Help Please!

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 13 Mar 2004, 16:27

Last summer my son's friend caught 4 baby catfish and gave them to her friends. We put one in my son's 5 gallon tank with a guppy that he brought home from school. The guppy has since died but we still have the catfish. He started out under an inch long and is now about 3 inches long. My husband decided to add water to the tank without curing it first. Today the catfish has a fat belly!!! I have never reseached catfish before, it seemed to being fine up until now. Is the fat belly from eating all the stuff stirred up when hubby dumped the water in or is this an ill effect of the tap water? Also just added one of those cheap little filters that just hook up to air pump and stick to the side of the tank.
Thanks for any info

Post by **Silurus** » 13 Mar 2004, 16:38

I'm not sure what species of catfish you re talking about, but I don't think it has anything to do with the tap water.
If it's a channel cat or a bullhead, they are pretty tolerant of most water conditions.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 13 Mar 2004, 17:22

I think it is a brown bullhead. I took a pic of it.

http://home.earthlink.net/~linduhvamp/i ... t_fish.jpg

Post by **Silurus** » 13 Mar 2004, 17:25

It's a black bullhead, and a very well-fed one at that. I wouldn't worry too much about the swollen belly.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 13 Mar 2004, 17:28

It had a little round belly yesterday, and now it looks preggy.

Thats ok, it's still adorable and loved the camera!
Thanks for the info!

spikythefish · Post by **spikythefish** » 15 Mar 2004, 19:29

what you have is a bullhead of some sort, GET A BIGGER TANK FAST!!

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 15 Mar 2004, 22:18

yup, bullhead allright.

very well suitable for a fishtank, unlike the Channelcat that should be kept in a huge pond.

Bullheads still reach about 1 foot or something (depending on species), so a hometank should be roomy.

lilobitrice14 · Post by **lilobitrice14** » 28 Jul 2004, 20:40

I'd release it into a lake.At least thats what i would do.But if you want to keep it i'd get it a 90 gallon tank,or a 75 at the smallest.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 11 Feb 2006, 15:24

How long do these things live???

It has been happily swimming around for about 2-1/2 years now in our tank! It has gotten bigger, but not too big (I think we stunned it's growth by keeping it in a 25 gal. tank) We mananged to obtain a 55 gal. tank for it. I'm a little leary about moving it though!!! I don't want anything to happen to it!! When I last posted, it was about 3 inches long and is now about 7 inches long. (I will post a pic as soon as my camera charges!!)

Post by **Shane** » 11 Feb 2006, 15:58

Linda,
You should get anywhere from 15-25 years of enjoyment out of the catfish.
-Shane

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 11 Feb 2006, 18:16

Wow!!! 15-25 yrs???

I'm assuming that they grow to their environment since the only time that we notice growing is when we do a partial water change. So now I have a few more questions..
How large will he get in the 55 gal tank?
Should we get him friends? If so, what will he be compatible with?
What should we be feeding him? Right now he's just eating the fish flakes and we feed him at night.

Also need some advice in cleaning out the used 55 gal. tank which is too heavy and awkward for me to handle on my own. It had been stored in a shed for about 6 months and has the whiteish film on it. I know not to use cleaning chemicals on the inside of the tank... Just need to know the easiest way of tackling this.

Nothing like a fish to leave me feeling like a moron.

kalija · Post by **kalija** » 11 Feb 2006, 18:35

If the white stuff is hard water stain, you should be able to get it off with white vinegar and a plastic scrubber, just rinse well. A python, or other hose hooked up to the sink will help with this since you can't move the tank easily.
Fish don't really grow to their environment, rather they get stunted by keeping them in too small a space. Waste tends to build up quickly and can stunt them. You can mitigate this to a point by making frequent large water changes, and good filtration will help, but I think he is going to need a larger home in the long term.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 13 Feb 2006, 14:51

Got the tank all cleaned up. Got the gravel, new plants, nice background, a few rocks, a couple air stones and the tank is set up! I pulled one of "his" rocks out of his tank and put it in the new tank. We did a partial change of his water and put what we took out into the new tank (which was 5 gallons) I'm going to take his algae covered plants and put them in the new tank closer to the time of moving him. (Don't want to take away his hiding spots yet) Hubby wants to get "test fish" before we drop him in. The tank has been sitting, filter running, for 2 days. The water is 68 degrees (same as his current tank)

Am I doing everything right for his new home?
When is it safe to move him?
What kind of test fish should we get?

