BN with ick?

j4782 · Post by **j4782** » 22 Oct 2005, 18:34

I'm just a little paranoid because yesterday, it appeared that my male BN had ick. White spots that were definitely not substrate stuck to him and his belly.

I turned up the heater to 80F. He seems to be shedding skin. There aren't as many spots this morning, but I have not seen his belly today.

comments, suggestions? I don't want to use Rid-ich+ or Ick Guard II because I'm trying to establish the tank.

Post by **Barbie** » 22 Oct 2005, 18:52

At the top of the forum is a post that says "before you post, read this". Could you do that please and answer all the questions in there? It sounds like your fish is probably getting ammonia burns, but it's hard to tell without any levels to guesstimate from. Cycling a new tank with plecos isn't usually a terribly successful or rewarding endeavor though, IME. Do you have other established tanks? Or just this one?

Barbie

j4782 · Post by **j4782** » 22 Oct 2005, 19:04

Sigh, no, none of tanks are established thanks to my mother's leaving soap in strange places.

Will do a water change. The water tests' not even done & the ppms are piling up.

Post by **Barbie** » 22 Oct 2005, 19:17

Until you get the tank established, DRASTICALLY reduce what you feed, seriously. Every bit of food becomes toxic to them as it becomes waste. They're literally living in their own raw sewage treatment plant at the moment. If you can find it, BioSpira by Marineland would help jumpstart this process for you. Otherwise, plan on very small feedings and very frequent small water changes for the next month

.

Barbie

j4782 · Post by **j4782** » 22 Oct 2005, 19:50

I DID add biospora about 36 hours ago. About 2/3 went into my 55, and the rest went into this 16 gal tank. Could it have expired? It was in a fridge at the store.

Added a different water conditioner that neutralizes ammonia & nitrites with the water change, so my tests are currently useless. Pre-change: off the chart for ammonia.

Thanks for the quick diagnosis, Barbie.

I have guppy, platy, & BN fry, so I'll probably cut back to just the babies for the next couple of days.

drpleco · Post by **drpleco** » 23 Oct 2005, 00:44

I agree that you're likely dealing with stress caused by poor water quality. FWIW, I have used biospira successfully to start up tanks, but it works only about as well as shaking an established filter into a new one.
Also, there's no substitute for lots of sq. inches of bio-media space for new bacteria to cling to. If you can, slow down your filter to allow the bacteria a better change at "grabbing" the media. A fast filter will flush a lot of the bacteria around the tank. This is especially important with a product like biospira.

For future reference, I've used mardel's coppersafe on BN's as small as 1" with no losses. Be patient, as it takes a while (1-2 weeks) to work, and DO NOT overdose.

Best of luck!

Andy

Azmeaiel · Post by **Azmeaiel** » 23 Oct 2005, 03:48

Hi, I had a small ick infestation on some BN when forced to do an emergency tank breakdown (discovered after an hour in the tank a new fish had camallanus even after being quarantine). Mine only had 2-10 spots of ick each. I carefully removd these with a cotton bud, re-acclimatised them to some 'clean' water then put them into the clean tank without getting any of the water from the container into the new tank, problem solved. It is a harder method But I have used it successfully on rams, BN, Cories, Guppy fry and very sensative loaches. It may sound stressing But I have had no deaths from the method as opposed to many deaths when using salt and copper treatments.Watch the fish for several days (usually about 7) and remove any spots before they have a chance to multiply.

Zebrapl3co · Post by **Zebrapl3co** » 23 Oct 2005, 07:14

Azmeaiel wrote:...Mine only had 2-10 spots of ick each. I carefully removd these with a cotton bud, re-acclimatised them to some 'clean' water then put them into the clean tank without getting any of the water from the container into the new tank, problem solved. It is a harder method But I have used it successfully on rams, BN, Cories, Guppy fry and very sensative loaches. ...

Hi, I've heard of this method before, and I just keep wondering. How long did you it take you do remove the ick from the fish? Actually, what I was wondering is, do you just grap the fish and start brush the ick off? How long can the fist stay out of the water?

Azmeaiel · Post by **Azmeaiel** » 23 Oct 2005, 14:38

I carefully caught the fish and placed it in a container of tankwater (about 1/3 full) still restrained in the net. it is best if the container is clear so you can see the ick spots. They are like tiny cysts that will fall off, sometimes with the lightest touch from a cotton bud, when removing I was carefully restraining the fish, in the net, in the water so I could still see the ick, then just lightly rubbed the ick untill it fell off (trying not to damage or rub nearby skin. some are persistant and hard to get off. once all ick was removed, the fish was released into its container, acclimatised to new tank water by floating container and slowly adding water from new tank. Then the fish is removed from the water in its container and gently released into its new tank, water in the container being thrown away to prevent ick spreading. The fish must then be constantly watched for the next week and any parasites removed before they can leave the host and infect the 'clean' tank.

It must all be done as quick and carefully as possible to minimise stress to the fish. Great care must also be taken not to damage the fishes skin or rub off any of its slime as you may end up with a bacterial infection as-well. For fish that can stand salt and/or higher temps, temp should be raised to 80 and salt added at 1tbs per 5 gal. Do a lot of research into the species you are treating as a lot wont tolerate this treatment (salt and high temp.

j4782 · Post by **j4782** » 23 Oct 2005, 22:03

It was suggested by someone on another board that packages of bio spira that are mishandled or exposed to high heat in transport can get to the store dead.

I think that's the case.

Checked the levels last night, did a water change, & this morning: Ammonia 2-4 ppm (slightly lower, but then again, my test jumps to 8 ppm,and that's as high as it goes), nitrites .25 ppm (no change), and nitrates 5-10 ppm (no change).

Have moved the male BM and the female to my 55, which is also supposed to have bio spira helping, but I figure, more water, the less likely the ammonia and nitrites will get so bad so fast.