S. Aterimus or S. Schoutedeni?

[zendog]

I'm thinking of setting up a 40 gallon tank (4 feet long by one foot wide footprint) for a group of Synos (4 or 5) and would like to make it a species tank and just stick with one species. Right now I'm thinking of either S. Aterimus or S. Schoutedeni. I'd prefer to have the possibility of them possibly breeding some day - realizing it may be a case of luck since many seem tough or impossible to breed. I know the Schoutedeni have been bred, but I haven't seen any reports for the Aterimus although I haven't seen a lot of reports of people trying since this seems to be a much less kept fish. I don't see much info on the Aterimus in general.

So I'm wondering if anyone knows:

1. How do these two species compare to each other in terms of being out during the day, cruising the tank, etc.? If it is a species tank I'd like to enjoy them during the day.

2. Do they like some current? A lot of current?

3. Besides size, what other differences are there between the 2 in terms of behavior or diet?

4. Do they both hold onto their patterns/coloration pretty well in adulthood or does one or the other (or both) loose a lot of the pattern like I see with a lot of plecos?

5. Anyone ever hear of Aterimus being successfully bred in captivity or, possibly more importantly, have they heard of people trying real hard and failing? I like the size of the Aterimus better but if there is really no hope of breeding them someday I'd probably go with the Schoutedeni.

Thanks all for any information on these two species you can provide.

[Richard B]

I've only ever seen 1 Aterimus ever in my life (which was in the late 80's) & everything else is a juvenile eupterus or hybrid - even most photos on the net are wrong - therefore I believe chances of obtaining this species is nil.

For a 4x1 foot tank i'd go for a smaller species - nigriventris, robertsi, batesi, congicus, or flavitaeniatus - schoutedeni can be a bit aggressive to each other. Flow unimportant to these species, they are unfussy feeders & keep their pattern.

They do however hide most of the time although nigriventris will shoal up & occasionally cruise the tank but essentially synos are nocturnal.

If you want to see & breed synos, i'd suggest going for Lucipinnis, the undescribed "Polli white" or grandiops which are all rift lake species

[Dave Rinaldo]

The fish sold as Synodontis aterrimus in the US are hybrids.

[naturalart]

I agree with Richard B, S. shoutedeni get a bit big for a 1ft. wide tank. And even though they are pretty and keep their pattern, the are hard on each other, especially in a small tank. Now if you plan on moving to a bigger footprint, then you can start with juvenile shout's and move them to a bigger tank later? Otherwise I would go with Richards recommendations. You could also consider some of the 'dwarfs such as the Microsynodontis spp. or

Mochokeilla paynei

And I've never seen a real live S. aterimus in the aquarium trade or anywhere else.

[N0body Of The Goat]

Another syno to consider for a 4x1 tank would be a 10+ group of

Microsynodontis sp. (1)

, when I had such a group ~4 years ago, they were hyperactive all day long.

I've got ~10 different syno species and the only two that are truly diurnally active are my

Synodontis notatus

and Troy (who I thought was a

Synodontis budgetti

, but recently I began to wonder if he/she was perhaps a

Synodontis resupinatus

). These two swim around in their 6-foot tank for a fair amount of the day.

My singleton

Synodontis schoutedeni

has the odd little swim during the day in the same 6-foot tank, but by and large, he/she stays mostly idle around the bogwood like my

Synodontis brichardi

trio and mixed species Euchilichthys quartet. It's very rare to see my

Synodontis angelicus

move out of his/her clay pipe until around now (dinner time).

In one of my 4-foot tanks, the synos are typically boldly going nowhere during the day! This tank has 12

Synodontis nigriventris

; the last 2

Microsynodontis sp. (1)

; my singleton

Synodontis congicus

. The only exception might be when there is a random round of "muscial chairs," when the nigriventris decide to change roosting spots around the bogwood.

[zendog]

Thanks all for the suggestions. Bummer that you can't get real S. Aterimus and they are just passing off hybrids.

My daughter actually already has a group of 8 Microsynodontis sp. "bumble bee" in a 30inchx12inch 20 gallon tank. They are very cute when they're all wiggling around the tank like a bunch of stretched tadpoles. She also has a couple of Mochokeilla paynei in a 4x1 with some other fish, although we rarely see those. The Congicus seem like an interesting looking fish, but might get too big for me based on the descriptions on this site and I've actually not seen them on any US lists lately so don't know if I could get them. Would 4 brichardi work or are they too big as well?

I may just go with the Schoutedeni and move them up to a larger tank when they've put on some size. Most that I've seen around are juveniles.

[Birger]

For brichardi a 40.would be okay with plenty of river rock and current.also a large group of nigrivrntris is always good. THere are robertsi in NA too right now.

[Richard B]

Congicus would work fine as they are slow growing, but more importantly a very gentle syno

[N0body Of The Goat]

Shame that S. congicus are rare as hen's teeth, I got mine by complete accident and I've been aware of perhaps two other specimens through re-slaes since (sadly some distance from me, I'd love a 6+ group). In ~5 years of owning, my singleton has maybe grown ~1cm to ~10cm SL maximum (might be a tad smaller).

Very old clip of mine, from when it was in my 4x1...

[Richard B]

I see Congicus about every so often but not too frequently & quite often labelled Notatus - but easy to tell apart by barbel
length

[zendog]

The Congicus do sound like a very nice fish and a good candidate for this tank. Anyone ever seen them for sale in the US? If so, any idea of pricing? Since I'd like to do a group, price will be an issue if they are one of the really pricey ones. I guess if they're not local I'd better get pictures from any sellers as well to make sure I'm not trying to squeeze Notatus into the 4x1 space!