Ethics of Selling Creatures

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 14 Jan 2006, 18:48

I have been raising African cichlids for over 15 years and I had an interesting situation
that happened to me last night and I wanted some opinions.

My girlfriend and 5 year old son returned from Wal-Mart last night with a hermit crab.
My son was excited but did anyone stop to think about the crab? It was sold in a very small
plastic container with a bit of damp gravel for $5. I asked my girlfriend if she bought any
food for the crab and she said no. I asked if she knew how to properly car for the animal
and she said no. Did Wal-mart give her any instructions or information on caring for this crab?
Again the answer was no. My problem with this is the ethics of selling someone a live
animal who has no idea of how to take care of it. I told my girlfriend that she had made a
poor decision. I also wonder who is worse, the person who buys such an animal or the
store that simply sells live animals for profit with no thought given to the well being of
the creature. I know my son pressured her into buying the crab but if someone would
have consulted me first, I would have recommended against the purchase.

The second part of my issue is what should I do now? If I make them return
the crab then I'll be the "bad guy" and everone will say I'm being a total jerk.
The thing is that I have no idea how to care for a hermit crab myself and my
daily fish routine takes too much of my time already. I know I can find information
on the web but space and time limitations concern me besides I don't want to inherit
the responsibility of caring for an animal that I would have never purchased in the
first place.

The other choice would be to keep the crab and do the best I can to keep it alive. It's just that
I have the feeling that it will not live very long and who knows what abuse and neglect it has
already suffered. I hate to watch an animal slowly fade away and die but maybe that would be a
good lesson for my son and girlfriend to understand why we should not buy a pet with out
first doing our "homework" and researching the proper housing and care of the species
we wish to keep.

I would never sell a fish to someone that didn't have an aquarium. I also have refused to
sell fish to people that I felt were going to put them into a bad environment. For me
it's not about the money, it's about the proper care and treatment of my fish. Why would I
spend months raising fry just to sell them to anyone that has $5 in their pocket?

I would appreciate any comments that the "Planet Catfish" members wish to contribute.
The members here come from all over the world and everyone's opinions will help
me to make a final decision in what I've found to be a complicated matter.

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 14 Jan 2006, 19:33

Can't help you with the ethics very much.

it's a hard decision.

I CAN help you with that crab, however; I've kept a few landhermitcrabs for some time.

In the wild they live near beaches or even inland in jungles and drink from rainpuddles. they're fruiteaters, scavengers, seed-eaters and the like.

You can keep it in a mediumsmall fishtank or terrarium with wet sand or gravel, and a low-edged waterbasin. A rough-edged terracotta bowl with edges about 1" high is fine. if it isn't too smooth, the crab easily climbs in and out to drink and bathe.
the water can be fresh, or just a little brackish. these critters only return to sea to breed, and they can drink freshwater without any issues.
substrate can be fine gravel or sand; not too thick, because then it can become a "dirttrap", you may need to replace it now and then.
it should be kept quite moist, imagine building up a tiny mangrove-swamp for your citter and you get a fairly good setup.

the footprint of a tank for only 1 should be 1 square foot or so max!
unlike fish, animals like this one do better when kept "tarantula-style", wich means a smaller, easy to clean tank with some branches and a cave is much better than a huge paludarium where it gets lost, entangled or starved......

the air-temperature should be about 22-26'C, you can archieve this by lighting the 'terrarium' with a common small bulb. ofcourse any special bulb made for lizards and the like (wich has UV, IR and more in the spectrum) is better. you should switch it off at night (use a timer, like the one on the fishtank).

it'll love to climb (warning! they're escape artists), and is quite good at it, despite lugging the shell along.
getting way up in a tropical tree to scavenge on fruit is a Hermits' bread & butter

You can add bits and pieces of uncooked eggshell in the tank on the substrate (as with chickens!), it will actually eat them to strengthen their armour. also, if you ever find bits of shed skin, do NOT remove those....crustaceans eat their old skin to strengthen the new one.
empty shells are also needed, when a Hermit molts, it needs a slightly bigger shell than the old one.

the food can also be laid in a small bowl. it loves bits and pieces of fruit and veggies, and also, it'll LOOOVE pellets and granules suitable for fish and pleco's.....
mine would pick up Wardley's pleco-tabs in their pinchers and nibble on those

