratulations on the successfull move.

It sounds like you weren't doing (often or big) enough water changes. As the fish grows, the amount of waste produced will increase, and it can help cause more stress. Also, the water "added" may vary in contents of for example nitrate, so you may end up with less efficient water-changes.

I just moved my big (100+g) tank to my new house. Lost one of about 40 fish due to some stress-related problem [I got all the fish over to the new tank, and within a few hours I could see this one fish looking a bit off colour, and as time passed, it didn't seem to improve, so I euthenazed it].

[And yes, I know how difficult it is to arrange moving of the house and keeping up with the fish-maintenance at the same time...]

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Mats