opinions on the ID of this cat.. Perruno or Marmoratas

PeacockBass · Post by **PeacockBass** » 21 Feb 2003, 11:20

i think marmoratas but the color is sorta resembling a perruno with its Small marbles..

thanks guys.

coelacanth · Post by **coelacanth** » 21 Feb 2003, 11:32

It's not P. perruno, there are too many dorsal rays. So, you have a young marmoratus.

PeacockBass · Post by **PeacockBass** » 21 Feb 2003, 11:35

k thats what i thaought.. just wanted more opinions..

i have 2 L. marmoratas.

YouTube · Post by **Jools** » 22 Feb 2003, 16:53

After a fair amount of research I stil think these two species are the same. Certainly we do not commonly see perruno in the hobby. Nothing I saw in Venezuela convinced me otherwise...

Jools

TiGrInUs · Post by **TiGrInUs** » 22 Feb 2003, 18:46

Can someone show me a picture of a perruno then? Where the dorsal is not that big?

coelacanth · Post by **coelacanth** » 22 Feb 2003, 19:41

Jools wrote:After a fair amount of research I stil think these two species are the same. Certainly we do not commonly see perruno in the hobby. Nothing I saw in Venezuela convinced me otherwise...

The few specimens that appeared at BAS a couple of years ago when they were getting Venezuelan fish were definitely different from the marmoratus we see usually from Peru.
Head shape, dorsal rays, everything about the fish shouted different species. I just wish I'd got some pics now. I did have a copy of Schultz that had information on Perrunichthys, but I haven't seen it for quite some time now...

YouTube · Post by **Jools** » 23 Feb 2003, 10:14

OK, this is from the description that Pete gave me a loan of..

http://www.planetcatfish.com/temp/perruno1.jpg
http://www.planetcatfish.com/temp/perruno2.jpg
http://www.planetcatfish.com/temp/perruno3.jpg

I only put the pics inline, the text you can read by clicking the links as I guess everyone doesn't want to download all this!

Jools

nolan · Post by **nolan** » 23 Feb 2003, 17:24

I also believe that these fish maybe the same species although my lfs has two catfish at around 20" they call perruno they have similar markings to the picture at the bottom of your original post.
i have never seen jevinile perruno only l. mamoratus and i think that your fish is mamoratus.

coelacanth · Post by **coelacanth** » 23 Feb 2003, 17:40

nolan wrote:I also believe that these fish maybe the same species although my lfs has two catfish at around 20" they call perruno they have similar markings to the picture

A lot of the confusion is down to TFH consistently labelling pics of marmoratus at perruno, and most dealers just used this name. It certainly sounds like this particular puzzle is something worth getting to the bottom of. I still think separate species based on the juveniles I saw at BAS, but I'd be delighted to be shown that these were just a population of a more widely distributed species.

PeacockBass · Post by **PeacockBass** » 25 Feb 2003, 07:29

im with Ceo on this one.. i have seen pics of perruno and they do look different then Marmoratas

Post by **Silurus** » 21 Jun 2003, 03:08

Mike Littmann and John Lundberg will present a paper entitled "Review of the validity of Leiarius marmoratus" at the ASIH meeting in Manaus next week, which might shed light on the argument.
Be sure to watch for my running log of the Manaus meetings for coverage of this and other talks in the Taxonomy forum.

Post by **Silurus** » 05 Jul 2003, 01:05

The correct name for the fish often identified as L. marmoratus in the aquarium trade is L. longibarbis. Perrunichthys is a completely different fish with a much more triangular dorsal fin.