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 14 Jan 2006, 20:12

Thanks for the information. I put the crab in a standard 10G aquarium last night with
a water bowl and about an inch of gravel. I offered it some shrimp pellets and a piece
of honeydew melon but so far it has no interest in eating. Are you saying that the gravel
in the aquarium should always be damp? I did put a flourescent hood with an aquarium bulb
on the tank and the hood only has a couple of small openings in it which can be easily covered.
Temp is 70Â° F (21Â°C) which I felt was a little cold and you seem to have confirmed that.
Do you think the crab is just stressed for now and will start eating in a day or so?
It seems to be very active but that's the part I feel bad about because it just seems to be
crawling around the edges trying to escape.

coelacanth · Post by **coelacanth** » 14 Jan 2006, 20:22

I think that you should bite the bullet, explain to your son that you don't know how to care for it properly and it might die without proper care, that sometimes we can be better people by thinking about what is the "right thing" to do (etc. etc.), and offer to buy him something special called a "catfish" (see, good way of sneaking in some decent Synos or something!). Take the Hermit Crab back and find the cretin who sold it without first checking that the buyers knew how to care for it, then use one of his legs (the cretin's not the Hermit Crab's) to beat the manager of the store senseless for employing dullards.
There are some good land/freshwater crustacean sites out there, might be worth checking them out to see if there's any husbandry info on this species.
Pete

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 14 Jan 2006, 20:59

I spoke with the manager of the store already to make sure that he knew my point of view
and to verify that the crab could be returned without a problem and of coarse the manager
said "no problem". I'm also returning a new coffee pot that makes the worst tasting coffee
I've ever had in my life and that was also "no problem".

My son just wants a pet that he can actually touch. He loves our fish but he can't pet them.
The whole pets in general issue is a touchy situation at our house. First of all, I'm allergic
to cats, and althought I like cats I simply can't tolerate them because of my allergies.
Second, I had to give up my German shepherd to live in the apt. we live in. The latest
tenant persuaded the landlord to let them have a cat and now they have 3 and I'm not
to happy about giving my greatest companion away to have the landlord change his mind
about dogs and cats in the building later. My girlfriend and son both love cats and they can't
understand why I'm forced to say "no way" but I'm suffering already from the cats downstairs
and my immune system can't take 4 cats. Part of the problem is also that my family
thinks I'm an over-bearing beast that makes rules out of my own convenience, however,
I feel I'm fair, I make my rules based on common sense, and someone has to be in charge
or we would live in total chaos.

coelacanth I must say that I agree with you and my family is going to have a big sit down discussion tonight.

Fish Demon · Post by **Fish Demon** » 14 Jan 2006, 21:46

You might try a docile arachnid, such as an Emperor Scorpion or a Rosehair Tarantula. These are actually great pets for kids as they tolerate being held and even petted (though not too rough as they have fragile bodies), and they are extremely easy to care for. Several scorpions can be kept in a 10 gallon tank, but the tarantulas should be kept alone in a smaller enclosure.

If your girlfriend or son doesn't like arachnids, you could try a small snake. Small Boas I have found to be most suitable for children, namely Rosy Boas and Sand Boas. Both of these are small, extremely docile species that can be kept in a 20 gallon long tank. They will almost always accept frozen mice, which is good if you are squeamish about giving them live food.

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 14 Jan 2006, 22:17

I had considered all three before (spiders, snakes, and scorpions). I also have seen some
very interesting rats which I know my son would love but their life span is so short I'm
afraid I'll get attached to them and then they will only live about 2 years (maybe a little longer).

I think we (my family) made a mutual agreement to return the crab and then, of coarse, my girlfriend
had to remind me of what's going to happen to the crab back at the store. I guess that's
why I wrote this post in the first place. It's kind of like putting a red-tailed catfish or an
Acanthicus adonis in a 20G aquarium. It's not fair to the creature to live in less than desirable conditions
and we all need to think about that. If we only sell creatures for profit without considering
their needs then we are making a huge mistake.

pictus_man_77 · Post by **pictus_man_77** » 14 Jan 2006, 22:31

I think youve said how basically everyone feels on this site.
You obviuosly chose the right thing to do by taking back the crab!
i think your son may enjoy a small fish, like a goldfish, or a Turantula ( i cant remember if thats how you spell it)

Maybee you could even get some sea monkeys, or even Triops for him!

