Behaviour Change in Clown Pleco

[Froeschli]

This isn't a problem, the opposite, really, but i am curious

I was given a tank a bit over a month ago. 30gallons, 8 guppies, 1 mystery snail and a clown pleco.

first thing i did, was to look up just what kind of pleco he was and read up on what he needed, so I added a piece of driftwood. Still, he was hiding all the time, and rather pale. not once did i see him check out the algae wafers or cucumber.

since then, i have added plants, changed the substrate to sand and last week, added two more clown plecos (hoping to end up with at least one male and female)

a couple days later I added more wood and a "cave" (2 pieces of shale propped together).

Now they've all changed to a darker color, and grown much more active. even the original one comes out in the daytime now. is it just due to having more hiding places, or having more of their own kind about?
from what i am reading, 3 is about the limit of what i can have in my tank (i expect i'll need to move at least one of them out once the two new ones grow up) but i can add more hiding places, especially if that will get them to come out even more
I've got more wood soaking, and am working on a 3d background with more caves.

i won't be adding any fish, maybe a few snails though, to stir up the sand.

[stuby]

Sounds to me they are more comfortable..... and a 30 is plenty big enough for 3 clown plecs and the others you have in there. I had a breeding group of clowns in a 29 and a bunch of fry for a long time. I moved them to a 55 now.

Take care,
Chuck

[bekateen]

I agree with Chuck. I used to breed 7 adult clowns in a standard (USA) 15 gal aquarium, and it housed all their fry. You've got room for a few more clowns if you want, but you're fine as you are. And yes, the more hiding places, the merrier... especially if you have more than one male.

Enjoy,
Eric

[Froeschli]

Thanks guys. it's a 30 tall, so not that much "floor space" (12x24"). besides, i expect i'll be swamped in guppy fry before long. (debating what fish i should get to eat those )
i'll wait and see how the clowns do before deciding on anything else. definitely will add more hiding spots

[stuby]

Thanks guys. it's a 30 tall, so not that much "floor space" (12x24"). besides, i expect i'll be swamped in guppy fry before long. (debating what fish i should get to eat those )
i'll wait and see how the clowns do before deciding on anything else. definitely will add more hiding spots

Even with the smaller base size they should be fine! You can always do a condo style cave/wood/rock pile for them to hide in and still add more of the clowns and they would still be fine. Picture is of some condo caves I make for my fish just to give you a idea of what will work...… you can do rock and wood piles and they would be just as happy with it..... just make sure it can't collapse is all!

[Froeschli]

Even with the smaller base size they should be fine! You can always do a condo style cave/wood/rock pile for them to hide in and still add more of the clowns and they would still be fine. Picture is of some condo caves I make for my fish just to give you a idea of what will work...… you can do rock and wood piles and they would be just as happy with it..... just make sure it can't collapse is all!

That looks awesome!

[stuby]

Even with the smaller base size they should be fine! You can always do a condo style cave/wood/rock pile for them to hide in and still add more of the clowns and they would still be fine. Picture is of some condo caves I make for my fish just to give you a idea of what will work...… you can do rock and wood piles and they would be just as happy with it..... just make sure it can't collapse is all!

That looks awesome!

Thank you. Been making them for about 15 years now..... work great but I still need to make more!

[Froeschli]

Added some broken clay pots and have seen more of them today than ever before. not sure how practical it'll be re cleaning, but I'll figure that out tomorrow.

Still have to finish soaking that large driftwood. When that goes in, some things will have to move. And I'll likely be taking out the last plastic decorations at the same time.

[bekateen]

Looks good. But they'll like the extra wood when you can add it.

Cheers,
Eric

[Froeschli]

Yeah, turns out the basement wasn't an ideal place for prepping the driftwood. I pulled it out of the bleach water and it went mouldy the next day.
New strategy: bleach, then let it dry in the sun on the roof, then put it in the tank. (Too big to boil)
I have a boatload of smaller driftwood pieces to put in if this one doesn't work out. But it's my fave. I'll know in a day or two.

[bekateen]

Myself, I hose off most wood outside. If it's small enough for a pot, I boil it for 10-15 min, then into the tank. If it's too large for a pot, I put it straight into the tank and let it float until it sinks, which can sometimes take months. If any moldy slime grows on it inside the tank, I remove the wood, scrub it with a stiff brush, rinse with clean water, and replace in tank.

