Breeding Synodontis Nigriventris

[Amneris3]

Hi all! I am looking for information on breeding S. nigriventris. If anyone here has been successful, I would love to hear tips. I am new to planet catfish and still trying to figure out navigating this site. I apologize if this topic has already been discussed and would appreciate being pointed to any information.

Thanks in advance!
Amneris3

While I am waiting for a reply, I will elaborate on my situation a bit. I have 4 UD Cats by themselves in a 20g long with mopani, driftwood, an anubias, pvc pipe, a ceramic log and I also created some depressions in the gravel. I believe I have 2 females, 1 male and 1 that is juvenile yet. I am changing 1/4 of the water every other day with cool water. Today is day 3 and I found 1 egg on the underside of the mopani. I wanted to get some pictures of the UDC, so I may have interrupted them.

[Birger]

There is not much info on this

Keep doing what you are doing and keep us posted.

A big problem may be trying to save the eggs before they get eaten.

I think the same with many of the other small synos

Birger

[Amneris3]

Thank you for the reply Birger.

Hmmm. Is it the parent pair that eat the eggs or the other cats? If I could determine a spawning pair, I would remove the extras. The few articles I have read suggest the parents attend to the eggs and fry so I wonder if the conditions are off in any way, do the parents eat the eggs?

I did remove the egg I found and have it in a container with tank water. If the egg is fertile and undamaged, I read that the fry should form in 4-5 days?? Here's hoping!

[Richard B]

The eggs could be eaten by any fish in the tank, parents or not.

Synos do not, to the best of my knowledge show any parental care so I'd be interested in what articles you've read that says they care for eggs & fry

[naturalart]

If its viable, I would think you probably want to aerate that egg, strongly so that its not just sitting on the bottom of the container? Maybe hang it in a net? From what I understand if it just sits on the bottom, it will most likely develop mold/fungus; it will anyway if its not viable.

[Amneris3]

I read that from a (clearly) not reliable source on the web and wrongly incorporated it into my plans. http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/catfi ... owncat.htm

I think the egg is already getting a bit of fuzz. If I am lucky enough to get more, will probably put them in a bucket with some air.

I checked today, no more eggs. Did another influx of cool water. Probably going to start checking daily for eggs.

Off the tops of your head, is there another successfully spawning syno I could use for comparison?

Thanks for the feedback.

[Richard B]

Synodontis lucipinnis

- although a rift lake fish, easily breedable. Eggs laid in a cave (although not adhesive) - see reports in threads & cat-e-log

[Amneris3]

I haven't had any more success and the one egg I found, did fungus over.

Does anyone think it would be beneficial to isolate a spawning pair in a separate aquarium? Assuming I am able to identify a spawning pair.

My fear is that they would be uncomfortable in a new aquarium and it would set back any progress I have made, if I have made any. Then again, if I have not been successful thus far or maybe not made progress, what does it hurt to try the move?

Opinions would be appreciated.

[Birger]

I think it would be worth a try...give them a comfortable tank with a number of spawning options which include overhangs,It is usually the females that control the choice overhangs...
Could also try splitting males and females for awhile first.
Easy to tell the difference with a bit of practice.

What do you mean a spawning pair...pick a male and female that are in good shape...I would think any pair bonding is temporary at best.

Do some homework on what is best as far as water conditions etc..



Birger

[Amneris3]

Yep, I meant male and female, ideally showing some interest in one another(??) I don't know, they are very different from anything else I have bred.

Thanks for the input, Birger. Going to give it a try.

[Amneris3]

Any help identifying gender would be very much appreciated. I think I have some idea, based on info I have read, but not positive.

If there are any specific markers I should be taking pics of, please let me know.

Here is individual #1

[Amneris3]

Number 2.

[Amneris3]

Number 1 again with Number 3 on the right. The little guy is extremely hard to photograph.

[Amneris3]

And finally number 4.

[Birger]

For synos in good shape a side shot works the best for me for determining gender.

Look at the first picture here http://www.planetcatfish.com/common/ima ... e_id=13654 you will see the males genital papillae....females do not have this and are generally chubbier looking.

What are the size of your fish...they still look fairly small?

Birger

[Amneris3]

I never even noticed that on the picture. I wish it would have talked about it in the description.

So the papillae is only visible on males? Is it always visible?

The largest fish is 3" in length. Here is a side view. I can clearly see the papillae. He is individual #2, from previous post.

[Amneris3]

Individual #1 is about 2 3/4". It also had a visible papillae.

#3 is very small, not quite 2". It doesn't have any visible papillae, but is probably a juvenile yet?

Individual #4, same size as #1. This one I am not so sure about gender.

[Birger]

Individual #4, same size as #1. This one I am not so sure about gender.

Female

Also keep in mind the measurements in the Cat-eLog are in SL, that is from the tip of the snout to the base of the caudal fin as opposed to TL (total length).

I never even noticed that on the picture. I wish it would have talked about it in the description.

It is on a long to do list I have not been able to get to.

Birger

[Amneris3]

Yes! I have a female!

Do they appear of breeding size and age then?One I have had for 3 years, 2 for about 2.5 years and the last little guy was purchased within the last year. I really have not found much information on lifespan or maturation time.

Thank you so much for your help, Birger, and for taking the time to answer my questions.

[Birger]

You are welcome.

The two larger ones should be mature I would think.

Birger

[Bas Pels]

If you get hold of a copy, Helmut Pinter has published breeding results of this fish. However, this was long ago, in the 1960 or something. Although his book was long in print, I have not a clue whether is has even been translated into English or not, whether is has been reprinted or not, whether he had the species he claims to have and so on.

But it might be worth the try

[Birger]

What was the title of this book...he seems to have a few?

[Bas Pels]

the Original title was Hanbuch der Aquarienfischzucht, Alfred Kernen Verlag, Stuttgart

It was written in 1966, my copy is a fourth print from 1978

He dedicated 2/3 of a page to S nigriventris, mentioning

water hardness 6 DH, 24-27 C. Small clusters of eggs are seen, sticking to the darkest parts of the windows, being light-yellow and ~2.5 - 3 mm across. Their stickiness is not very large and during maturation some of them fall from the window to the bottom.

Hatching after 7-8 days, and after another 4 days the fry starts to eat Artemia nauplii. During the first weeks the fry swim normal, belly down, only in the 7th or 8th week they start to swim upwarts down.

Growning is very slow, and they only become sexually mature in their third year. In order to get the females to produce eggs the fish need lots of food, such as black mosquito larvae.

Apart from body shape, the difference between male and female is also noticable by looking at the dots on the body: females have few lage dots, while males have more, smaller dots. On the back of the head and neck the malt has a row of small dots, which are missing in the female. Schortly before mating the brown groundcolor of het fishes changes into yellow-white and the spots become more Obvious.

This may not be a full translation, but it tells what Pinter told in his book. I must say, he gave only a little away

[Amneris3]

Thanks. I am going to see what I can find.

[Heck]

Interested in knowing if you ever had any success.