(im 14, and im still fascinated by Sea Monkeys and Triops!!)

coelacanth · Post by **coelacanth** » 14 Jan 2006, 23:58

Jackster wrote:I also have seen some
very interesting rats which I know my son would love but their life span is so short I'm
afraid I'll get attached to them and then they will only live about 2 years (maybe a little longer)

Besides teaching kids about respect for life, responsibilities, compassion and all the other aspects of keeping animals alive, pets also teach kids about grief and loss, very important lessons for later in their own lives.

I'll put in another vote for Sand Boas, they are weird, "handleable", easy to care for, and being exotic they can help teach kids about other parts of the world which will help them understand more about those places.

I'd still go and find the cretin who sold the crab though...

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 15 Jan 2006, 00:43

Well as what usually happens around my house at the last minute my girlfriend backed
out on returning the crab and the excuse was my son's feelings combined with the fact
that the crab was sure to die in the hands of Wal-Mart or some other uninformed family.

I think there are far more reaching issues here than just the crab but for now I will use
any advice on caring for it properly as I will do my best to keep it alive and healthy.
The only thing I'm really mad about is the fact that somehow I still ended up being
the jerk in the end?

I hope Hermie likes his new home in the tropical regions of "The Frozen Tundra".

Phathead6669 · Post by **Phathead6669** » 15 Jan 2006, 00:54

I think the main issue here is Wal-Mart. The owners of Wal-Mart have no ethics and are trying to make as much money as possible. They hire immigrants and pay them less than minimum wage and won't let them work full-time hours so they can get benefits.

As for the hermit. I think the crab would have a better chance of living with your son than Wal-Mart. I have Wal-Mart staff with there fish and ya I try to not watch them anymore.

A hermit crab is probably and good pet for you son to start learning how to care for another living specie. I'm sure you can find a bit of time to help him with it. Think of it a quality Father/Son time. I have a daughter myself, 3yrs old, and we will sit and watch my fish. She helps me feed them and stuff.

snowball · Post by **snowball** » 15 Jan 2006, 02:27

Jackster wrote:Well as what usually happens around my house at the last minute my girlfriend backed
out on returning the crab and the excuse was my son's feelings combined with the fact
that the crab was sure to die in the hands of Wal-Mart or some other uninformed family.

It would seem that now is the chance for your son to bite the bullet and start learning the pleasures and responsibilities of looking after a small creature himself (with a little help from dad of course). All the best for little Hermie, I've not kept them but sidguppy's advice seems spot on. In fact it almost makes me want to go and rescue some myself!

Post by **Marc van Arc** » 15 Jan 2006, 09:12

Jackster wrote:The only thing I'm really mad about is the fact that somehow I still ended up being
the jerk in the end?

I know what you mean.
But are you? You've discussed this thouroughly. How many people would just say no and leave it at that?
I think you did a great job. The conclusion may not be to your satisfaction, but alas. Just regard this as a new challenge for your kid and help him out when needed.
As stated before by several other members, this case has many learning points, which may become positive experiences.
The only negative one I can think of is that from now on you'll have to do the shopping

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 15 Jan 2006, 10:07

You might try a docile arachnid, such as an Emperor Scorpion or a Rosehair Tarantula. These are actually great pets for kids as they tolerate being held and even petted (though not too rough as they have fragile bodies), and they are extremely easy to care for

While I agree on the docile temperament and the easy to care for in both Emperor-scorps (Pandinus imperator) and Rosehair Tarantula's (Grammostola rosea), I strongly advice against ANYONE "petting" them!

American Tarantula's ALL have a defense-mechanism, wich is their hairs.....the hairs have the same effect as nettles, but worse; when stuck to the fingers nothing happens, but once you rub your eyes, pick your nose or something (and we're talking about kids here!), you're in for immedeate hospital-treatment IF you're a kid, and a anaphylactic shock if you're allergic......

several species can stridulate the abdomen with their hindlegs, a fine cloud of minute hairs spreads in the direction of the 'attacker'. Even some individuals of the Rosehair show this behaviour, and there's no telling beforehand if you buy a mildmannered one.
this is called "hairkicking", you might check on it.

Some species like Theraposa leblondi (the Goliath or Giant Tarantula) have a very bad reputation of being a hairkicker.