Yes, we've grown really attached to this stupid fish!

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 13 Feb 2006, 15:11

If you can, I would advise that you move the filter from the small tank to the bigger one. That way you get the advantage of transferring some "good bacteria" that live in the filter over to the new tank. Even better, if you can, is to squeese some of the filter media into the new tank. This will make the water look cloudy for a bit, but will help establish the needed bacteria in the new tank.

Test-fish will only be good if you are 100% sure that they are healthy and do not carry any decease or parasites.

Here's what I'd do:
Take a decent amount of water out of your current tank, into a bucket or similar. Then catch the Bullhead and put it in the bucket. Move all rocks, gravel and water remaining in the small tank into the bigger tank. Then fill it up with same amount of tap-water (dechlorinated of course). Once you've done this, release the fish in the new tank. After a day or two, fill the tank up to the usual level.

That way, it won't be different from a large water-change for the fish.

Info on Black Bullhead:

--
Mats

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 14 Feb 2006, 02:46

Well, hubby got impatient... "Penny" is now in his new home and I think he hates it, or maybe just the other things swimming around in there with him. It is a possibility, considering he hasn't been with other swimmy things in 2 years! Those pesky little goldfish just won't leave him alone either! We took advice and put a very large portion of his water, and a bit of the old gravel in the tank and also moved his filter to the tank. I dropped a few cheap goldfish and feeders in there (hehe to let him have some fun)
A photographer I am not! But here he is.
Old Tank

New Tank... isn't it pretty?!?

I'll spare you the picture of him with the feeder fish.

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 14 Feb 2006, 08:56

Great looking little chap.

I would lay off the food for about a week, as you may experience an ammonia or nitite spike after changing tanks.

Also I would add some pots or pipes for him to hide in.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 14 Feb 2006, 11:51

Thank you!!! However I don't know what happened over night... We got a fat belly again!! I counted all the other fish in the tank and he's been nipping at them, but none of them are gone. The one he got last night (a small feeder) he just killed and I scooped it out of the tank. I did not feed them last night, I figured they all had enough algae from the plants that were transfered from his old tank to the new tank to get them through the night. (yes they were covered in nice green strings of healthy algae

) Could he have vacuumed up a rock scavanging for food?

If so, will he be alright with a rock in his belly?

He does have a sheltered place in a corner behind three fake plants placed very close together. He's been hiding there whenever the light is on. I'm going to have my kids collect some more big rocks for him as soon as the snow melts.

Here's his fat belly.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 14 Feb 2006, 12:03

I can't say what the fish ate, but it's certainly eaten something pretty substantial... Hopefully it goes down. I doubt that it's gravel, as most fish can tell the difference (although they will try to eat gravel if you drop bits of grave into the tank).

Getting something for the fish to hid under will make it feel much more happy in it's new home, particularly with all that light gravel. A flower-pot (broken or whole) will make a good hiding space for the fish.

There's something looking like danios or minnows in the tank, are you sure that's not what he ate?

--
Mats

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 14 Feb 2006, 12:22

His tank mates are..
6 medium size goldfish, 8 little feeder goldfish, and 2 irredescent sharks. (I know, not good but try telling a 10 year old he can't have sharks after you took his fish out of his room)

He swam around last night with a feeder in his mouth, but he didn't eat it, he just killed it. I scooped the dead feeder out. My daughter got upset and so we rescued a feeder and put it in the African Dwarf frog tank. LOL So that left 8 feeders. I took a head (and tail) count this morning... everyone is accounted for.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 16 Feb 2006, 01:41

I am happy to report that his belly went down and he is back to normal. We haven't figured out what happened. He is still adjusting to the tank but is coming out more frequently.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 24 Feb 2006, 00:37

