pls help me get rid of snails and have egg free plants

jojitsui · Post by **jojitsui** » 24 Oct 2005, 17:42

Ello can some1 help please, a few weeks ago i added live plants to my tank (which genville n

ac ripped up that nite and destroyed lol) i rinsed them before i put them in but now my tank is being over run by snails i have tried to pick them out but for every 1 i take out 2 more appear im at my wits end and am seriously considering using no snail chamicals which i really dont want to do. Does anyone no a organic way to keep them under control,
also does anyone know how best to get rid of snail eggs from live plants as i really want more plants but not if it means more snails
cheers joey x

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 24 Oct 2005, 17:53

If your tank is big enough, then consider some clown loach.

I also believe that doradids such as these (http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/do ... /166_f.php http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/do ... /313_f.php) may help, but i'm not entirely sure of how effective they are though.

Are these snails really a problem though? I always have a few in my tanks and they never get to epidemic proportions.

I would just leave them to it. they should also eat some of your algae.

jojitsui · Post by **jojitsui** » 24 Oct 2005, 18:17

Cheers for that i will have a look on net now to see if i can get info on how to care for clown roaches then mayb buy one 2moro or the day after

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 24 Oct 2005, 18:29

The other thing you can try is to put some courgette in the tank, using a teaspoon (or Screwcumber) to sink it. Once the snails find the courgette, remove courgeette with snails and dispose, then re-apply courgette.

Having some fish that eats small/medium snails always works. I've received snails the same way as you, bought plants with snail eggs, and I've removed snails with the above method, and I've also plopped a few snails into other tanks, because they are actually a good additional source of food for the fish.

It seems that only my original snail tank has a problem with snails growing in it, probably because it only has small fish in it, and the ancistrus can't really eat the snails once they grow beyond a certain size.

For example or species of Loricariidae are also able to eat snails, so a large specimen of that would be a good addition if you like them...

--
Mats

racoll · Post by **racoll** » 24 Oct 2005, 18:55

here's a link on clown loaches:

http://www.loaches.com/species_pages/bo ... nthus.html

You will need at least a four foot tank for these fish.

Having said that, my father has a pair in a 36" X 15" X 15", and at about 6" and twelve years old, they seem to have stopped growing.

Cool fish. I like them a lot. they make a really loud clicking noise when feeding.

jojitsui · Post by **jojitsui** » 24 Oct 2005, 20:42

That loach site is fab thank you. would i be able to keep either Leporacanthicus Joselimai or Pseudacanthicus leopardus with my 2 large common pl*cos??? (plus neons and angelfish) not sure the courgett would last long enough tho as its grenville's fav

. We are hoping to get a six foot tank in the next few weeks so i dont think space will be a problem but as the pl*cos are so big i would be worried about them either being hurt by another bottom dwelling fish or vice versa,
thanks for all your help joey x

djw66 · Post by **djw66** » 24 Oct 2005, 23:42

All the Botia species will eat snails; they concentrate on the softer-shelled young snails, eventually stopping the life cycle of the snails. There are several Botia that are smaller than clowns. Look for B. striata, B. lohachata, B. morleti - in other words, loaches that get no more than four inches long (striata about three inches). Botia do much better in species groups of six or more.

Another option is a freshwater puffer fish. They will absolutley decimate snails (then, of course, they will start on your other fish). But, if you want to get rid of snails, a puffer will certainly do the job.

Dave

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 25 Oct 2005, 00:41

All loaches will eat snails but some species are actually quite aggressive.
In my opinion and experience the best snail eater is the skunk botia.
In the past I would just keep one individual and move it from tank to tank.
Skunk botias are usually very inexpensive (at least in the USA).

djw66 · Post by **djw66** » 25 Oct 2005, 06:15

racoll wrote:here's a link on clown loaches:

http://www.loaches.com/species_pages/bo ... nthus.html

You will need at least a four foot tank for these fish.

Having said that, my father has a pair in a 36" X 15" X 15", and at about 6" and twelve years old, they seem to have stopped growing.

Cool fish. I like them a lot. they make a really loud clicking noise when feeding.

I've always had larger tanks (six feet and larger) and in spaces thus, clowns WILL get nearly a foot long in such spaces if properly cared for, which is why I suggest smaller Botia species as above. Your father's pair have stayed the same length because they have insufficient space to grow in a three-foot tank.

