Ant Problem

[AndrewC]

My fish hut has been up for roughly 4 years at the back of my garden, and i always knew ants were under the slabs beside the hut, but i never thought they would eventually try to get in the hut.
The fish hut is a timber frame fixed on top of a concrete floor slab, thank goodness i didn't make a wooden floor on top of the slabs, what a nightmare that would have been, the internal walls are polythened and lined with plywood, which i'm sure is a good seal.
For the first couple of years think i didn't have any hassle with ants, but a couple of years ago ants starting find cracks to get into, i sealed the cracks where they were getting in and it stopped them that year.
Last year i tiled under the tank racks, three tiles out and four tiles up the wall, which sealed the joint between the bottom of the hut and concrete floor slab, and it did it's job that year.
I also paint the hut each year to keep the cladding in good condition and i thought it sealed the cladding from the ants.

But this year i think ants have nested in the timber frame.
On Wednesday i killed about 50, then on thursday i killed about 100, but yesterday they were all over the place, and i am finding them floating in my tanks.
I don't mind ants and usually just squish them, but i found a ball of ants with around 30 floating in a tank, that i don't like.
I can't see any ant activity outside the hut, so they must have got into the frame.

Because it is fish safe, i have been spread Diatomaceous Earth everywher in the hut (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Diatomaceous-Eart ... 33659ef44e), along all corners of the hut floor, and a foot or so under the lino and around my water storage containers, where i can always see them hiding.
They are coming in behind a water storage container and i need to take the belfast sink out to get the container out, so just now i am basically spreading Diatomaceous Earth in the hope it kills the ants and it is also carried back to the nest.

I am so tempted to drill holes right around the hut and poor commercial ant powder down the cavity, but with the ants i am finding in my tanks, i could wipe out my fish because of the chemicals in it might getting carried into my tanks.

Has any body else had a problem with ants like this and how did you deal with it ?
Will Diatomaceous Earth kill the out ants in the long run, is there anything better for the job ?

[Firestorming]

These are from a site that I get a lot of "remedies" from:

ANT CONTROL SUGGESTIONS

Using Borax in the following ways will help you with your ant problems:-

1.. Mix Borax with Honey, A Water/Sugar Solution or with dry Sugar, place into lids off of jars and put around the nests build dirt up around the lid so the ants can get in and place bits of sticks from the edge into the mix so they can get back out.
They will take the mixture to the nest where it will kill the queen and the young.

2.. Mix Borax with water and pour into the nest.

3.. Or set a hose up to drip into the nest at a good solid drip rate, in three days the ants will move, hopefully to someone elses yard.

Another ant control suggestion:

Ant Killer (safe for humans and other vertebrates)

1 cup sugar
1 cup molasses
2 T yeast

Mix together. Puddle mixture in lids (placed upside down with the goop in the middle) and place the lids in the ant's paths. They will almost literally toss down anything they are doing and flock to it. So many they will eventually suck all the moisture out, I put out a couple drops of water in the center to help them clean up. It may start to look white because most of the molasses is gone, but that's ok, you really only wanted the molasses to attack the ants anyway and once they've found it they have make a trail to it. They take it back to the colony and feed the lovely sweet nectar to everyone they see, even the queen. Put new solution out as needed until they slow to a trickle or stop. You've then killed the whole colony. But it will reinvigorate itself, so stay vigilant. Store excess in the freezer.


I always keep my tanks covered when trying to remove ant or other pest invasions

[joefish72b]

Use Neem Oil, it's widely accepted as a natural pesticide. It isn't harmful to humans as it is used in some medicines. It biodegrades and breaks down in sunlight so no worries. Insects hate it and all you have to do is spry it all over the floor and around any spot you see the ants coming in. The ants get it on themselves and then when they clean it drives them crazy. It may take a week or two but they will leave.

One other note outside structures are better made out of non wood based materials. One thing you might want to try next time is spray liner like linex. They use it in the bed of pick up trucks, it sprays on and solidifies in seconds. Works just like the heavy plastic bed liners. You can build your structure and then spray liner the inside before covering the studs, that would keep everything out.

[AndrewC]

Thanks for the reply, i am going to check out the ingrdients for the Ant Killer (safe for humans and other vertebrates).

I have found the ants are hiding in the plastic runners for my tank covers and when i open the sliding glass lids, it gathers them together and they then fall onto the waters surface, i'm sure that's how i found a ball of thirty of them in one tank, though usually i am just scooping out one or two at a time.
Plus my glass tank lids have a small angled bit cut off the back corner of them to provide access for my cannister filters inlet & outlet pipes, which is where the ants get into the plastic runners.

So you have found that once you get the ants under control, they can come back.
It looks like i am going to have to drill each cavity in the framing and pour plenty of Diatomaceous Earth into each cavity and plug the holes again, it will be the only way i am sure of killing the nest.

Is Diatomaceous Earth the best thing to put into the cavitys to kill the ants, or is there any other fish safe substance that would be better for the job ?

