Newly Adopted & Ill Eupterus

[MatsP]

I understand your feelings, but at the same time, if it wasn't for IDIOT fishkeepers that release their fish in local streems and waters, these fish wouldn't have to be exterminated. They never existed in the past on Hawaii islands, so the only reason they are there is because someone didn't do the right thing.

I know bristlenoses are cute fish - but they are in the wrong place...

--
Mats

[naturalart]

Sorry GF, cant tell gender from that pic.

If you can remember, take a magnifying glass to check the roundness of the sand. Its not silica itself that I'd be worried about, its the shape of it, and what other elements make up the sand. I don't think you want it cutting up Nui's whiskers or hardening your water.

I dont condon people releasing exotic fish on foriegn lands. Particularly in Hawaii; island ecologies are so unique and fragile. And I know Hawaii has lost alot if its native wildlife. Really a sad story.

googols

[GoldenFeather]

Hey all.... Midnight hi's!

No sand... The manager had said he "had had" silicate sand not "had" it. My blunder, what's new? So I'm going to check out the "pool supply" industry to see what we have available on this island. I may have to go with gravel.. at the end of the day.

Thanks for your hopes... I realize many of you continue to hope along with us as we strive to better Nui's world. Thank you so very much for that...so very much. Tonight he plays with a new catpappa leaf waiting for my midnight attentions... soon sweet Nui...

###

Oh the planeria... they really reminded me of something. Have you ever seen something and KNOW you've seen it before... a lot!!! That was me with these. They swam just like.... I couldn't recall! Was driving me crazy! They reminded me of mosquitos. You know in their like pollywog stage? (don't know what it's properly termed)

Well I found a thread (other site) talking of mosquito larvae in the gell of some frozen bloodworm types. I don't know if they were they or planeria. They look and swim exactly alike. With the naked eye that is. I found one long worm thing and all the others were regular mosquito/worm size. Were that long one a mosquito it would have to have come from the Amazon as we're known for our large insects and it was giant.

GPlex, GF

[GoldenFeather]

I understand your feelings, but at the same time, if it wasn't for IDIOT fishkeepers that release their fish in local streems and waters, these fish wouldn't have to be exterminated. They never existed in the past on Hawaii islands, so the only reason they are there is because someone didn't do the right thing.

I know bristlenoses are cute fish - but they are in the wrong place...

--
Mats

Yes, they, Are, IDIOTS! I'm trying to think of how best to address this. I have a little experience in raising public awareness and am retired from that type of work now. But I wouldn't mind doing something in these regards maybe. I've now come across five different catfish here even though that study only picked up on one. On Maui we have the evidently foot long pleco of some species I've yet to learn. We also have the channel and blue catfish that the state brought in for fishing purposes loading up a couple resevoir with them on O'ahu. (The state of Hawaii also introduced Oscars into the same resevoirs in the 1950's)

On O`ahu and Kaua'i we have the little Corydora Aeneus in the streams. So thus far, ,I've found five. Frankly I'm overwhelmed I mean there are evidently over 4000 introduced marine (fresh/salt/brack) species. But we're just talking about cats. The only realistic way for me to accomplish anything is to remain within that limited frame of reference only. Anyway, thought I'd just confirm for you that we've many idiots here the state being the biggest one. There are horror stories , literally, because of what they have introduced into our environment to mitigate or address this or the other thing. All levels of flora, fauna messing up the whole biota. In some areas we're in crisis because of it.

Ancistrus temmnickii (?)
Corydora aeneus (?)
Pleco - Maui (?)
Pylodictis olivaris (Global Invasive Species Database)(1920)
Ictalurus punctatus (1958)

And I believe there may be more. I also feel a need to own a bit of responsibility in these regards by virtue of my newfound love of Nui and Li'i. See I've also learned of a couple people who have released their GAE's into the wild. What a completely HORRIble detriment. What pain and suffering they've inflicted on the other fishes be they endemic, indigenous or introduced. And I can't take the idea of someone dumping Nui into a stream. Though, he may like it... maybe. Our environment does not meet their needs, perhaps a small example but the temmnickii's upper temp limit is 75°ƒ/23.88cl and summer days can get near 90°ƒ/32.22cl. And maybe they adapt, fine. But they don't adapt to extermination when the state decides they need to protect a native species their presence inhibits or has removed. Then they're killed in the most efficient and cost effective not necessarily humane way possible.

