Help with new pleco :-)

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 05 Dec 2003, 22:03

Hi,

I posted on here recently about needing advice before getting my L134 but I did not get many replies.

Now, he's here and I am a bit worried about him although it's probably nothing! I get a bit paranoid about new fishes and I have never had a pleco before. Anyway, I got him yesterday and he was a bit pale when he arrived. His dark bits were very light, but with dark outlines. He seemed to brighten up and although he has not moved from a rock he's been on I gather this to be normal. Today, his colour is still pale. Should I be worried about this? I'll tell you as much as I can about my set-up:

* 4ft/35 gallon tank
* Sharing with loaches, barbs, corys, glass catfish, 2 gouramis, 2 angel fish and 2
mollies.
* I don't know any of the parameters but everything was fine last week when I had it
tested at my LFS (ph was a little high but 2 water changes since then).
* The tank has a mixture of real and false plants and things such as rock, plant pots and
mopani.
* Tempature is 25/76
* I have been treating white spot for the last couple of weeks (no spots now but itching)
* I do a 30% water change one a week, and I did one today as I thought it would be a
good idea after adding fish

Thanks for any help/advice. It would be much appreciated as I am a beginner to plecos and I can't find much about the L134 online.

Dana

jonthefishkid · Post by **jonthefishkid** » 05 Dec 2003, 22:32

your pleco should be fine alot of new fish stay pale after catching them and tranporting them.

Post by **Barbie** » 05 Dec 2003, 23:11

The treatment for ich can kill off your biobed. If you no longer see ich on your fish, the odds are good they are scratching for another completely different reason, usually ammonia. I would definitely be testing your ammonia and nitrites. IMO, you shouldn't modify your tap water parameters or mess with your pH, unless you are going to do it in a separate holding tank before introducing it to the tank your fish are in. The swings it can cause are FAR harder on them than adjusting to the range that comes out of your tap.

On a side note, introducing new fish that haven't been quarantined in a tank specially prepared for it is asking for trouble...

Barbie

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 05 Dec 2003, 23:28

Barbie wrote: If you no longer see ich on your fish, the odds are good they are scratching for another completely different reason,
Barbie

Thanks for the reply, your comment on ich is not true though. Ich has a cycle of 2 weeks and lives in the water for at least that time. So, it's quite reasonable that my fish would still be scratching from ich.

I have not "messed with my ph" in that I have added any treatments, I didn't change a huge amount of water and the other fish that I bought on the same day are fine and dandy (2 Beaufortia kweichowensis). I did mention in my earlier post that my levels were all fine last week and the fish have been scratching the whole time. Although, I have noticed that it is only the green tiger barbs that are doing it. All the rest are fine (I have 8 tiger barbs - 2 tiger, 2 albino and 2 rosy as well as the greens) though... any ideas?

I am afraid I do not have the capacity to have a quarintine tank. I have never done that with any of my fish (although I know that strictly speaking, I shoud).

Is it normal for plecos to go paler? I know that it is for some fish such as Botia macracanthus, also this seems to be something that happens more with fish that have dark areas.

Thanks for your help.

Fiskars the Whiskers · Post by **Fiskars the Whiskers** » 05 Dec 2003, 23:50

Sometimes my pleco has these thick stripe-type blocks where the color is significantly lighter. Then I go back and look at him later and he's upside-down sucking on the glass and his color is back to his normal dark brown with no light areas. Sometimes he gets a dark honey shade in big camoflauge-type spots. He doesn't seem stressed, so maybe he's just changing based on feelings? Or something? But to me it seems fairly normal. Can anyone elaborate?

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 05 Dec 2003, 23:55

Thanks for the reply,

As I said above it is normal for this to happen in some fish such as Botia macracanthus (clown loach). They change colour depending on their mood. Maybe it is similar?

The lights just went out and I placed an algae wafer beside him. I went to move it so it was closer to him but I can't find it and he has moved a bit. So I think he has snaffled it! Surely this is a good sign, especially after only one day?

Fiskars the Whiskers · Post by **Fiskars the Whiskers** » 06 Dec 2003, 00:01

To me, if they're rambunctious and eating that's a good sign!

Fiskars the Whiskers · Post by **Fiskars the Whiskers** » 06 Dec 2003, 00:01

Hee hee, "snaffled" is a cute word. *L*

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 06 Dec 2003, 00:10

Fiskars the Whiskers wrote: rambunctious

LOL, what does that mean? I have been having a closer look and I don't know if he snaffled (lol) it after all. There seems to be a lot of other fish in that area, even though the lights are off. Bloody bottom feeders!!! They are in at everything! How do I feed him without the others stealing it? Although he is bigger than them!

Fiskars the Whiskers · Post by **Fiskars the Whiskers** » 06 Dec 2003, 00:28

Evil food-stealing bottom-feeders!!! *L* My pictuses live with my pleco and I always feed them first, because otherwise they will take his food and usually eat it whole. So I feed them and then drop an algae wafer right next to Plecostomus Pete and then wait a minute to see if he'll actually figure out it's there and then he does (usually).

Maybe you could put another small piece of food in next to him and hope that he gets it before the others do?

Rambunctious is what my pleco was when he was in the tank with the many other corys!!! I'd drop in some sinking pellets or algae wafers for them to eat and then they'd skitter over to it and start munching, but then as soon as Pete knew there was food, he'd muscle in there, take the food, and swim over to another part of the tank with it, with the cories trailing behind him trying to catch up. He was the prankster plecostomus. I eventually moved him because he got so big and was continually stealing food. So now he eats better and has lots of space to be rambunctious with the pictuses.