[Bas Pels]

if you know where thge nest is, pouring boiling water into it will kill almost all ant there - and this is where the queen is

killing the queen implies the whole colony is dead

but obviously, finding the nest might be a problem

[slackline]

Diatomaceous Earth
If you use it, make sure you use food grade. The other stuff is bad for your lungs. Food grade is awesome for ant control.
Scott

[AndrewC]

Thanks Bas
I am in the process of drilling a 1/2" hole in each bay right around the hut and pouring three or four kettles full of boiling water in each bay through a funnel, hopefully this will do the trick.
I see a few ants getting washed out of the corner that they are entering inside the hut, but not as many as i thought, the bottom boards of cladding are fixed well and will split if i remove them and i don't have any spare boards, so only time will tell if i have got the queen.
Pouring water into a timber kit frame is not the best thing for the wood, but needs must.

I will just fill the drilled holes with polyfilla, and they will give me quick access in the future if i need to do this again.

[joefish72b]

The boiling water remedy rarely works. Most times the queen is secluded inside the nest and kept in an area that doesn't see water penetration. Is there any chance your structure is more of a foraging place rather than the location of the nest? If so the queen will not be in the structure.

I see your biggest issue being "non lethal" form of pesticieds. I have many options but none work as quick as chemical killers. Here are a few options for you:

2 parts molases 1part yeast 1 part suger, place it in areas of activity and allow the ants to bring it home.

50/50 mix of vinegar & water add pepermint for added strength and just spray in areas of activity.

Repellants:Peppermint, Lavender, Eucalyptus, Cinnamon, Fresh Ground Black Pepper,Bay Leaves,Whole Cloves,Red Chili Powder (sprinkle liberally or make a paste with water and apply at entrance),Red Pepper Flakes,Salt,Used Coffee Grounds, Sage, Cucumber Peels

Excellent repellant mixture: Get the hottest peppers you can buy, blend them up in water in a blender, strain mixture and put the liquid in a spray bottle to spray areas of activity. (caution the pepper oil will burn your private area so WEAR GLOVES THE WHOLE TIME)

[AndrewC]

Thanks for the help.
The ants have receded to only a few i am finding each day.
I have a large task ahead of me this weekend, removing the sink and storage tubs, cleaning the hut and filling every gap in the hut with silicone.

Still not sure if the ants nest was in my hut walls or it was just foraging ants, the reason i thought the nest was in my hut walls was because of the numbers of ants i was finding, there was hundreds of them, for a few days in a row i was killing hundreds of them.
The diatomaceous earth seemed to be helping as the days went on, i was finding the ants concregating more in groups in places and they were not as active as when i was first finding them, making it easier to wipe up large groups with wet paper towels.
I also noticed after i started spreading the diatomaceous earth around the walls of the huts and around the storage tubs, i was limiting the ants foraging.

This weekend i am going to lift a layer of 2ft slabs that go right around the hut, and contaminate the ground around the hut with diesel.
There has always been ants under the slabs beside the huts and i now i realise the numbers there could be, i am going to try stopping them coming near my hut for good.
I have a large tub of Boric Acid powder, but i think animals will not notice it easily, whereas, animals will smell the diesel and keep away from it.

[roybo]

Mix Borax with Honey, A Water/Sugar Solution or with dry Sugar, place into lids off of jars and put around the nests build dirt up around the lid so the ants can get in and place bits of sticks from the edge into the mix so they can get back out.
They will take the mixture to the nest where it will kill the queen and the young.

Been doing this for years, works great!

[AndrewC]

I decided against lifting the slabs just now and i am trying baited food that will hopefully get carried back to any nests and kill them.
The brown powder around the bottom of the hut is diatomaceous earth, great when it's dry, but not as good when it has rained.
It will be interesting to see the numbers in the tub tomorrow.

The baited food made up on Saturday afternoon.
A tub has been placed on each side of the hut.


The baited food is two tablespoons of boric acid powder mixed in with some jam.


Sunday and i see the ants have found this tub easily.




The crack in the slab where the ants are coming from just now.

[Coryman]

Andrew,

I am afraid you have a big problem that can only get worse, unless you tackle the whole problem.

Firstly in a wooded fish house we give ants the ideal home, warmth, dampness and all that wood to chew on to make nests.

I had a massive problem a few years ago and eventually found a nest that almost filled a quarter of the roof space of the fish house. Removing the nest and the thousands of eggs did not stop them, even after dosing everything with strong bleach. After a closer inspection I found that they had chewed through a lot of the buildings main frame as well as making runways in the polystyrene insulation. Something to remember with polystyrene is that it will and does over time absorb moisture which not only makes it poorer at insulating, it becomes ideal for ants to tunnel and nest in.

I ended up stripping the shed out a third at a time and replaced all the chewed and rotten timber, then after giving all the walls a good coating of wood preserve I added a good dusting of ant killing powder. I then used 2 inch kingspan insulation throughout, which was then boarded over with 1/4" ply board and the whole inner of the shed was then fiber glassed up to the top of the walls.

As yet I have not seen any signs of ants. Now I get slugs!

Ian

[L number Banana]

Hi Andrew,

Keep using the borax solution. It does work. Takes a little while for the queen to eat enough to kick the bucket but that's why a weak solution is best, you want to make sure they keep feeding it to her.

I work in horticulture and this is all we use. Have for years and as long as the solution is weak, it will continue to work as the queen is killed and new queens set up.

Peppermint oil makes a good barrier for places that are dangerous like electrical boxes.Apply it to the outside of the box with a cotton swab. Don't get it on your skin.


Patience and good luck.