my tank broke

DewDropPony · Post by **DewDropPony** » 12 Jul 2005, 19:58

I went away for three days and came home to find a empty tank and dead fish. The tank was on the second level of the house. It went through the bedroom floor and the liberary to the basement. The whole ceiling of the liberary is taken out. The carpeting in both rooms has to be redone. The furniture is messed up and so it the furniture in the basement. The walls have to be repainted. The drapes were taken down and I haven't even looked at them for water damage yet. The tv has water in it and the entertainment center and the french doors going to the liberary. Ironicly the only thing that didn't get damaged is the 55gal in the liberary below the tank that leaked. Our ensurance is covering it, but its going to cost thousands of dollars. Our house is new. They said it should take a month to fix it. But ordering new furniture is going to take longer than that soo.

Let this be a lesson to us all. I checked that tank the day I left and there were no leaks or cracks. The water level was fine. Never under-estimate your tanks.

sidguppy · Post by **sidguppy** » 12 Jul 2005, 22:14

tanks just don't crack or bust overnight because it's wednesday or the gods have a bad day.....

if the water went through the floor, you obviously got a wooden house! wooden floors can be very tricky because wood 'works' when the weather changes, due to changes in the humidity in the air.

to crack a tank in a wooden house you probably made a unknown mistake with setting up a tank wich was too heavy or putting it on the wrong places on the floor, and making the bottom 'bend' in some way. wood bends fine, glass unfortunately......
or maybe no or not enough styrofoam under the tank to equalize pressure etc.

There's ALWAYS a cause to domestic disasters like this, it's most likely some pressure buildup in the support of the tank, or simply too much weight at one point.

maybe the silicone was almost gone, that can happen too.

Too bad about this; I once had a filter bust on me* when still living at my parents' house wich has wooden floors.....they were not amused at all!

*badly glued by me, and it couldn't take the pressure. happened when I wasn't home, always this way now......

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 12 Jul 2005, 22:53

If you are in doubt, put it on a concrete floor on a lower level or get a stuctural engineer to assist you.

Always consult with a structural engineer if you aren't certain about how much weight a floor can hold. If the floor is not completely level, problems will ensue. Of this, I can guarentee. Upper levels of a wood-frame home shouldn't be the first choice when placing an aquarium of greater than 29 gallons. Water weight is heavy weight!!!!

natefrog · Post by **natefrog** » 13 Jul 2005, 02:29

I just moved, (to say the least, an ordeal with ten tanks), and specifically chose a basement suite with a concrete floor just for the ability to finally get the 120G I've been dreaming about, (quite literally at that).

DewDropPony · Post by **DewDropPony** » 13 Jul 2005, 04:17

This was a 28gal against a wall. The floor is level. We checked it. The stand is level. There were no brakes or cracks in the tank. I could only find water in the airline hose which was located in the stand. Which I know it shouldn't have been. I set up the tank again outside under the deck and so far so good. I don't know.

natefrog · Post by **natefrog** » 13 Jul 2005, 08:25

If the pump was below or at tank level, or the air line hose was disconnected and hanging out of the tank then by the laws of physics the tank emptied itself via the air line tubing.

It seems a little strange, but without back pressure in this situation a fautly pump or disconnected tube allowed the water in the tank to move to a lower location, (the basement). Hydrologic cycles in nature works this way, just as a syphon would, (it can happen even without the help of primeing it.

A back check valve, or moving the pump to above the water level are the best ways to avod this from happening twice.

Sorry to hear of the calamity. I hope the books in your library are okay.

kev · Post by **kev** » 13 Jul 2005, 14:51

that's really bad luck mate, i have six tank's in one room upstair's, got i hope nothing happen's.