However, your dad obviously takes good care of his tank to have 12-year-old clowns. He can look forward to another 12 or so with them, as Botia can live a loooong time.

You should hear the racket when you have six or more Botia at feeding time

Dave

djw66 · Post by **djw66** » 25 Oct 2005, 06:28

jackster wrote:All loaches will eat snails but some species are actually quite aggressive.

Jackster,

Like Tiger Barbs, Botia are more aggressive when alone or in a very small group. I've kept eight species of Botia over the years, but always in groups of six or more per species, and have had no problems with aggression, even with B. hymenophysa or B. lecontei, which are quite picky when alone, especially when they get larger.

Dave

MDOU · Post by **MDOU** » 25 Oct 2005, 08:36

i stated a post like this on plecofanatics.com but my idea was to have dwarf chain loach eat my snails. i never (well at least not yet) got an answer to wether or not DCL would eat them or leave them be. so do anyone here know?

(oh god aint me good at english)

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 25 Oct 2005, 08:46

Like Tiger Barbs, Botia are more aggressive when alone or in a very small group

I agree.

single Botia's evolve in terrorists all too often, nipping or even killing fish.

and do NOT make the mistake for going minimal, 3 is NOT a group on Planet Botia; they will harass each other 24/7 and the agression can fly off the handle, you can easily end up with 1.

5 is the minimal number.

even so, some species are true dedicated snail-killers, but others get downright lazy and just wait for the regular food to come around.

this especially happens when you get a plague of MTS (Melanoides tuberculata); trumpetsnails.
these burrow and have an operculum; wich makes them a bit more of a challenge.
Botia's can handle them by eating all the young (livebearing snail), and/or harassing the adult snails to death (they have a very hard shell).

Good snail-eating Botia's IME:
-Botia macracantha (Clown)
-Botia striata (Striped Loach)
-Botia sidthimunki (Dwarf Loach)
-Botia modesta
-Botia morleti/horae (IME even in a full group, this one will go after the other fish

)
-Botia nigrolineata (this one looks like a giant sidthimunki)

Lazy bums wich quickly turn off eating snails and hang around till feeding time

-Botia eos
-Botia geto
-Botia almorhae/lohachata (Yoyo Loach)
-Botia hymenophysa and allies
-Botia dario

Haven't kept any other species yet

jojitsui · Post by **jojitsui** » 25 Oct 2005, 11:15

I can't thank you all enough for your help and advice not sure what to get yet will have to wait untill me n j can deside

. so untill then will just have to keep adding them to the bucket (don't want to kill them) so if anybody would like some baby snails free of charge just email me n you can glady have them.

Taratron · Post by **Taratron** » 25 Oct 2005, 11:54

When I had two Agaymysis pectinifrons and many banjo cats in my tank, I noticed a decrease in the snail population. I did remove the two A. pectinifrons because I want to plant the tank, so hopefully the banjos will keep the snails down to a minimum.

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 25 Oct 2005, 17:02

This is what I meant by aggressive species. This Botia beauforti is about 7 inches long and
has lived with many different species of African cichlids over the last 5 years. Not one fish
has ever challenged it's dominance and he (or she) has ruled my 55 gallon tank since the day
it was introduced. Even a 10 inch C. frontosa knew better than to mess with this one.

Before I had purchased this fish, I had kept a Botia helodes (Tiger loach)
in the same tank and, although I loved it, it was the meanest fish I have ever encountered.
Will putting a group of Tiger botias together minimize aggression?
I really don't think it will work. When I special ordered my Tiger loach (10 years ago) the store owner
shipped in a dozen or so. A few days after I picked out the one I wanted, the owner (a friend)
told me he was mad at me. I asked him why, what happened? He then went on to tell me that
all the Tiger botias were shredded to death except for one. I'm also sure the first Tiger I had would
still be alive today if it would not have undermined a large rock and crushed itself by accident.
One thing I can say for sure is that my 55 gallon tank is snail free!.

marktman · Post by **marktman** » 25 Oct 2005, 19:05

Get ya some dwarf puffers!! Best snail eradication that I can think of in such a small fish!! Only problem is that you have to remove the empty shells.

j4782 · Post by **j4782** » 25 Oct 2005, 19:11

All loaches will eat snails

Actually, I can think of 3 or 4 particular fish sold as 'loaches' that won't ever do a thing to snails: the dojo loach/weather loach/weatherfish, kuhlii loaches (there are several species), java/"black" kuhlii loach, and hillstream loach/Hong Kong butterfly "plecos."

