New Job!

[pleconut]

Not wanting to say too much, until it was made final. Last week i was offered a job at a LFS, its now been finalised, and is a very good opportunity for me to learn a lot more, and gain even more experience in fishkeeping in general. I have a trial period for a month, then to see where it goes, so for those in that are in, or have been, in the retail business, are there any really good reliable resources to get good, sound, information, apart from here, obviously for all things catfish, that you know of.

The main areas mainly are:

-Coldwater basics -goldfish ect.
-Rift lake cichlids, (not my forte) but always supplied, quite a few tanks!
-South American cichlids are also commonly supplied.
-Staple community fish.
-Synodontis are usually supplied.
-varying L numbers, these are increasing in number and variety, of regularly supplied fish. (An area of specific interest for me... but I'm still learning).
-Also fish that are not so often found are a regular, that may not be so familiar to me, sometimes catfish, do come in.
-Reptiles are also sold. But I'm on the fishkeeping side.

Mostly, my job description during the trial, is general tank maintenance and upkeep, so any direction to really good info sources.
Any tips or pointers will be really appreciated.

[bekateen]

Congratulations!

[pleconut]

Thanks, ive been waiting and looking for such an opportunity! I shared some tips, i hope good ones, then he offered me a job!

[Viktor Jarikov]

Much success and luck in your new endeavour!

[pleconut]

Thank you.

[catfishchaos]

If theres one place where I have learned the most its probably been working at my LFS or learning in order to give customers proper information. Do your best to give out proper information and no matter what DO NOT RECOMMEND THINGS YOU ARE UNSURE ABOUT. If my customers have questions I can't answer I tell them that I don't know and give them some resources (you have no Idea how many receipts I write planet catfish on a day) where they can get some info. Its better to tell them your always learning than explaining that you thought that catfish would't eat their very nice tetra collection.

Learn how to manage your time and close conversations, I'm a total chatter box and im pretty sure my current record is 4 hours with a single customer but my average 2-3. Its important to be able to sum things up quickly so you can serve a large volume of customers while still giving helpful info. I would say being able to effectively explain the Nitrogen cycle in a timely manner is the #1 most helpful time saver and the most frequently asked question or the most important thing to explain.

Lastly don't get discouraged by rude mean or upset customers. there are some days where I serve 17 jerks and only one nice customer but for me that one nice person who is eager to learn would worth dealing with 100 jerks. Some people don't like when you tell them goldfish and betta fish don't do well in bowls, others just want something for the kids and really don't care about the animals. Just try to calmly explain why and try to open there eyes a little to the amount of knowledge that aquarist are exposed to and need to process.

If you want more tips just PM me, I volunteered at the local store for 5 years (wasn't old enough to hire) and have been a payed employee for 2 years now. Always happy to give some tricks or summaries I frequently use.

Congrats on the Job!

[pleconut]

Thanks, for the tips, I went to another LFS at the weekend,I felt so sorry for a member of staff, who repeatedly one after the other, was explaining to parents, with tantrum throwing kids at the prospect of going back home with no fish, about the nitrogen cycle. I appreciate some parts of the job aren't so straightforward.

[Marine590622]

One thing you could do is institute a policy of having a bunch of sponge filters running in your stores tanks That way you can customers home with a filter full of Benificial Bacteria to get a good jump start on their nitrogen cycling. (for the cost of the filter of course)

[catfishchaos]

One thing you could do is institute a policy of having a bunch of sponge filters running in your stores tanks That way you can customers home with a filter full of Benificial Bacteria to get a good jump start on their nitrogen cycling. (for the cost of the filter of course)

I've had a few wise people with new tanks (or even total newbies that did some reading first) ask me to squeeze some sponge water into fish bags for them but at no charge, its a great idea and would save a lot of grief but I'm not sure if a chain store like the one I work at would go for that.

[pleconut]

Thanks for the tip, when I've bought filters in the past, on occasions, I've paid for it new but its been matured there.

[bekateen]

One thing you could do is institute a policy of having a bunch of sponge filters running in your stores tanks That way you can customers home with a filter full of Benificial Bacteria to get a good jump start on their nitrogen cycling. (for the cost of the filter of course)

I've never seen that practice in a store, but that is a great idea. Personally, I like the Hagen Elite sponge filters. They come in 1- and 2- sponge varieties and, in my area, sell for $9-15 USD (very cheap, IMHO). What I like about the 2-sponge variety is that you can alternate cleaning of the sponges. Apologies to OP, this is a little off topic.

Cheers, Eric

[pleconut]

The double sponge filter looks more practical, for cleaning alternatively.

[Mol_PMB]

It's a great idea. So many customers start off with bad advice and an uncycled filter. This would be far more effective than a bottle of 'snake oil' bacteria.

Congratulations on the new job!