Kev

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 13 Jul 2005, 15:51

kev,
It's hard to tell over the internet. But, there are as many situations as there are buildings. Building code requirements vary by different cities, states and countries. It also depends on how a building is designed, how the materials for that building are chosen and, ultimately, how the building is constructed. You may be just fine, kev! If you feel you may be stretching things to the limit, do some research on your home first. Find out what kinds of materials were used in constructing it: is it masonry(brick/block/concrete), wood or steel? Are there columns on the floor below? Once you do this, you can look up the strengths of these materials on line. Here's a web site on spans:
http://www.awc.org/technical/spantables/tutorial.htm
Here's a "Do It Yourself" forum where someone asks the same question we're dealing with:
http://forum.doityourself.com/showthread.php?t=212744
There was one other link from a different fish site that was so rife with errors that I didn't include the link! This may raise more questions than it solves. This is an area that should be pre-planned, too.

Amanda

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 13 Jul 2005, 16:06

One other factor to consider is that houses in england often have smaller rooms, which means that the beams going across from one wall to another becomes shorter and stronger. Having said that, I know how much "swing" there is in my upper floor, and I wouldn't want to put a big tank anywhere upstairs. My ground-floor level is more sturdy, so it's OK there.

Tanks up to about 100-120 liter (~30 us g) should be OK as long as they are on a stable base that spreads the load over a few sqaure feet.

Another thought is to use the walls to support the weight. Older english houses are often brick/concrete walls, so the walls can be used to support some/all of the weight from the tank. For instance, screwing a 2x4 onto the wall will significantly reduce the strain on the floor.

But as Bronzefry said, it's all depending on the house construction, and they vary greatly between new and old, the US, England and other countries. Not to mention "what was the building designed for".

--
Mats

ClayT101 · Post by **ClayT101** » 13 Jul 2005, 18:38

I am in the process of dealing with a similar situation. I am buying a house that is raised about a foot off the ground (for flooding). I just had the place inspected and talked to the structural engineer about the supporting of my aquarium. Basically, what I am going to end up doing is increasing the number of Joyces (sp?) to support the aquarium. Currently, the joyces are about 3 feet apart, so I will put in 2 or 3 additional ones to support my 6 foot long aquarium (that way there will be a joyce every foot or 1.5 feet. The guy said that it should cost about $150 per joyce.

Elspeth · Post by **Elspeth** » 13 Jul 2005, 22:38

Joist.

Air tubing can be at fault for a drained tank. When you set up again, use a check valve. AND a pump higher than the tank. In fact, I think I'm going to go move some air pumps of my own now!

And... sorry about the fish.

natefrog · Post by **natefrog** » 14 Jul 2005, 14:59

Joists set at three feet apart is astonishing. Building codes in Canada don't allow floor joists to be spaced at more than 16 inch centers.

Any floor with so few joists would have to reenforced before aquariums are set up, but get a second quote as I would never charge $150 dollars a joist and this is what I do for a living.

ClayT101 · Post by **ClayT101** » 14 Jul 2005, 17:16

natefrog wrote: Any floor with so few joists would have to reenforced before aquariums are set up, but get a second quote as I would never charge $150 dollars a joist and this is what I do for a living.

How far apart do you recomend? What is the going rate for a joist? Also, this is not very high level, it is about 1 foot off of the ground, if that makes a difference.
Thanks

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 14 Jul 2005, 20:35

Clay,
The engineer found a true weakness in the structure of this home you're looking at. As Nate said, 16" on center is the general code in US and Canada for floor joist placement. Anything wider and the floor cannot support as much weight. Even if you didn't have aquariums, you're going to need to do something about that, no matter what. The price of lumber is like the price of oil-it changes by the day. Another option you may want to ask the engineer about are laminate beams. These are two or three 2"x(2 by) joists that are pre-glued and available at the large warehouse-type hardware places. These can be placed in strategic areas where the weakensses are. Gold star for consulting with an engineer, Clay!

If you have any doubts about your individual situation, please find a consulting engineer. Better to err on the side of caution.
Amanda

ClayT101 · Post by **ClayT101** » 14 Jul 2005, 22:22

All of the houses here are old. The one I am thinking of buying is at least 80 years old. I doubt the building codes were the same back then.

Thanks for the star

bronzefry · Post by **bronzefry** » 15 Jul 2005, 00:32

New Orleans has some beautiful homes that are well worth the investment. It sounds like you're doing your homework, Clay.