There's a gross lack of awareness in regards the tropical fish buying public. And the LFS community have some portion of responsibility regards them. I'm thinking of beginning there and of sending a letter to the editor perhaps, just to see what happens... if anything at all. Either way, I'll have some direction.

I'll close this for now but do have a question re: temmnickii. I read in the Cat-eLog that they're rarely imported. What is the reason for this? They're sweet, small, gentle... plus the have the only bushy nosed females? I'd think they'd be popular?

Googols Everyone... for putting up with this kinda off topic note... only kinda off topic tho' because I considered it part of my search for Nui's new tank mates and then it went and turned into an issue as well.

(((((smile)))))
GF

[GoldenFeather]

Sorry GF, cant tell gender from that pic.
barble
If you can remember, take a magnifying glass to check the roundness of the sand. Its not silica itself that I'd be worried about, its the shape of it, and what other elements make up the sand. I don't think you want it cutting up Nui's whiskers or hardening your water.

I dont condon people releasing exotic fish on foriegn lands. Particularly in Hawaii; island ecologies are so unique and fragile. And I know Hawaii has lost alot if its native wildlife. Really a sad story.

googols

Hi Natrual,

Thank you yeah? Sorry about that picture. I have another I think was the one I originally had in mind when I sent the last. It's just a bit better. I'll continue trying to capture his tummy side. Thank you too for letting me know how to check the sand. This type of information is invaluable to me as knowing nothing I can really mess things up (like buying sand that cuts up his tender barbles and mouth). As this record is evident now and then... (((smiles))).

Googols and Googols for you, GF

[GoldenFeather]

Here's the photo Naturalart,

Nui Tummy Side Up (smile)

Well, now that I've uploaded it I see it's too dark for a page. Um, but I'll wait to hear from you, colors come out different... (apple/pc wise) I'm on apple. Let me know. I'll take it into photoshop and just tweak the contrast a little to see if it helps. If not, will just try again another day...

Googolplex,
GF

[naturalart]

Hey you're on Mac too? I thought I was the only one. Cool. I love my mac. Any way, yeah the pics too dark. If you can bring it up, lighter, maybe we can see something. Also a profile shot would be possibly more effective. If the thing sticking out of its vent is pointy=male. If its smooth, rounded=female.

Doesn't the LFS carry natural sand/fine gravel?

googols

[GoldenFeather]

Happy Friday Night Everyone
This is a post for Andywoolloo...

Andy, I've been going through our collective thread here and I found your photos and have a question. Your beautiful Euptera in the 2nd photo from the bottom, right above the sweet Lucipinnis?.... It looks like it has "blue" eyes. Does it? I know it may be the lighting but had to ask you.

BTW, it was real pleasure looking back through them again. They are so very beautiful. And the one that's depicted with the erect dorsal fin is amazing. Look at the feathers! Wow... !! must be from your careful care. Your love of them is obvious.

Thank you googolplex,
GF

[andywoolloo]

they do appear blue don't they? maybe it's just a reflection thing. I am not sure.

I do care for them very much. the little gluttons.

[GoldenFeather]

Hey you're on Mac too? I thought I was the only one. Cool. I love my mac.

Hi! & Nope, you're no longer alone... we're mac & cat relative now. We have a PC too but just for Scott's GIS/mapping stuff otherwise we're 101% Apple. Europe well, most of the rest of the world outside the U.S. and Hawai'i ... have always been PC dominant no.

Any way, yeah the pics too dark. If you can bring it up, lighter, maybe we can see something. Also a profile shot would be possibly more effective. If the thing sticking out of its vent is pointy=male. If its smooth, rounded=female.

I found a couple other tummy shots with things showing. But had to tweak the contrast on all of them. I'll do my best to get a good shot when possible. But, I'm now 99.9% positive Nui is a girl!!! I can't believe it. I totally stereotyped her due to size and look. How disgusting... (me not her!!!) I'm such a jerk. I've had a good look at things there and she definitely has a rounded pink nub. I recall taking serious note of it because I thought it was the other spot and was worried it was an emerod or sign of blockage. hmph... but it was her "the kine"...