Handling Tarantula's can be done (with Rosehairs for example), but NEVER touch the upper abdomen or 'pet' it....just let it walk on the hand if you really want to do it, to get kids used to spiders or to get rid of a phobia.

O yes, and ALWAYS wash your hands after handling one; just in case.

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 15 Jan 2006, 17:04

Jackster,
It sounds like you're handling this as well as possible. I won't go into detail about my feelings towards Walmart. They aren't kind and I don't think this is the place for my feelings about Walmart.

Could you think of the Hermit Crab as a "rescue?" Maybe teach your family what a rescue is and the value of it? I know you need to talk to them about impulse purchasing of pets which is a bad habit. But, maybe this could also turn into a good lesson for your family, too. Just a thought. You aren't a jerk. She was giving into the impulse to purchase something that was living. Maybe she thought since you know about fish, you'd know all about Hermit Crabs?
Amanda

troi · Post by **troi** » 15 Jan 2006, 22:06

coelacanth wrote:
Jackster wrote: I'd still go and find the cretin who sold the crab though...

I understand the feeling but I feel for the cretin. Walmart is bad about selling inappropriate pets but they are very good about taking them back.

Without thinking I bought two "irridescient sharks" that the store sticker said grew to 12", which I can handle. Then I did my research (yeah, dumb) and found out that the fish gets a bit bigger than I am if kept well. Duh. Returned the fish. I did explain the problem, complete with fishbase printout and pix, to the fish dept at the store and to everyone within in earshot but it won't make a difference.

These "cretins" at wal mart are working there because they need the jobs. Ppl don't work at Walmart because they have high tech options or MBAs. Here, they have families to feed and no other job market. The store keeps ppl alive and, in this case, has actually kept the town from completely dying. And, at my Walmart, the guy in the fish dept deplores that he has no info (not everyone has internet access or libraries handy) and the fish he sells die but he can't help. I use it as an opportuhity to teach.

Some other smuck in the dept called security on me when I explained to him that floating bettas in a 65 deg. Goldfish tank was not good for the fish, so I got to talk with security and the district manager about the fish and finding what they need. We had a great time.

As for the kid and the crab, I would keep the crab and use it as a starting point to teach about a lot of things, like books, talking to ppl, how to ask the right questions, responsibility in taking on a pet and so forth. A crab is not that hard to keep.

We are not going to change the marketing habits of the dreaded WalMart, but we can teach as we go and talk to local and district managers.

BTW, wiht no real LFS around here, I go to the other hated chains and have found here in NM that they take good care of the fish, have GREAT goldies and the help either informed or willing to learn. shocked me!

troi

Politely · Post by **Politely** » 16 Jan 2006, 01:29

Please don't take offense at the following, because it's not meant as a rebuke or criticism, it's just some additional thoughts.

You can't discuss the issues here without examining the fact that our hobby is based on a huge number of animals being exploited and/or killed. The experienced aquarist contributes to it - much more than the casual keeper. Without the demand, these animals wouldn't be in the market place (and sometimes driven to endangerment or extinction).

We all start somewhere - usually by killing a bunch of fairly commonly available fish (probably captive bred) and then graduating to killing exotic new hard-to-find and oh-so-delicate-and-difficult-to-keep species (imported, of course). I think it's the rare hobbyist who contributes back to the gene pool more than they've taken - and almost never back to the wild. Note that even if the hobbyist hasn't personally killed any fish (are there any that can make this boast?), each fish purchased is usually a survivor from a pool of many that have died on their way to the home tank.

To require people to fully understand their animals before they purchase them sounds good in theory, but completely impractical and undesirable. I wonder how many of us would be willing to submit to a test and a home inspection before being allowed to take an pet home.

I don't know if there's a "right" answer here, but it's probably not fair to blame Walmart and inexperienced salespeople/purchasers without taking a look at what we do & cause, too. However, I do think this is a great opportunity to research and learn together with your son, and maybe even discuss some of the issues with your son. I've found that children even as young as yours can be engaged by learning about the animal and possibly the issues you've raised here. This purchase could turn out to be the basis of a lot of learning and sharing.

Good luck with your new pet

-P

Caol_ila · Post by **Caol_ila** » 16 Jan 2006, 05:49

Hi!

