Otocinclus Breeding

[James0816]

Very good James!

Not so good at my end, I've seen four fast growing ones some days ago but now I can only count two and seems to me they stopped growing or are not eating that much. They already stay on zuccini, still there is some reason for them to disappear

Are you using the ground up flake food method to feed them?

[Vlacek]

Hi James,

to understand my situation a bit more, together with otocinclus there are c.hastatus , c.venezuelanus and hisonotus in the tank.
Both corydoras species are now spawning together with otocinclus. The chances that any hastatus fry survives is low as I don't have proper food for them but I'm hoping to raise some venezuelanus. Anyway, having corydoras in the tank means that sinking food can be hardly reachable for otocinclus. On top of that, my ottos simply don't go to the bottom and only stick to walls and plants. They grew fast in thebeginning and had poop hanging out of them all the time but now, nothing. They grew on what they found on aquarium walls mainly, zuccini was not that important I believe. The walls could not have been cleaned up by them to the state there is nothing for them anymore, still ottos have disappeared apart from one which is obviously struggling. I'm changing water every day now because many c.venezuelanus eggs are quickly covered by fungus (only like 10% are fertilized), so does the zuccini (strange that in my other tank I can leave zuccini for ever and it doesn't get rotten but algae doesn't grow there either).
So, I'm feeding with frozen cyclop, spirulina tabs (local product, with which I have far better experience than with anything from Sera, tertra and Hikari) and Sera micron for fry. I'm also pouring in some live artemia. My best experience for ottos is with brown algae but it needs special conditions to grow and only lasts for limited period usually

[James0816]

Started moving some of the older juvies out last night into the new holding tank. I think they are in hog heaven with all the diatoms in the new tank. I just moved over one small batch to see how they were going to do. As of this morning, all were just fine when the lights came on. Will move over another group this evening and that should take care of the older ones.

The younger fry continue to do very well. One piece of zuc was gone yesterday and the other piece was in a black out conidition. There were that many covering it. I really should keep a camera down there for times like this. Will put in fresh pieces today.

I delayed the water change since I was catching the fry. Will do that once all the bigger juvies have been relocated.

[James0816]

Hi James,

to understand my situation a bit more, together with otocinclus there are c.hastatus , c.venezuelanus and hisonotus in the tank.
Both corydoras species are now spawning together with otocinclus. The chances that any hastatus fry survives is low as I don't have proper food for them but I'm hoping to raise some venezuelanus. Anyway, having corydoras in the tank means that sinking food can be hardly reachable for otocinclus. On top of that, my ottos simply don't go to the bottom and only stick to walls and plants. They grew fast in thebeginning and had poop hanging out of them all the time but now, nothing. They grew on what they found on aquarium walls mainly, zuccini was not that important I believe. The walls could not have been cleaned up by them to the state there is nothing for them anymore, still ottos have disappeared apart from one which is obviously struggling. I'm changing water every day now because many c.venezuelanus eggs are quickly covered by fungus (only like 10% are fertilized), so does the zuccini (strange that in my other tank I can leave zuccini for ever and it doesn't get rotten but algae doesn't grow there either).
So, I'm feeding with frozen cyclop, spirulina tabs (local product, with which I have far better experience than with anything from Sera, tertra and Hikari) and Sera micron for fry. I'm also pouring in some live artemia. My best experience for ottos is with brown algae but it needs special conditions to grow and only lasts for limited period usually

Definately have a water quality issue with everything getting fuzzed over. I'll get that from time to time if I don't keep up with the tank during my fry feeding regimen.

With all the other guys in the tank, sinking foods will be a tough bill even for the adults. To help with this, and mainly the fry (both Oto and Cory), grind up some pellets and such into a very fine powder. Mix a small amount with some tank water and shake well. Then you can spot feed by pouring this right over the top of the plants. Everything will get coated for the Otos. This has worked extremely well for me and I'm confident that it is what is helping get my survival rates up.