• •friendly side note: "the kine" is local slang here which can mean anything at all. When you say "the kine", the one listening just knows automatically what you're saying... You use it for words you can't think of or– words you wish to refrain... But you understood hm...like that.

BTW, I've found a couple other tummy shots of Nui and am posting them. Have had to tweak the contrast on all...(photos are weird but her the kine shows up better). And I remain hopeful of getting another op to get a good one. Though with the catappa water (quite dark amber/brown) I'll have to do it after a water change.

Further now, I'm having a NH3/4 & NO2 spike today... I over fed yesterday. Well I didn't over feed them but I definitely had food in the tank for an excess amount of time. I'm trying to get Nui independent of my hand and net feeding. So after feeding him a small portion only, I let food loose into the tank.

Twice yesterday and late last night, I put the food in the water and left it floating the surface. I coaxed him out but he doesn't want to go up. Maybe there's too much surface action from two filters do you think? He gets about two inches from the surface, brushes the food with his barbles and darts back down. He did this twice last night, all around the tank and then back to his cave.??? Go figure?

Oh, I should also mention that he gets his barbles, the little ones with all the branches, stuck in the net now and then. He doesn't panic, he just stops and pulls gently back. I've pulled back once not lnwiu


And now I have do do a good water change. My NH3/4 is nearly .25 and my NO2 is the same +. So I'll wait to hear from you all on this one. I'm looking forward to your ideas on what to do and opinions on what I'm doing. Especially if I'm incorrect. Please.

So that's that on the front here in Nui's world.

Doesn't the LFS carry natural sand/fine gravel?

googols

I don't know about that shop I've only been to once but it's likely I guess. Petco only carries the coral sand. But I've been thinking about our black sand here. We also have red, green ad others. But I'd like the black. I found a thread that's discussing these sands... (re: aquaponics not aquruaria) it says black sand brings your pH down (that's great for us)... and someone says they'd heard the red which is cinder not sand, pushes it up.

Natural, you wisely mentioned my need for concern when using live sand due to the often high content of crustaceans and shell due to my high pH issues. But the black sand (I think) is mostly basalt and obsedian, the green olivine and peridot and the red/cinder and out of the question anyway. It's very rough.

The black sand to my hands' memory is soft, smooth, however, I'll need to take my loop to it to really check it out if we decide to take this consideration further. My other option now is gavel. I don'w

I'll close for now sending...
A Googolplex X A Googolplex of Thanks for Everyone...
Readers, Advisors all of you Wonderful Thinkers and Fishkeepers...
...for putting up with my seemingly endless, mostly interesting, sometimes tragic and always hopeful...
backs and forths and ups and downs.

My Heart,
GF

[GoldenFeather]

Hello the Clan,

I have good news I want to share with you...hope it's okay...

I became a new Aunt this morning!

My youngest sister Sha'ni, gave birth to3 a baby boy Caleb Kawaikapu-o-Maui (kah-why-kah-poo-oh-mow-ee) he was born of 9 lbs within 22"... !!!

Happy Sunday...
GF

ps: thanks for letting me celebrate wtchya

[ginagv]

well that is indeed joyful news!

congratulations to you and your family.

Gina

[GoldenFeather]

Hey...
<snip>

Any way, yeah the pics too dark. If you can bring it up, lighter, maybe we can see something. Also a profile shot would be possibly more effective. If the thing sticking out of its vent is pointy=male. If its smooth, rounded=female.

I found a couple other tummy shots with things showing. But had to tweak the contrast on all of them. I'll do my best to get a good shot when possible. But, I'm now 99.9% positive Nui is a girl!!! I can't believe it. I totally stereotyped her due to size and look. How disgusting... (me not her!!!) I'm such a jerk. I've had a good look at things there and she definitely has a rounded pink nub. I recall taking serious note of it because I thought it was the other spot and was worried it was an emerod or sign of blockage. hmph... but it was her "the kine"...

My Heart,
GF

Hi Natrual....
Forgot to upload the images...

Here they are, tweaked and all...

USD Nui 1 of 4....

2 0f 4

3 of 4

One more, 4 of 4 in next post...

Googols, GF

[GoldenFeather]

Here is the last one...

4 if 4

Looking forward to hearing if these will help.
Thanks...
GF

[naturalart]

Hi GF, congrats on becoming a auntie. Maybe you can turn him into a aquarist when he gets older.