[pleconut]

Thanks, going in later on today to finalise start date and hours etc, he has been also prepared to in the past, to provide mature water gravel etc, that is from a healthy tank of course.

[Mol_PMB]

How about a dedicated setup with an automatic ammonia dose and a bunch of new filters running off it, that would be sold to customers at a small premium over the filter itself but still less than the cost of a bottle of snake oil?

Water doesn't have any significant quantity of bacteria in it. Gravel maybe if it's in a high-flow area but nothing like as good as a cycled filter.

[pleconut]

Have to look into that, I've just been along to discuss hours, days ect, i start next Monday 5 days (mornings at first) per week. Was given a run down of what my role is for the first month, mainly maintenance of tanks, there's about 40-50 of various sizes, some a of a big size including those at the back with some big jobs coming up, like stripping them down individually, with regards to hazards of the job he did warn me about one fish, alone in a tank, who doesn't take too kindly to the presence anyone's hand in and doing tank maintenance, a red devil cichlid, the name says it all really.

[TwoTankAmin]

Good luck with the job- I am sure it will have both its high and low points and on balance will be a great learning experience.

I actually have run my own small bio-farm for filters on and off for the past few years. In a store, this would present some potential difficulties. The most important issue is the filters would need to be pathogen free. Fish stores are notorious for having problems with this and pet stores are much worse. It is why we quarantine.

I would suggest, if you wish to do this, you follow a few basic guidelines.

- The container for the cycling of the filters must be completely isolated from anything used in the the rest of the store. It needs to have its own tools, buckets etc.
- It is important to have things controlled and to that end I use Dr. Tim's ammonium chloride as my ammonia source. If you are so inclined you could create your own solution from scratch.
- I also use Dr. Tim's bottled bacteria to seed my bio-farms. I know this works and contains the proper bacteria. I also know it comes without pathogens.
- You will need to keep on top of the KH and pH. You will be dosing a lot of ammonia into a small space with lots of filters. Nitrates can build rapidly acidifying the water and the bacteria can use up the carbonates/bicarbonates fast. (I just throw crushed coral in a bag into my farm.) Water changes are important for reducing nitrates and replenishing other things.
- Only use a dechlor that does not neutralize/detoxify ammonia
- The container needs no light and no substrate.
- Keep the pH in the high 7s and the temp in the low 80s to maximize growths rates.
- When starting up, do not just dose ammonia every day. Monitor the levels and as they approach 0, you can redose. My practice is to dose based on the number of filters involved and the tank size each is intended to make safe.

I had the following on/in a 20 gal. tank: An AquaClear 300 and a 150, 3 poret 20 ppi cubes and a fairly large hydro sponge. My ammonia dosing for that tank with all the filters cycled was 140 ppm. That works out to about 1.75 ppm/gal. I wanted the sponges good to go on 10 gal. tanks for certain and the ACs good for another 40.

One last comment. I tend to work with this stuff as well as with plants in tanks using a more "seat of the pants" methodology. I tend not to test etc. and rely on a feel for things. However, I would suggest that a better approach is to be a lot more technical and exact in doing things. But I am only doing this for myself and do not have to be as concerned about my methods. If a tank comes up short here, I can always throw in a bunch of plants from my excess plant tank.

[pleconut]

Thanks for those further tips, I obviously know the importance of keeping such an arrangement entirely pathogen free, rather than running such a system at a store, where despite all preventative measures, its not always easy to maintain one. The tank drainage systems are centralised were the many of tanks are drained and waste leaves from pipes installed below that can be connected when necessary, most have their own equipment. Although there's not such a risk of unwanted things getting into the tanks as it's only installed for drainage purposes. Its still possible i suppose that it could potentially cause a problem. I did speak to the manager about the possibility i could do a few things at home. Breeding and such like, this could be something i can also consider as I'm planning a fish room anyway, though the job is going to take up a lot of time, recently i cut back considerably on my stock, now with doing tank maintenance at the shop for half of the day, I'm sure glad i did! I'm currently running just two systems at home, my bristlenoses and L397 tanks as the only fish intended for breeding, as well as a para pleco (impulse buy) currently with the BNs that will soon go into their own tank when cycled. But its also something well worth considering for when i do have the time available and the ability to maintain all the systems responsibly, (and why now I tend to plan ahead more and try not to impulse buy) But still as for the Para i cant bear to part with him ! In term of impulse buys i used to do this regularly! However a whole lot of different factors, (included is what i now decide to do, re the para pleco), has changed my whole perspectives on fishkeeping recently. So the fish room will still be built but no other fish immediately planned.

[pleconut]

Just finished my first shift, slightly different seeing it from the other side of the hobby, topped up tanks and cleaned the glass inside, had my arm nipped by a tankful of golden barbs, then outside my hand being chased by a gang of rift lake cichlids, that once my hand came away, then turned on eachother. But no misbehaving catfish of which to speak. I stripped down one system entirely for it to be rebuilt, will do this tomorrow. I didn't bring any fish home today, but did reserve for myself three 4ft ex display tanks for my fish room.