[Vlacek]

Hmm, sounds like an idea with pouring it over the plants. I was not grinding pelets but I'm mixing Sera micron (which is very fine powder also good for the youngest and smallest fry and contains spirulina too) with water. I only started doing this recently and I stop the filter for short period to let the food sink down. I'll have to pour it on places where the current is very low all the time I guess. BTW - how strong current do you have in your tank? My is moderate I'd say. Small ottos liked to stay on the wall where the current was strong. Probably also algae grew there fastest. Shame c.venezuelanus have so low fertility rate and it's a nightmare to split good eggs from useless ones which get fungus in 24hrs and spoil water further. They lay like 100eggs in a day, twice a week now. Hope the vittatus will lay another set of eggs. Have to improve on water quality in the meantime but don't want to supply them too little food either

[James0816]

This round of Oto rodeo is complete. All the juvies are now out of the breeding tank and in the holding tank. Some were pretty easy to get. Others were just plain stubborn. It'll be about another two weeks and they will be able to find good homes.

Prepping fresh zucchini for both tanks. Will have to recharge the CO2 as well but that will be a weekend project.

[James0816]

Approaching the one month mark for the latest arrivals and all is just perfect. Today I visibly counted (37) babes in the tank. Fat and happy. Zucchini's don't stand a chance. I'm going to start adding an additional slice in there just to ensure everyone partakes...I.e ... the adults.

Over in the holding tank, the babes there are doing well too. Think I will hold on to these guys til the end of the month and then find them some homes.

[Vlacek]

Hi folks, I have to admint that I've failed to keep small otos alive. They've all died within two weeks despite very good start they have shown. They simply stopped eating even though feeding conditions have not changed. If it was a water quality, I'm not sure. I've only started daily water changes when they were like a week old. Out of three species (o.vittatus, c.hastatus and c.venezuelanus) which were spawning at the same time, c.venezuelanus have proven to be the hardest as quite a few fry is doing well and are now my primary focus as otos have stopped spawning. Probably really best to keep otos separated from other fish in order to be able to provide only food for them and not to spoil water with anything else. On the other hand, I have another tank which has probably much better water stability and quality but this is not suitable for otos either as there is literally no algae growing. So some "mess" is needed in the tank with otos

[James0816]

Sry to hear that. The first couple of weeks are the toughest thats for sure. If you can make it past that point, there is a very good chance of making it to adulthood. Definately could make it harder with the other species in the tank as well.

If you keep everyone in the same tank still, try spot feeding the powder blend using a droper or a turkey baster. This will enable you to directly cover the plants where the wee ones are at without disturbing them or anyone else. Just let it flow out easily so as to not create a huge flow at one time.

[James0816]

Babes have done wonderfully and continue to grow rapidly. Looks like I will have to start moving this batch over next week at the rate they are going. The tank is literally swarming with activity. I'm going to leave one additional male in the tank this time. Let's face it, papa Oto is a bit old now but still having fun. ;P

20% water change with mild gravel vac in all tanks. Will be recharging the CO2 today and adding fresh zucchini.

I have finally decided to split up the Macros. I've been saying it for a long time but giong to pull the trigger this time. It will probably be tomorrow when I get around to it. The ladies are just so plump and they are really trying to keep the guys' attention. Maybe with one gentleman in the tank, things will change.

Nothing new on the Cocama front. They remain active and doing well. Just no sign of a spawn. I need to tweak the scape in their tank just a bit too.

[bigdaddyo]

I have a group of 9 O. Cocama that I want to try breeding and stumbled across your thread here. Thank you for sharing your experiences with the rest of us.

[James0816]

You are most welcomed. I'm sure hoping to break ground in the other species. In due time. Takes patience. I really want to find O. flexilis and O. mimulus too. I keep mentioning that just in case someone finds them. Have to keep it fresh on peoples minds.

[James0816]

Came home to a pleasant and very unexpected surprise today. No...nothing with the Cocama's.

While checking in on the juvie Vittatus, I found a wiggler on the front glass. Closer look and I found a total of (4)! Did not expect this at all. There were no tell tale signs and the tank has been too active for a viable spawn. I never saw any eggs either. Which such a small amount of fry, this spawn had to be very small. A lead up to a bigger one in the coming days. Kewless.

Checked in on the Macros and all seem to be doing well. I need to get a few more after splitting up the boys and putting them in a different tank. Might just get a female and throw in there with them so they don't feel too left out.

[Vlacek]

Hi James. How are things with you?