Cheers, Eric

[Froeschli]

Ok the big piece of driftwood is in. And sank mostly.

From the color of their droppings, I believe they prefer the dark piece of wood so far. With some nibbling on the second, smaller one. We'll see. Oh one's just nibbling on the new piece
Will have to rescape some things, I find it is too cluttered, but I expect the fish like it that way. Even the guppies are exploring the nooks and crannies.

Just read about wooden caves. I'll make some of those next.

Then, maybe, get a few more clowns

[Froeschli]

I've drilled out a small piece of wood. (Left)

only had a 7/8" spade bit, so I thought it might be too small for the original clown pleco, but I've seen his (?) tail stick out of it several times already today.
The other two are quite active now, even in the daytime. Not sure if that means they need more food? They're certainly "processing" a lot of wood. (I am starting to regret choosing sand for a substrate - all their dirt is accumulating like dust bunnies.)

They're about 2/3 the size of the "big" one, which , from what my friend said, I assume is over a year old and probably mature. Not near as shy as that one though. Except when I bring the camera out
Funny, really, the plecos scatter and the guppies come right up to the glass...

[bekateen]

They can breed in a cave with a diameter of about 1", so a 7/8" drill bit should be fine for a smaller adult. As far as more caves, I prefer to have at least one cave for each male in a group, plus at least 2 more caves as my minimum number of caves. For 3 clowns, if I wasn't sure of their sexes, I'd provide at least 4 caves for the group. But that's just me.

They look good. And yes, get ready for lots of sawdust poop!

Cheers, Eric

[Froeschli]

Thanks, Eric, I've found a 1" bit and made another wood cave. I'll see about doing more later. It just seems like a lot of work when I could just 3d print some
ah but the natural look....

Question though, in one of your videos, you have a male clown pleco fanning a clutch of eggs. Is that a common behaviour even when there are no eggs?
He's got another (plastic) cave he likes but always sits in it facing outward. With the first wood cave though, he goes in head first and pretty much constantly moves his tail. Is that just to keep the water circulating for his own breathing?
I'm saying "he" just because he's the biggest. I have yet to get decent photos of them all to even attempt identifying what sex they are.
Actually, is it possible he's growing bigger, even though he ought to be mature by now? The previous owner had him for over a year, but didn't keep driftwood in the tank...

[bekateen]

Hi,

Yes, plecos in caves will sometimes fan even without eggs just to move water for circulation, and also it's rumored they might be fanning to push out pheromones to attract females. Yes they can get bigger.

Cheers, Eric

P.S., I'd avoid 3D printed caves because if the clowns do spawn, the fry will chew on the inside of the cave. I think that's why my clowns preferred to spawn in bamboo caves. Babies could chew on bamboo for food.

[Froeschli]

Huh, never even considered them eating the plastic caves, though PLA (polylactic acid - made from corn starch) ought to be safe enough. Still not quite what I want in this tank though.
As much as I complain about the work involved, I like the look of the wooden caves.
Haven't seen bamboo big enough, or that would be my choice for a "quick fix".
Anyhow, they haven't touched the new cave yet at all. Debating on repositioning it. - it's in the "bright" corner of the tank.
The big pleco now spends most his time in the first cave, with the braver one of the other two lurking nearby.
The third just sort of hides where the first two aren't.

[Froeschli]

Yay. It took some rearranging, but one of the small ones has moved in.

Now I will have to make more

[bekateen]

Good looking cave!

Cheers, Eric

[Froeschli]

Ha, added a large piece of wood with 5 caves drilled into it all around. And they've started playing musical caves. The big one has quit chasing the others away and one of the little ones has taken over his previously preferred cave.
This is fun to watch

[Froeschli]

Without actually naming them, I have the "big guy", the extrovert and the introvert.
Here's extrovert. He (?) Is the only one ever found on the glass.

Meanwhile, Big guy is in a new cave, and introvert behind the rocks....

[Jools]

Big guy may well be a gal...


Jools

[Froeschli]

Big guy may well be a gal...


Jools

Lol. That's the extrovert, one of the juvies.
Makes me think they may all be girls though. None show clear odontodes, though big guy definitely is "furrier" than the littles.
Wouldn't that just be my luck.

Good reason to get two more though