The pics are great. But a side long or profile shot would be very helpful. That little pink nub is probably what I'm referring to when I say pointy or smooth round. If it comes to a point (like a cone) its a male, and just moon-shaped with no point its a female.

Yes, I'd take a look at the black sand through a magnifyer. Whats smooth to our hands may be abrasive to a little sensitive cat whisker. It doesn't have to be perfectly round, just no sharp edges.

googoley

[GoldenFeather]

Hello PC Friends,
... I've really missed you.... much

Things have been busy of course, won't bore you with events beyond our beautiful spectrum here... I've been keeping up as I had been with water testing, parameters being watched. I posted the last spike I had. Boy... I should have expected my NA's would go off since my others had but didn't and did another water change to get it back in shape quickly. It worked.

Haven't had any issues since until three days ago when I noticed the worms again. I'm just hoping they are planeria and not nematodes. I've been doing a lot of reading and still can't land on a target. I've just read one tho' that said that nematodes can cause white feces. We had that yesterday. I just don't know who it came from. I'm thinking Li'i... the little poopbot. She eats and poops at the same time. That same text I'd read also said it causes bloating and loss of appetite. No problems there. I'm wondering if the white feces is due to eating the worms perhaps? It gets light when I feed zucchini and cucumber but this was pretty stark white in comparison – yesterday's.

Other than this all is well. I don't have new substrate yet and I'm glad of it at this point. I'm going to clean the larger filter which seems to be a worm breeding ground. I can stand bent at that side of the tank and just suck up worms as them come out of the flow. Not like a ton, but perhaps 3 every 30 seconds to a minute. Which seems a lot to me. I first noticed when I did a water change yesterday, the filter had been off for an hour. I filled the tank and when I turned it on, they came flooding in. Tons. I was able to retrieve several but not near all. I've been stirring things up just to suck them out or net them out. Not easy but seems effective. Tonight I'm cleaning the filter though before turning it back on. I want to get rid of them soonest I'm able. Especially if they are nematodes...

Regarding substrate I've decided on a small gravel. Can't find a source on my island or anyone willing to special order it. Not worth their time and I understand. Regarding our beach sand, I've thought better of it. Besides its' physical make-up, I'm not sure of other things like parasites what la? How to ensure it would be safe. Perhaps there'll come a time I'll know better, how to prepare it properly etc... when I do I'll be able to reconsider. Also, worms have me worried, I can't imagine getting them out of sand... So I have found a nice small looking smooth gravel on Ebay. Haven't checked Aquabid yet but will. One they have called "Oklahoma..." looks nice. I need to ask the supplier about their source, how they go about attaining it, their process. I also think I'll ask for a sample if that's not to much? I'm thinking that sellers who cater to the aquarium fishkeeper community should be dependable. I've found them so thus far at least.

Regarding tank mates, I've been thinking I should just take time enough to research things well. Learn how to take care of Nui and Li'i well. Li'i – figure out how to deal with her. I've just developed a strong urge to go about it slower. I was feeling a strong urge to acquire more fish soonest possible. But Nui doesn't seem to be lonely... rather more of a loner really, though he likes to know where Li'i is. But that's about it. I don't observe any other social leanings or needs with him. I know he'd really enjoy watching other fish as he does catappa leaves or my hand cleaning the gravel but that's about it.

I read today that the planeria worms are a sign of really poor water quality. I can't figure that into the equation though. Parameters are fine, no gravel but a couple cups though I found a huge amount in a plastic plant thing from the old tank, got rid of it. It was missing several stems. The base holding the thing, had holes drilled in it to hold these stems and it was in these holes that they made their home. So when I'd moved it before to vac the gravel beneath, they didn't show up. It wasn't until I held the plant under the out pour of the filter and gave it a good rub with the thumb that they all came out. Gadz it was gross. It took me a couple times before the idea came to throw the thing away. Duh

I'm planning on changing out some of the filter media tonight when I clean it. Also sucking out the junk stuff and all the water and worms from it. Hope this works to help take down their population. SO hope it. Wish us luck!!! we need it I think...(((smiles)))

Well in closing, I really have missed you all... I found you cross my mind regularly like a good friend does. You and the PC have become a welcomed addition to life, an actual part of life, it's great! I've truly come to appreciate you in a googolplex of ways.. . Helping me save Nui and Li'i's lives! was the start and continuing on helping me become a fishkeeper and hopefully I'll become a good one. In so numerous of ways this has been inexplicably wonderful, frightening, challenging and rewarding. Thank you, from the deepest depths of our human & fish hearts for you & to you, ...along with our our warm tropical best wishes for you and Yours – human & non...