A week later...
I am cursing my husband for the test fish!!!
I told him that it was not recommended but...
Ok, out of 6 goldfish, 4 goldfish delevoped black spots on them and were immediately moved to the other tank. One of them died the others are frequently lying on the bottom of the tank. I noticed white dots (Ich?) on the other 2 goldfish and the irridecent sharks and have removed them as well. The feeder fish (comets?) appear to be fine... except for the 2 that are missing. LOL I think someone had a snack.
Ok, here's the next thing. The catfish has been "standing" on his tail fin with his body propped up against the side of the tank and the plants. *odd look*
My questions are these..
First and most importantly, I have removed the "sick" fish, what is the next step in preventing the cat fish from catching whatever the goldfish have?
Should I take the feeder fish out as well?
Should I treat his tank? If so, with what?
I really don't want to lose this guy even though he is really not appearing to be sick. Any advice will be followed and sheared with hubby since he doesn't listen anyway. Thank you in advance.

Post by **Silurus** » 24 Feb 2006, 02:43

Does the catfish have a place to hide? I have seen bullheads (and other catfish) in the position you describe when they are placed in a tank without hiding spaces.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 26 Feb 2006, 18:16

Decided to start a new thread.
New tank (2 weeks old)
2-1/2 year old black bullhead.
Hubby put test fish into the new tank to "cure" the tank.
6 goldfish, 2 irridecent sharks, and 10 comets.

I saw symptoms of illness and have moved ALL but the bullhead and the comets (they look fine and were acting fine).
4 of the 6 goldfish and both irridecent sharks have died from illness that I suspect is ich.

Now, the comets and bullhead look fine but they are acting weird. I caught them flicking themselves along the gravel and the bullhead has taken to staying close to the filter tube. Is this early signs of ich? what should I do?
I'm going out today to get a new test kit and will give you results when I have them. I do have Stabilty on hand.

coelacanth · Post by **coelacanth** » 26 Feb 2006, 20:57

Fish with impaired gill efficiency (such as when they have a parasitic infection) may stay near to a filter outflow, as in the wild flowing water would normally carry more oxygen.
The flicking is also potentially a symptom of (amongst other things) a parasitic infestation.
However, fish will also do these things in response to water quality problems.
You should be testing for Ammonia and Nitrite at this stage, and using a filter bacteria "starter" liquid. It woudl also be an idea to have a pH test kit.

Aside from this, Goldfish and Black Bullheads are not suuitable tankmates, and "Iridescent Sharks" (Pangasius catfish) are not suitable tank inhabitants full stop (unless you have a huge aquarium).

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 26 Feb 2006, 23:13

All the stores I went to today were out of the test kits!! I did pick up a bottle of Quick Cure and I do have a bottle of Stability. I haven't used either as of yet. I am waiting for my neighbor to come home to see if she has a test kit that I could use. I am hoping that the quick cure is safe to use on the bullhead.
The iridecents have died, (white spots) the golfish arent looking too good. I'm not gonna waste my time on them. They are in a seperate tank.
The comets are flicking themselves all over the place. The bullhead is more active and acting itchy.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 27 Feb 2006, 11:16

I'm always wary of using medecines without knowing that it's certainly a cure. You can get rid of ich without medecines (but it's not quite as "easy"). Check the bottle to see if it says that it's safe to use on "Scale-less fish". This is catfish among other things.

I'd probably add the recommended doze of Stability, just in case - it's most likely harmless.

As coelecanth said, you need to check the water quality - nitrite particularly will impede the fish's breathing. Check if any of your local shops are able to do a water test for you - they usually can, and will, test water for customers. Make sure you tell them that you want numbers, not just "it's good" or "it's bad". You want at the least:
Nitrate
Nitrite
Ammonia

pH is also kind of useful, but usually if you have the results of the above, it's either OK or not OK anyways, but the pH will affect how bad the ammonia reading is [it SHOULD be zero, but if it isn't, the pH will indicate if it's ].

I also agree with coelecanth about the suitability if Pangasius spp. in aquariums. Most grow well beyond what's even remotely suitable for home-aquaria, and even publich aquaria would have a difficulty housing some of the larger species like . They should not be imported...