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 06 Dec 2003, 00:41

I think Brucilla (not sure of sex yet - Bruce if a boy, Cilla if a girl!) should learn from Pete! I think what I will do next time is to put one wafer on the opposite side of the tank for the others to amuse themselves with, (they are sooo greedy) and sneakly feed Brucilla so they don't notice!!

Fiskars the Whiskers · Post by **Fiskars the Whiskers** » 06 Dec 2003, 00:53

Oooh, Brucilla is a GOOD name!!! In the beginning, when I first got my fish, I just assumed they were all male (except for the ones that, due to color differences, were obviously female

) so they all have male names. Except now that I know more and know my fish better, I think my oto Oto is actually female. And I have a sneaky suspicion that Sam II is also female.

But I digress! I think putting food in opposite sides of the tank is a really good idea. Try to lure the bottom feeders to one side and then *shazam!* Brucilla gets food and does not go hungry!

My coworker says you should feed cheese to Brucilla, as you are a cheese specialist.

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 06 Dec 2003, 01:10

LOL

Tell your co-worker that I might try that! I am off to sleep now but thanks very much for all your advice! I'll keep you up to date on Brucilla's progress if you like. And, I will let you know the final verdict on the sex/name thing although I suspect he/she will just get called Brucilla!

Oh, I also tend to call my fish boys' names. I don't know the sex of most of them, or any actually! By the way, over here Sam is seen as a girls' name as well as a boys'. As in short for 'Samantha', so there you are. Not to worry, eh?!

Night night, Dana

Fiskars the Whiskers · Post by **Fiskars the Whiskers** » 06 Dec 2003, 01:17

Yes, I actually would appreciate being up to date on Brucilla, now that I feel like I know him/her so well! And if you just call Brucilla Brucilla, then I think that's just fine, too.

Can you get a picture?

And, that's true, Sam could be a girls' name. *L* I didn't think about that. I just thought "Sam" seemed fitting for my albino cory. He's got a lot of spunk. He's a good fish.

Anyhoo, you're off to bed and I get off work in 15 minutes! (Time is a little different when you're in Alaska vs. the UK

) Then I will go home and visit my little finny friends.

G'night!

Post by **Barbie** » 06 Dec 2003, 04:49

Actually if you aren't seeing ich on your fish, the odds are good they are no longer infested. The reproductive cycle is such that occasionally a treatment will allow a few to infest their gills, and continue to reproduce on into the two weeks, but its not the norm. I've treated for it a time or two. I still say you should check your ammonia and nitrite levels. Ich is something fish can easily live through if they aren't stressed, and their water quality is good. Bad water is not, and the meds for ich, DO interrupt your biological cycle.

Barbie

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 06 Dec 2003, 12:02

Thanks Barbie,

I am going round to my LFS today to get some de-chlorinator and some plants so I'll get it tested there (and save myslef some Â£!).

Brucilla is looking just the same today, pale. But has been on the move around the tank.

Thanks for the advice, I'll let you know.

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 06 Dec 2003, 18:19

Hi again,

I have had my water tested today and the amonia is fine, however, the Ph was not good. It was at 6.6. I have bought a thing that puts the ph right (7.5) so I will do that tonight and test the water again (I bought a test kit). My lfs think that my tap water could be to blame as it was 7.6 last week but I have done 2 water changes since then.

I bought some sinking pleco food for Brucilla today and I also got a piece of bogwood just for him. At the moment he's still looking a bit pale (not as much though) but has stuck himself onto the side of tank.

I'll keep you up to date. Thanks for your help.

Post by **Barbie** » 06 Dec 2003, 19:49

WHOA, back up. PLEASE don't adjust the pH of your water in your tank. Your fish aren't going to see the humor, whatsoever. First, tell us what your tap water parameters are! Did you have the nitrites tested? How about the nitrates? A master test kit with every test you'd need but nitrates is only 15 dollars, at http://www.petsolutions.com. Much cheaper than replacing the fish you ordered...

At 7.5 pH, any ammonia present is going to be 10 times more toxic to your fish than it was at 6.5. Raising your pH drastically like that is NEVER a good idea. Your fish have adjusted to the pH your tank water is at, and a far healthier way for them to be adjusted back up, is to do regular, partial water changes. Three a week of 10% each would usually do the trick, without stressing the fish. Your barbs and other fish that you listed previously don't require a high pH. I'm not really sure why your lfs sold you something to drastically change it. Water changes will remove some of the acids that are the end product of fish waste, and readd buffering capacity from your tap water. It would be advisable to find out what your kH is. If its terribly low, then you can add a SMALL amount of buffer to a bucket or pretreatment tank for the water, but I had a kH of 3 degrees in Anchorage, and managed to keep everything stable with careful watch to not overfeed, and weekly 30-40% water changes.

In this case, I honestly think buying your own test kits, and doing the partial water changes would be of a MUCH greater benefit to your fish. You can always take back whatever buffer they sold you and use that as a credit toward the test kit that would actually give you an idea of your parameters.

Barbie

Cheese Specialist · Post by **Cheese Specialist** » 06 Dec 2003, 22:04

Too late I'm afraid, I have used it. It's the master test kit that you mentioned just now, that I bought, so I do know all of my levels (they were tested at my lfs). I have used the 'proper ph' before and it was ok but I do understand your point. I was worried about this myself and I asked them about it but they assured me that this was better than leaving it like it was. I am really worried now. I have no choice but to see how it goes. I added some stress coat so hopefully the fish will not get too stressed.

I'll keep you updated. Thanks for your advice.