I'm going to cruise the planet now to see if there's any news from your end of the world and waters... and to do a little research...

Take Care Everyone,
Our heart,
GF

[GoldenFeather]

Regarding substrate I've decided on a small gravel. Can't find a source on my island or anyone willing to special order it. Not worth their time and I understand.

Oops!

That was in regards to sand... can't get anyone to special order it. Gravel I'm sure they would, but things here are much more expensive in some cases than what I can get online. Including shipping. Maui prices are 30% above the other islands (all) and Hawaii prices are some high & of most everywhere else excepting Japan... etc. My sister moved to the UK a couple years ago, said their prices are higher. Wow!

Anyway, I think getting the sub online is my best bet cost wise...

So glad to be able to be back on with you all... GF

[MatsP]

Planaria isn't a sign of poor water quality as such - it's a sign of overfeeding. Continue that, and you do indeed GET poor water quality. But the worms are simply there because there is food there, they don't indicate water quality as such - they are just doing what they do best: reproduce. Remove the food, and two things happen:
1. The fish will be more hungry -> eating the planaria.
2. Less food for the planaria -> less baby planaria -> less adult planaria -> even less baby planaria -> etc.

--
Mats

[naturalart]

I'm thinking that sellers who cater to the aquarium fishkeeper community should be dependable. I've found them so thus far at least.

I would be careful not to make that mistake. There are bad apples in every bunch, and aquarium suppliers/sellers are no exception.

Do all the aquarist there in Maui just use colored rocks?

Sounds like you just may have found the breeding source of your worm colony. Another possible source could have been the cattappa leaves. Didn't you say you collected the leaves yourself?

And also, personally, I think Nui is a boy at this point.

googols

[GoldenFeather]

Hi Youguys...

Thanks for the quick responses! I get it re: the life cycle and food with the worms. And yes, I've found the colony... I cannot spell the sound it makes me feel. I can't even make the sound it makes me feel. Inexplicable place where extreme disgust and freak merge into a mindscream in all my response centers. I am totally freaking freaked out. I haven't got the filter back together and going. I don't know what to do. It is totally infested. I am such a freaking Freaking IDIOT! I've got all the media out and in zip locks. All separately. I took the plastic cartridge frames out of the bio-fiber sacks and in that zip lock (w/plastic cartridges-2) as well as another with the four blue spikey bio-balls in it – put a half teaspoon of sea salt and hot water, about one quarter cup and shook. They died. And they numbered in the thousands maybe. from long ones to specks which I think are their young. If so, then there are millions as I see this in the tank water. I've been changing out 50% each day the past three days since I found them again. I had taken out the catappa leaves... and then put them back when all was okay. I think you're right in that regard, Natural...


I think these are "nematodes" though I actually can't find any photos online like these. I've taken some photos...below and want to wait for some responses. I'm holding off on killing everything in the filter... though we do have another healthy one going and I've started up a small 20 on it just for some extra current at this wormy end of the tank. The tank isn't actually wormy... unless its filled with microscopic babies... and probably is. GAGuragh I did just clean this filter what... less than two weeks ago. I did not look into the wells though... I just scooped debris from the water in it with a net. Hadn't even thought of looking inside. I am wanting to kill everything in there. Sea salt worked great on the other the plastic media... I'm thinking I could do the same in the filter wells. It's a double welled thing. The center is full of them too... (it's just so freaking yuck)

Also, when I used the sea salt and hot water on the bio-sack cartridges, lifting up the lip of it, the same sort of thing was going on there but much less. When I added the salt and hot water they all came off as very small worms not long thick things. Just little 1/8" threads.

Here are photos of the worms I'm thinking are "nematodes"...

Right Filter-well - see worms in corner and along water line

Bridge between both filter wells... where impeller is located.

Left Filter-well - see worms in corner and along water line

Another post ahead with a single photo of the right corner an hour after this one was taken. The shape changed. And now hours and hours later they are all submerged away from the light I suppose.