Have some news my end. Firstly, I'm successfully raising oto negros (either they are hisonotus or otothyropsis, can't really tell). Again, great difference between fry left in comunity tank and fry raised in small breeding tank where they could find some spots of brown algae. Later ones grew twice as fast as those left in tank . Bare bottom and some fist size rocks seems to be a good approach too. I fed them with Sera micron powder. They are now 2month old and around 2cm long.
This week I had another spawn of vittatus. My only female is still extremely fat after laying about 30eggs. She is more than three years old I guess and I'm not sure how long will she stay with me. Interesting thing was observed - since morning till evening, she was laying eggs and a male has never left her alone. In between spawns he was sucked to her body! Haven't seen this before.
I also got hold of three cocamas recently but not sure about their sex, they all look the same.They are all longer than my vittatus male so I'm afraid they are all males but they were all the same in the shop so I had no choice really and they are almost 10times more expensive than vittatus They are doing fine so far. Do you treat cocamas any different compared to vittatus?

[joe323]

Its funny you bring the cocamas up, because I have very recently been contemplating buying a couple of them from thewetspot and attempting to keep them in the same 30gal long that I am using for my spawning group of vittatus. In there is a school of C pygmaeus (~20), a school of vittatus (~15) and several Sakura red shirmps. The C pygmaeus just came in last week and are doing well but are a bit small to show spawning activity yet. I'm hoping they are immature and not just all males

My pH is just under 7, temp is 78* and I do 33% water changes every week. The otocinclus and shrimp are fed daily a jello I make from pea/carrot baby food and agar...(btw thank you James for the idea). The pygmaeus eat BBS and NLS Small Fish Formula and surprisingly the otos seem to eat both the BBS and NLS lately as well. I got very lucky with a large group of wild otos that readily accepted prepared foods.

What do you guys think about potentially using this set-up for a small group of cocamas as well? There is plenty of room and the tank is so heavily planted, I occasionally have trouble finding the otos...until that agar jello hits the water that is.

I will post a video of that later

-Joe

[James0816]

Been a spell since I've updated. Time for the younguns to move out. In the process of moving them and finding new homes. Did a partial trim on their tank. Think I overly hacked the aquatic Kudzoo (Subwassertang). I didn't feel like removing the wall this time to trim it. It's not too bad but.....

Ladies are showing signs that they are ready but there is too much activity in the tank with the wee ones. I'm expecting a new spawn any day now.

Unfortunately, nothing new to report on the Cocama's or Macrosphilus.

O. Flexilis and O. Mimulus are still on me hit list so if anyone has any leads, certainly drop me a line.

[James0816]

Good news! Good news!

Routine maintence today in all the tanks. Using my typical method of a drip line to add the water back into the tanks one gallon at a time. Just went down to check the jugs and replace the empties. A look in the Macrosphilus tank and ..... drum roll please ..... Houston ... we have a spawn in progress!! YaY!

The bad part though, most of the eggs I saw are not viable. Very typical with a first spawn though. Finally a break through for these guys. Now all eyes are on these guys to see the progression. Get the routine down and hopefully we'll be good to go.

[James0816]

Quick check of the Macro tank and I was only able to find (3) eggs. I snapped a few pics but none turned out. After analyzing the pics, I found that one eggs is non viable even though by eye it looked good. Wonder what happened to the other eggs?

Light bulb <insert voice of Gru here> .... it dawned on me ... I have (3) Pygmy Cories in this tank to. Know how Cories will eat their own eggs .... I'm pretty sure they would eat others to if they find them. Hmmmmmm ... might be time for a relocation project for them guys.

I'm getting ready to go back down there and give it one more glance over before the lights go out.

[James0816]

No eggs or fry were found yesterday. Will continue to monitor for future developments.

[Coriequest]

I haven't caught the pygmaeus eating their own eggs but they are the only ones it could be! I added a breeding net, it increased fry survival...took out six goos sized fry two days ago.

[James0816]

I'm gonna move them to another tank today just to be safe. Took me this long to get the Macro's to spawn so want to give them every opportunity to have another go at it.

[pel]

Hey James,

just wanted to congratulate you for this wonderful thread and your breeding success of otocinclus!
*thread bookmarked and subscribed to*

Best of luck for the cocamas!

Philip

[nvcichlids]

Hey james,

Any updates? Happen to find any new species?

Hope all is well!

[James0816]

I always love present surprises.