--
Mats

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 28 Feb 2006, 01:45

Ok, my local Petsmart will test the water for me. My neighbor told me this and she would know. (She has about 5 HUGE goldfish happily swimming in her 20 gallon tank!!! By huge I mean a HUGE 8-10 inches each!!! And they are healthy!) I am worried about his water because it is a bit cloudy looking. I have been using the Stability in it for the last 2 days (Started after my last post). Will this clear it up?
The bullhead is not looking too well. He's been hiding in his usual spot in the dark back corner of the tank behind his plants. I wish he would come out more so that I can get a better look at him.

Hubby fed him and said he ate well and it is very visible that he ate.
I noticed some white dots on his fins last night and put a light dose of the quick cure in there. They say it is safe for scaleless fish but it really stressed him out and I'm not sure if I want to repeat the dose. So how do you cure Ich without medications? My husband is getting annoyed with my efforts in saving this fish, but I really don't want to lose this guy. My 10 yr old son would be crushed! (Ok, ok, so would I) Especially since it's OUR fault!! The bullhead was doing just fine in the old 20 gallon tank that was in my son's room and we probably should've left well enough alone, but we didn't.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 28 Feb 2006, 09:54

Ok, let's start from the back: there's no doubt that this fish would NOT do well in a 20g tank forever. You'd have to move it at some point or another. That's clear.

In hindsight, it may have been a good idea to start off by maturing the water in the tank with a couple of goldfish, and getting it properly matured (like 6-8 weeks or so - it takes longer to mature the tank when the water is cooler).

As to cloudy water, that's generally a sign that the tank is not mature.

Try reducing the food a bit - that will reduce the waste, which will reduce the stress on the fish caused by the pollutants that the fish produce. Once you have the beneficial bacteria going, you should be OK to increase the feeding a bit. Fish will survive a LONG time with little or no food, but they can quite easily die from the stress caused by "dirty" water. Water changes will help here too.

As to ich-removal without medication, there's two things you can do: add salt - not a good idea with catfish, or raise the temperature. Combine this with vigorous gravel-cleaning and lots of water changing. Do a search on "Ich" in the forums, and you should come up with plenty of different suggestions. Look at the advice written by Barbie for example, and you'll get a better idea of what I'm suggesting. But, very important, make sure there's plenty of water movement, an extra airstone would definitely help a lot here.

--
Mats

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 01 Mar 2006, 01:03

*sits on her hands so she doesn't put anything into the tank*
I'm gonna hate myself for admitting this, but I think my husband may be right. He thinks I'm reading way to far into this and stressing myself out for nothing. I never really noticed the behavior of this fish before because he has been in my son's room. The only time I really watched him was in the morning for a few minutes after I fed him. Hubby thinks I'M the one stressing the fish by constantly watching him now that he is in the living room! I have stopped watching him and he seems to be normal! LOL
We have, however, lost the 4th of 6 six goldfish in the old tank. The last 2 aren't looking so good and I suspect they will be getting the proper "swirly" soon.
I will not be feeding the catfish tonight... If he gets hungry, he has feeders in the tank with him that he can easily eat.

I am going to try to raise the temperature and keep the light off for him. Hopefully this will get him through to the weekend when I'll have time to do a partial water change. I'll keep you updated. Thanks for the help.

LindaVamp · Post by **LindaVamp** » 14 Mar 2006, 20:51

He's not looking good at all. Lethargic, but still eating. Hiding, but still coming out to say "hi" to me when I get close to the tank.

He has lesions all over him.

that are getting worse by the day.

I'm taking a new sample of water up to the pet store this afternoon when the kids get home from school and hubby is at work. Is there anything else I should pick up while I'm there? Aside from what I need pending results from the water tests.

Here's what I was thinking of doing and please stop me if I'm wrong!!!

My son has an African Dwarf Frog. It's tank was filled using the OLD water from the 20 gallon tank (before we even had the 55 gal. tank) Should I take the frog out of the 1 gallon tank it is in now and put the catfish in the 1 gallon tank with his OLD water that we knew was good until I get this new tank stabilized for the catfish

Help Please!

Delaware Canal Catfish

Wow! It's been almost 2 years!

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