Another alternative is the aggresive-when-underfed marisa cornuarietis or Giant Columbian ramshorn snail. http://www.applesnail.net/content/speci ... rietis.htm
Easy to tell apart from pest snails because they come only in gold or striped shells. They will hunt down the pest snails, which don't have trap doors, and eat them. Marisa have trapdoors. They started going after my clams yesterday. :/

I think a clown loach would be overkill. They will even crack open tough apple snails with trapdoors to eat them.

Too bad you're in the UK. Try offering those pest snails as puffer food on ebay or aquabid.

marktman · Post by **marktman** » 25 Oct 2005, 20:27

Nice websight on dwarf puffers.
http://www.dwarfpuffers.com/

djw66 · Post by **djw66** » 26 Oct 2005, 04:29

jackster wrote:This is what I meant by aggressive species. This Botia beauforti is about 7 inches long and
has lived with many different species of African c*****ds over the last 5 years. Not one fish
has ever challenged it's dominance and he (or she) has ruled my 55 gallon tank since the day
it was introduced. Even a 10 inch C. frontosa knew better than to mess with this one.
Before I had purchased this fish, I had kept a Botia helodes (Tiger loach)
in the same tank and, although I loved it, it was the meanest fish I have ever encountered.
Will putting a group of Tiger botias together minimize aggression?.

Jackster,
Nearly all Botia species are 'mean' when they are alone or in small (read less than six) groups, and they must be introduced together. Like most marine aquarium fish, a lone Botia views the aquarium its in as its own, thus will harass/kill any other Botia species you put in with it in defending its territory.

Marine Damsels used to cycle sw aquariums will harass and in short order kill any other fish you put in with them for the same reason.

If you do get B. helodes, get them in as large a group as you can afford (6+) and correctly house, and you shouldn't have aggression problems at all.

Nice looking beauforti you have there, but he'll be alone the rest of his days. He WILL NOT accept any other Botia, even in a group of a dozen.

I've kept groups of different species of Botia in larger aquariums, say B. dario, B. strata and B. modesta in 'schools' of six to eight or more, and as they were introduced together, there was no aggression at all, though you could hear the clicking all over the house when food hit the water (Botia dig bloodworms hard).

Dave

djw66 · Post by **djw66** » 26 Oct 2005, 04:34

j4782 wrote:
All loaches will eat snails
Actually, I can think of 3 or 4 particular fish sold as 'loaches' that won't ever do a thing to snails: the dojo loach/weather loach/weatherfish, kuhlii loaches (there are several species), java/"black" kuhlii loach, and hillstream loach/Hong Kong butterfly "pl*cos."

Which is why I said Botia species. Those you mention are not Botia species.

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 26 Oct 2005, 20:16

Agreed I should have said all Botias eat snails. But some people just have to pick apart other's posts.
Rather than contributing by answering the question at hand some must go around and try to
find fault with others and what can I say but that's a real waste of time.

I will take your advice on Botias (djw66), however, I think that your advice applies to many
types of tropical fish. Most just do not like their own kind so adding groups or keeping
in groups is really just common sense.

jojitsui · Post by **jojitsui** » 28 Oct 2005, 13:15

I cant thank you all enough for you advice, i think we have now decided to move the pl*cs & the neons in to the larger tank and buy some clown loach and keep the angelfish in the original tank but add more plants. hopefully i will be able to keep the snails numbers controlled by the loach and picking them off then (i dont mind a few just not the pile i have got now) thanks again every1 joey x

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 28 Oct 2005, 15:29

Sounds like you have a great plan that will work fine. Clown botias are very colorful and
IME also very peaceful. They don't always mix well with my African cichlids but your angelfish
(S. American cichlids) should be good tank mates.

jojitsui · Post by **jojitsui** » 28 Oct 2005, 15:42

the angle fish are not going into the same tank as the loach because i have read when they get bigger (they are only tiny now) they can hurt neons, the loach will be goin in to a planted tank with 2 common plecs and 12 neons, unless you think i should keep the neons in the smaller tank and put the angelfish n loaches 2gether . what do you think would be best??? tcheers joey x