Have you thought about some easy to keep, small turtle? My girlfriend also has animal-allergies and so we have a 120cm tank with two Sternotherus odoratus - stinkpot or common musk turtle in english I think. You could keep one easily in a 80 litres and the big plus is that they dont need the UV that day active turtles need.
If you buy a baby youll have a lovely pet to look at. Taking it on your hand scares them a big deal and most have parasitic worms so not very adviseable for a little kid to grab.

Just an idea for a long living pet. Age estimates are between 25-55 years afaik.

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 17 Jan 2006, 04:55

This has been a great discussion! I have some comments.

First I did not want this to be a bash Wal-Mart post but I do have an opinion.
Wal-Mart hurts any local economy. They provide mostly lower paying part time jobs with no
benefits while eliminating smaller businesses that provide higher paying jobs.
The end result is a net loss in jobs for any given community and an increased tax
burden for that same community due to low income workers with no health insurance
that must be supplied by the state at the cost of taxpayers.

I obviously have killed a few fish but my basic system is to spawn as many species as I can
so that fish taken out of the wild are minimized. I currently have 5 wild fish and I will agree
that we all have to consider what we take out of the wild. IMO catfish, especially plecos,
have been over-caught and exploited, so yes, we as advanced fish keepers can be
contributing to the problem if we do not think carefully about what we are buying.

troi · Post by **troi** » 17 Jan 2006, 05:16

Jackster wrote: First I did not want this to be a bash Wal-Mart post but I do have an opinion.
Wal-Mart hurts any local economy. They provide mostly lower paying part time jobs with no
benefits while eliminating smaller businesses that provide higher paying jobs.

In general, I would agree with your comments on WalMart in particular and the part-time, low pay chains in general. In my town, however, when the mines closed the bottom fell out of the economy and there were no jobs. Walmart did hurt a few of the remaining family businesses, but those didn't hire many ppl. Walmart and the prisons brought jobs. Without them, there would not be much of a town remaining. The illiteracy rate here is 35% so WalMart is a good job to some people. Without walmart, we would have to drive 50-90 miles for simple things like kitchenware or clothes. The other food or clothing stores are also chains, discount chains or franchises.

It really hurts me to stick up for Walmart, but in a small out-of-the-way town, it is your friends and neighbors who work there and you are glad they have a job and a warm place to stand.

Not many employers pay benefits if you don't have a degree or a high school education. Low wage, no benefit at walmart is no different from low wage, no benefit at the locally owned diner or LFS. It is small business owners they hurt more than the ppl who they employ--here, anyway.

troi

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 17 Jan 2006, 14:40

In the situation you describe I can see the positive side so I will agree with you.
I do believe that this situation is also an "exception to the rule" from the majority of instances.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 17 Jan 2006, 15:38

I'd like to drag this away from the "WalMart is evil/no it isn't" back to the original ethics of selling creatures that the buyer has little or no information, and sometimes also isn't particularly a good candidate for almost anyone.

My example would be one of the local FS, that have around 8 or so small Red Tail Catfish. Labeled as growing to 100cm (40")... They aren't exactly cheap (3" ones at US $60, bigger ones around $100), but it's still nothing compared to the cost of keeping this fish in a decent sized heated pond. As far as I can tell, there's no way the average person can possibly keep one of these fish to proper adult size. I met one of the staff from my favourite local shop in this shop, and we discussed the fact, and his conclusion was that "It doesn't make sense to sell these like this". I doubt the general staff in the shop with the RTC would actually KNOW what the requirements for this fish is, aside from the basic data stated on the sheet by the tank.

And by the way, someone said "Find the cretin that sold the hermit crab" - well, as far as I know, WalMart generally doesn't have staff serving people. Most likely, there's just a stack of these little boxes with crabs in them, sitting on a shelf for the customer to put in their shopping cart. No staff there to "ask" if the customer knows what they are doing. So there's really no person TO FIND.

--
Mats

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 17 Jan 2006, 22:01

MatsP wrote:And by the way, someone said "Find the cretin that sold the hermit crab"
- well, as far as I know, WalMart generally doesn't have staff serving people.
Most likely, there's just a stack of these little boxes with crabs in them, sitting on
a shelf for the customer to put in their shopping cart. No staff there to "ask" if the
customer knows what they are doing. So there's really no person TO FIND.