[smitty]

Hope everything goes well for you at the new job.

[pleconut]

Thanks smitty, now i need to decide what to put in the 3 4ft tanks.

[pleconut]

Gutted P'od and extremely disappointed is the only way, i can describe how i feel, right now, there's probably many of you here would be extremely also shocked and upset, to know of the goings on in this establishment. I've worked there almost two weeks now, and I simply couldn't continue with this job and live with myself. Being told by the boss to do things that i simply wouldn't do myself, with what some of those fish, etc, go through. I don't think this is going to go anywhere, and it's certainly not for me. But is it enough for me to say I've certainly learned a lot about, definitely how not to do things, i don't want to enter into all the details. But it goes without saying I'd much rather put my energies into working somewhere that sets a good example, than where i have done for the last two weeks. I did get some fish, I hope to be able to give them the best life I possibly can. Just feel sorry for all the others.

[bekateen]

Hi Teresa,

Sorry to learn that you're having such a negative experience. While I'm curious to know what exactly are the bad practices of the store, frankly I don't need to know and it's probably just as well that you keep those kinds of details private, out of respect for the business (even if the business doesn't deserve such respect based on what you know; but it's always good to take the high road and avoid gossip, even when it's truthful).

From what you wrote, it sounds like you've either left that job or you're about to. Of course, that will be your decision to make. However if you haven't left the job or put in your termination notice, as a veteran of several jobs I didn't care for (not at fish stores though), I'll tell you that you can learn a lot from and also make a positive difference at jobs that are not "ideal." For example, even if you can't control how the store is managed, you can have a very positive educational influence on customers - teaching them best practice for aquarium maintenance and fish care, helping them to make wise, informed choices when buying fish, etc. Also, although your boss may want to you follow certain practices you feel are not good for the fish, with time you may gain the boss' trust and persuade them to change procedures and thus improve the quality of the store. Who knows? You might be the only light in a dark place.

Anyway, again, sorry to hear that things aren't what you'd hoped for. Good luck,
Eric

[pleconut]

Hi Eric regarding, the customers I believe I gave someone the right advice today I wouldnt even dream of doing so, if I wasn't sure, but got a severe telling off! I would advise someone with the same question here on the forum exactly with the same answer, and if i did the opposite I'm sure there is a fair few here on PC that would very quickly pick me up on it. Someone who had just started out, when looking at the fish, I advised them they couldn't put an almost 18inch common pleco, in a 3 ft tank, so suggested to them a young common bristlenose alternative, not rocket science, obviously there's a lot more involved here, but I dont think its right to spell out all the graphic details.

[Jools]

You missed the opportunity to sell them a tank big enough for the larger Pleco. I know something of the experience you had, so I can empathise.

Jools

[pleconut]

I think I probably would have got a pat on the back instead!

[bekateen]

Teresa, what's ironic about your advice is that in my area, bristlenoses are as expensive or more expensive than common plecos (pardalis and gibbiceps). A 6 inch common pleco can sell for $15-20, and a 4-5 inch adult (sexable) BN will be over $20 in many local stores (most of my LFS don't carry adult BNs). A small 2 inch common pleco can sell for $2, whereas a 1.5-2 inch BN sells for $6-9. I tried to get one of my LFS to stop selling common plecos last year and replace their stock with more BNs. The owner's reply was if I can provide him with a constant supply of my ABN babies (1-2 inches long) for 75 cents each, he'll cancel his common pleco orders to try it out. But in reality he didn't want that because a lot of customers LIKE the thought that their fish will grow huge.... And then a year or two later they're bringing those fish back to the store to trade in because they've made a big (literally) mistake and their plecos outgrew the tank.

Maybe that's why your boss got mad - he's got this 18 inch monster pleco he doesn't want and can't get rid of, and some unsuspecting customer was just about to take it... Then you came along and talked them out of it! LOL

Cheers, Eric

[pleconut]

I think i probably would have got a pat on the back, the only decent sized tank was £350 not to mention all the necessary equipment. I've not handed in my notice, yet. Eric, but you're right though, even if I'm the only one there, doing the right thing, it may impact them to do things differently. This would be better for the business in the long term. They did offer me the job, as the manager said they need to make some very big changes, and he needed an extra pair of hands, if he's recognised this and wants to get on track, there's a point at which to start then, as tough as it is, i think i need to see it might take some time. And try to persevere with it!

[bekateen]

Tough decision. Best wishes.

(I was going to write, "You go, Girl!" and then I thought better about it.)

[pleconut]

Keep on pressing forward, praying and hoping something good will come out of it.