Jackster · Post by **Jackster** » 28 Oct 2005, 18:31

I'm must have misunderstood. Well I think angels or clown loaches do have the potential
to harm neons when they get larger. Angels can be aggressive if they pair up and decide to spawn.
Clowns get pretty big and may pick on neons. Either way if all the fish are small and raised together,
they should tolerate each other well as they grow. Neons are rather delicate so keeping them
completely separate would be the safest but if you keep them with other species just make
sure you watch the situation closely.

djw66 · Post by **djw66** » 28 Oct 2005, 22:46

jojitsui wrote:the angle fish are not going into the same tank as the loach because i have read when they get bigger (they are only tiny now) they can hurt neons, the loach will be goin in to a planted tank with 2 common plecs and 12 neons, unless you think i should keep the neons in the smaller tank and put the angelfish n loaches 2gether . what do you think would be best??? tcheers joey x

You bet the angels will 'hurt' the neons; they are ideal prey organisms for angels, and are avid neon eaters when the angels grow to be young adults, ESPECIALLY if you put the angels in before adding neons. Adult angels will hunt neons if there is cover in the tank (plants, bog wood).

If you kept the angels with the botia, as long as the clowns aren't tiny (inch or less) you won't have any troubles. Botia can take care of themselves, and Angels normally ignore benthic fish that aren't bite sized.

Clowns can reach six inches in a year or so in a normal sized tank, considerable larger in a big tank (over 200 or 300 gallons), so they might snark up a sleeping neon or two at night, but they won't go out of their way to do so. You'd be better off either keeping a smaller species of Botia or a larger species of tetra, like lemons (six or more) or serpae and their kin, if you want to keep clowns for looks and snail patrol.

I'd watch to make sure the common plecs get enough appropriate foods, as they are quite capable of sucking up a sleeping neon when they get larger.

Dave

B-2 · Post by **B-2** » 30 Oct 2005, 01:03

I would leave the snails. They do a great job of eating algae, uneaten food, and dead plants

. I have a 50 gallon tank that is crawling with small snails. They appeared after I bought a plant. They are completely harmless and fun to watch. They multiply quickly but they never get bigger than a pea. They do not clog my filters or cause any other problems. I added some to my gold fish tank (a blue plastic barrel that I put outside in the summer) and they do a great job of keeping the algae under control. Before I put them in, the sides of the barrel were covered in thick algae. Now there is only a thin layer left. The older snails will naturally die off and new ones take their place. There is usually not enough food for all the snails so only some will live. That helps keep the population under control. Usually you will never have an over population of them. Most of the time the snails will be hidden in the gravel or on rocks and drift wood. They mill not block your view by sitting on the glass. My snails are rarely on the front glass. Snails are great in fry or quarentine tanks because they will eat uneaten food. Snails also make the tank look more natural. You will rarely find a lake, river, or pond without snails.

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 31 Oct 2005, 10:29

Bettinacharlotta,

The snails I've got tend to eat plants if there's nothing else to eat. Sure they eat algae, but with 80 small bristlenoses in the tank, I can guarantee that any algae that would potentially crop up will soon disappear, long before the snails get there [even if they move quite rapidly, the bristlenoses go quicker].

And they do produce the same ammonia-type muck as anyother aquatic animals, so they contribute to the bio-load in the system. Having LOADS of them will certainly cause a problem if you don't have something to control their spread. Of course, just about decent size fish will eat the snail-babies, so for instance the gold-fish pond will not get overgrown with snails. On the other hand, in a small-fish tank, like my baby-bristlenose tank, it does become a problem.

--
Mats

j4782 · Post by **j4782** » 01 Nov 2005, 15:23

Jackster, I wasn't trying to pick apart your post. I just wanted to point out loach species that would be no good for snail population control.

If your snails were eating plants, they were apple snails (p. caniculata, insularium, or haustrum), not the common physid or planorbid "hitchhiker" snails.

True, with the common "pest" snails you can control the population by making sure you don't overfeed. I believe physids might also cannibalize each other if they're hungry enough.

marktman · Post by **marktman** » 01 Nov 2005, 17:57

I'll say it again. Dwarf puffers. They don't get any larger than and inch and a half. Most only an inch. If you can't find any, send me a PM.

pls help me get rid of snails and have egg free plants

pls help me get rid of snails and have egg free plants

Harmless inhabitants