Let's back up and then get back up to speed. It's been a very long time since I've updated my journal. Got busy with work and such I just haven't really done much with my tanks. They are pretty much just "surviving". I really let them go and am ashamed of myself. I haven't noticed any new spawning during the very brief moments I get down to the fish room to feed and top off. Heck..I haven't even done any water changes <ducks for cover>. And to be completely honest....I haven't a clue the last time I did a water change. Just feedings and top offs. About all I had time for. I barely have enough time to get on the puter from time to time.

Fast forward to today. Tired of seeing these tanks in their current conditions, I decided to take a stand and get some better time management going. I'm starting with my high tech tanks. The first one I started yesterday. The plan was to pull all the plants, scrape the glass and get rid of all the <blankety blank blank> duckweed.

Today, I finished pulling the plants. Netted out about 98% of the duckweed. I then fabricated a duckweed filter using a small powerhead. I put the filter in the tank and turned it.

As I was watching it do its thing, I saw something swim up and lite on the front glass. Upon further observation...it's a wiggler! WOW and KEWL at the same time. Then I saw another on the side glass. I decided to remove the filter and then put a sponge over the HOB intake. I wound up counting (4) wigglers in the tank. I parent group is (5) and they are still rather young which surprises me. I wouldn't have thought they would be ready to breed yet.

This particular tank wasn't even a planned breeder tank. It was really more of a test tank for Otos as the pH is extremely low (<6). They are Vittatus by the way.

So now, I need to get the water cleared up again and get the plants put back in.

I'm really limited on time but will try and keep this more update and I apologize for all those that have been following and not getting their fix with updates.

Annnnnnnd....if people are still following......I am still looking for O. flexilis and O. mimulus.

[James0816]

Now I really feel bad. I just went and installed the pre-filter to protect the fry. Started looking around and found a newbie. Not more than 24hrs old! Crap! Now I'm wondering if I washed away any eggs and/or other babes when I rinsed off all the plants. Ding Dang It!

[pel]

Hey James!

thanks for coming back with updates, I really like to read your success story! I mean even if you don't take care of them as you used to, they still spawn. As far as i know you are the only constant otocinclus breeder, that reports to the interwebs.

What Otocinclus did you breed so far? What is happening with the Cocomas?

Greetz,
Philip

[nvcichlids]

Hey James,

I just got everything situated in my 14 gallon biocube for some otos. I have a group of 6 cocamas being held by a fellow club member. My question is, do you keep any other fish with your breeding otos? I thought I remembered you stating shrimp, so I would assume they don't eat the eggs? Do you think pygmy corydoras would eat the eggs as well? I look forward to your input on them.

Thanks agian for such a wonderful thread!

[James0816]

Hey James!

thanks for coming back with updates, I really like to read your success story! I mean even if you don't take care of them as you used to, they still spawn. As far as i know you are the only constant otocinclus breeder, that reports to the interwebs.

What Otocinclus did you breed so far? What is happening with the Cocomas?

Greetz,
Philip

Thanks Phil. Mainly Vittatus at the momnet. I had one small spawn from the Macrospilus. No luck on the Cocama's as yet. But we're still trying. I'm still trying to land Flexilis and Mimulus as well. Absolutely no luck there as yet. One day hopefully.

[James0816]

Hey James,

I just got everything situated in my 14 gallon biocube for some otos. I have a group of 6 cocamas being held by a fellow club member. My question is, do you keep any other fish with your breeding otos? I thought I remembered you stating shrimp, so I would assume they don't eat the eggs? Do you think pygmy corydoras would eat the eggs as well? I look forward to your input on them.

Thanks agian for such a wonderful thread!

Thanks and you're most welcome. If you are trying to breed them, I wouldn't keep any other fishies in there. I like to keep shrimp in the tanks as they keep things nice and tiddy. They also take care of the eggs too. They'll eat the non-viable ones and pick off stuffs that settle on them.

[James0816]

Now that the dust and Superstorm Sandy have cleared, I looked in the "other" tank today and was able to find (3) wigglers out and about. Didn't know if they would make it or not since I broke the tank down and scrubbed down all the glass. Active little buggers I must say. I'm not doing anything special in feeding these fry guys. Being a high tech tank, I have to keep the balance. So far, they are doing well.