--
Mats

Well Mats you're not far off but that's the whole point. The ethics of putting a small
crustacean in a very small round plastic container with no food or heat source.
This amounts to what I would call cruelty. Then setting it out on the counter for a
curious little boy to beg mom to buy for him. This is what I consider the unethical part.
Selling a creature for profit with no consideration about it's well-being. Then not even
providing so much as a simple data sheet with some basic instructions for proper care.

Doesn't it make you feel good to know that they sell guns too?

Just for the record the crab has not eaten anything since we purchased it. I have offered it
hermit crab pellets, dried krill, nori, algae wafers, and fresh fruit with no results. I have
no idea what conditions the crab was exposed to during transit and my concern is that
it was not fed and kept to cold for to long (just my own theory).

Does anyone know how often crabs eat? Some websites say to feed it everyday while
others seem to suggest that they only eat once every several days. I've been researching
as much as possible and I'm following all the suggestions for hermit crab care so if it doesn't
"make it" at least I tried.

Zebrapl3co · Post by **Zebrapl3co** » 17 Jan 2006, 22:42

I think I will start by appologizing for what I am going to say. But please do look outside your realm of existence and take a good look at the concept of ethics.
For god sakes it's only a crab and a very tiny one too. I eat their cousines for dinner all the time and they boil them live. They throw the crab in boiling water, shut the lid and keep something heavy on the lid to keep it from clibbing back out. The crab will trash around in the boiling water for the next 30 seconds or so. It gets quieter and quieter as the time ticks on. I don't like to be around when that happens, but I also accept the reality that the whole planet's been doing it ever since the human race existed.

True ethics it in not keeping any pets to satisfied our own lust for the hobby. Just because some people are kinder to their pets doesn't make they any morally better.
Take slavery for example, does a kinder master to his slaves means that he is in a higher moral ground? NO. If he free his slaves and encourage others to do so, then he will be.

So why don't you bit the bullet and you keep to your fish and your son keeps his crab.

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 17 Jan 2006, 23:37

I eat shellfish also but after all we do have to eat.

It's just a crab, one crab multiplied by how many my local store sold times how many
stores sell them. I have a feeling that it's a pretty big number. The real qustion is how
many actually survive. I wouldn't approve of any discount chain store or pet shop that
sells animals under similar conditions. I've watched fish come into my local Wal-Mart week
after week and then the next day nothing but lots of dead fish. Again no one at the store
is qualified to keep fish properly especially on a commercial level. The stupid part
is the type of fish they try to sell such as Angelfish for example. Our water is 8.3 PH,
24 dh GH, and 12 dh KH which basically translates into liquid rock. The majority of
species that are sold here are not well suited for this extremely hard water and they die.
Why keep making the same mistakes over and over?

Wal-Mart has also pushed out a total of 6 pet stores in the area over the last 15 years
that I'm aware of. These stores gave great customer service but could not compete with
Wal-Mart's cut throat pricing. Every time a pet store closed our Wal-Mart raised it's prices.
Then if a new one starts up, they lower prices to drive them out of business.
That's just wrong and some will say that it's just good business but I do not agree.
Do I have a chip on my shoulder? Maybe. I opened my own strictly aquarium store in
1994 and only survived for a few months. What did Wal-Mart do? Well their multi-tank
aquarium system was all but forgotten about. The tanks were filthy and no one even
bothered to take dead fish out of the tanks anymore. As soon as they noticed my new
shop they purchased an all new and larger system directed at putting me out of business.
Well I had landlord issues and dumped my store to sell fish out of my house (no overhead).

If you think Wal-Mart is a great company then buy some stock. If you think that under-selling
small specialized businesses is good for your local economy then what you really want
is a Wal-Mart SuperStore right in your home town (not mine).

Phathead6669 · Post by **Phathead6669** » 18 Jan 2006, 14:47

For god sakes it's only a crab and a very tiny one too. I eat their cousines for dinner all the time and they boil them live.

In china they eat Cats. So if you had a PET cat for many years you would eat it? An animal is an animal no matter size, sex, specie. Its one thing to go to the grocery store and buy live crab to eat(or lobster). But its another thing to go to a pet store and buy a Crab and eat it. One store is there to provide us food and another is there to provide us pets that after purchasing we have made the decision to except the responsibility to care and nurture the animal. If the store cannot provide proper, let alone any, information on the product they are selling then they should not be selling the product.(Animal and material products)