Needing a good recommendation for my tank

zmazza · Post by **zmazza** » 27 Feb 2006, 21:15

I sincerely apologize if this is the wrong place to post this, but being a new catfish owner I couldn't find a more appropriate forum...

I have a 40 gallon breeder and the pH on my tank runs at about 8.3.

I have tried keeping plecos several times to no avail. The catish usually pass away after about a week or two, regardless of the fact that I try and feed them algae wafers. It was pointed out to me that they were relatively new tanks, most less than 2 months old, but fully cycled. I seed my tanks with filter media from other tanks.

They told me there wasn't enough algae in the tank for the catfish to feed on. They also said that most enjoyed acidic water, which I definitely didn't have. I have tried to keep common pleco's (I know now that they get too big), as well as tiger pleco's. They said those only got to about 4-5". Forgive me if thats the wrong name. Again, still new to catfish.

Sorry for the long rant, but I wanted to give a basic background.

I have a 40 gallon tank at 36x18x16. It has a 25 watt fixture and about 30 lbs of smooth, small diameter gravel. It even has a few small low-light plants... anachris, amazon sword.

The current tank mates are some small zebra danios and a rummy nose tetra, as well as a 2" senegal bichir.

I know that he will leave anything alone that he can't easily fit into his mouth. So I'm looking for a catfish that is big enough not to be eaten, but small enough that it will fit in my tank. I also need one that can tolerate higher pH. Is there one that can fit this niche that is readily available? If the catfish is bigger than what my tank can allow, thats fine too. I can always trade him in or find a good home for him. I have a LFS that is always looking for larger catfish.

Please help!

Thanks a bunch.

-Zac

ac82 · Post by **ac82** » 27 Feb 2006, 21:28

From what I have read some small Synodontis would be ok for a tank your size, an ideal one would be Synodontis Nigriventris.

They are commonly called upside down cats and are quite easily obtainable from a good LFS. I have got 4 in a 30x12x18 and they have been doing fine, just give they them plenty of hiding places and they will feel well at home.

Hope this helps

zmazza · Post by **zmazza** » 27 Feb 2006, 21:38

I've always liked upside down catfish, but I never knew if they would survive in 8.3 pH or not. How many would you put in a 40 gallon breeder? Keep in mind though that the main attraction of the tank is going to be the senegal bichir... I'm going to have more than adequate filtration and regular water changes... I'd like to have a gourami or two , as well as some sort of catfish.

I'm thinking of the three spot gourami..

How about this stocking idea...

4 upside down catfish
2 three spot gouramis
1 senegal bichir

I want an active tank... so I think this might work. The catfish and the gouramis would be too big for the bichir to eat. If it got too crowded I could always move them out.

THe gouramis only get about 5" or so, and the upside down cats only get about 4, right?

ecoli · Post by **ecoli** » 02 Mar 2006, 17:32

Well, you can't keep the bichir in that size tank for too long. The bichir can get over a foot long...

zmazza · Post by **zmazza** » 02 Mar 2006, 18:19

If I see that it's a problem I'll buy him a bigger tank. No problem. The tank is 36 inches long, 3 times his length, as well as a foot and a half wide. I think it's a very good start for him. It will take him a year and a half, two years to get up to a foot. I'm hoping to buy a 75-90 gallon when I build my house in the next year.

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 02 Mar 2006, 19:30

true upsidedown cats reach 3", and I've seen 4" Polypterus ornatipinnis youngsters tearing 1" nigriventris-youngsters to pieces

Also; with that high pH they simply won't last at all.

Bichirs are more adaptable when it comes to pH; some species like ornatipinnis and endlicheri can and do dwell in Riftlakes as well in rivers.
other species like the Common Bichir dwell in the Nile, wich has a very fluctuating pH, and it doesn't seem to bother them at all.

However ALL Polypterus are voracious carnivores and can and do attack and eat fish up to half their own length.
I once krpt a 8" P ornatipinnis succesfully in my Tanganyikan tank. it didn't bother any catfish in there (although there were 2" catfishes in there), but it DID attack and maul 4" cichlids repeatedly.

A Green Bichir would grab and try to eat a 4" Blue Gourami whenever it got the chance....Trichogaster trichopterus (the Blue 3spot) doesn't reach much over 4", and to a foot-long Bichir it's just a snack.

If you upgrade the tank, you might think about larger Synodontis; riverine as well as Tanganyikan. riverines wich can handle both Bichir and pH8+ include S angelicus, S eupterus, S ocellifer, S schall, S robbianus, S obesus etc.
Tanganyikans who get big enough and are used to agressive nippy fish include S multipunctatus, S polli, S nigromaculatus and the expensive S granulosus.

some of these fish are shoalers, others should be kept as singles because of severe territorial issues. I suggest you romp around the catelog for some more info.

zmazza · Post by **zmazza** » 02 Mar 2006, 19:56

He's a senegalus bichir. They are supposed to be one of the most peaceful bichirs, however they are opportunity feeders and will eat anything that is big enough to fit in their mouths. He's 2" now and is swimming happily with a 2" goldfish (don't ask), 5 small zebra danios and a rummynose tetra. I haven't fed him any live fish. His diet is primarily bloodworms. My gravel is dark brown, so he can't see the shrimp pellets. Any idea on other foods I should feed him?

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 02 Mar 2006, 21:11

he doesn't hunt by eyesight, so you can feed him pink food on pink gravel....he hunts by smell.

often Bichirs don't accept artificial food, so it might be he's picky.

2" is a true baby Bichir...tiny!
senegalensis is one of those that pass the 1 foot mark with ease. it takes time however; slow grower. but it can and does get huge; I've seen many senegalensis in the 1.5 foot reaches; 45 cm/18".

you can try: krill, mysis, unfrozen artemia, small earthworms or bits of them (whole when he's bigger), bloodworms, fish-eggs (when you buy fresh fish for dinner, often those have eggs, good food), chopped mussel without the shell, small crushed snails (no MTS/trumpetsnails!), white mosquitolarvae, gammarus, bits of unpeeled shrimp (whole shrimp when he's bigger), pieces of fish like smelt (whole smelts when he's bigger), blackworms, small aquatic insects like damselfly-larvae and the like.

toddnbecka · Post by **toddnbecka** » 21 Mar 2006, 06:35

Synodontis multipuctatus would be a good choice, particularly if you want 4 or more. They are schoolers, and more of them means more activity. Symodontis petricola would also work well with the size tank and high pH, but they are harder to find adult size. More commonly available are 1-1.5", which the bicher would eat.