Thanks a Googolplex... tytytytyt
GF

[GoldenFeather]

Here's a fourth photo... a second shot of the right filter-well one hour later:

• 

  Right Filter-well (2 of 2)

HE

I hope you don't mind but I need your help deciding how to deal with this. Should I completely redo the filter. Clean it all out, Set in new media – new bio-bags on salted-cartridges and well squeezed sponges, perhaps having salt treated the sponges?. In order to clean them out I think I should do hot water and sea salt treatment on the filter wells/walls etc and permanent media. Boiling water evidently kills them as well (140°ƒ). My tap is 150°ƒ at its' hottest (tho' by national standard is suppose to be 135°ƒ).

Also, I should say that I don't see this in the other fliter. Though it could still be infested. They perhaps don't hang out above because the media in that filter fills the entire well... with sponge at the top and above water line about 1/16".

As well, the strange opaque/clear mucus like long poops I've been seeing, posted it last month and also back in the 10G days just before leaving when I stopped feeding Nui is when it showed up! Now that I've stopped feeding again, mostly, it's back. And, Li'i has white poop which I've read some negative responses too where nematodes are concerned. And I guess that's my first question. It's definitely my first concern, their welfare, their life, is it at risk here. I've read it could be because of parasitic worms... and that there was loss of life in some cases.

That's it for the mo... I look forward to any help with this....

Googols Bigtime,
GF

[naturalart]

There are thousands of species of nematodes and probably hundreds of species of annelida worms, as you may know by now. In order to find out the life cycle of your particular worm you may have to talk to someone at a University, and then they might not even know. I'd say, in the short term, at least they aren't adversely effecting you fish visibly. It sounds like you may have to approach this as a management problem for a while. You could just tear the whole tank apart, but that won't guarantee you'll get rid of the worm. I would just keep vaccuming them out and cleaning your filters at each regular waterchange. You could take your filters and rub salt into every square interior inch then rinse in the sink under boiling hot tap water. Alternate salt dipping your filter media as you have done. Don't worry too much, the beneficial bacteria will return. And maybe salt dip your cattappa leaves. Some people keep a teaspoon of salt in their tanks. This may help I don't know.

Make sure no uneaten food stays in the tank. Fish are "cold-blooded" so you don't want to feed them like they were a dog or a hamster. They don't need food available all day long and missing a feeding every 3rd or 4th day won't hurt them.

Finally you could enlist the assistance of fellow tank dwellers. These are the fish of the picker/gleaner clan. two fish that jump to mind for you are the pencilfish and barbs. But I would caution that if at all possible I would find out the lifecycle of this worm beforhand.

googols, gotta go to sleep

[GoldenFeather]

Natural...

Googols for that response, it was calming to read. Just having another perspective is really helpful. So I assume these don't look familiar to you. I hope someone here will recognize them, be able to identify them for us. Tell us their proper name and the best address. I need to find out soonest I can, if they are affecting the fish. They say that if these are "scavenger" worms they are harmless... they match the identification description. But they also match others. Though I've seen nothing on this "corner gathering" up the wall... that part, for me, is what freaked me so badly. Like a scary movie.

The two natural remedies for worms I've found are – salt and garlic. The salt recipe/formula is: 1 tsp salt per 5 gallons. But we can't use salt with Nui or our other Cat beauties right? Actually I've read a couple articles that claim doing a "salt treatment" in your tank won't hurt the catfish. They say it's perfectly harmless done once in a while with them. You mention a spoon of salt in the tank. I don't know if that small an amount will have any effect on them (worms) though. I've also read that garlic is great medicine for parasites/worms in the fish if they'll ingest it... The one I'd read today was an experience... the fish had long stringy white poop & worms coming from it. They were also constipated. The garlic flushed it all out. The trick was getting them to eat it. Evidently some like it... They finally succeeded by mixing the garlic with cut up and mashed together prawns. Sounds good to me.

Determining the "life-cycle".. Well... I actually set up a jar to observe them when I found them in the tank the other day. I put in a little (very little) gravel and food. And they've pretty much disappeared into it I think? But speaking of disappearing...

I went to look inside the filter today after posting the photos and found most all of the worms were gone! The surface was clear, the walls too... I could see nothing but a bunch of junk on the bottom which could have been them... but it seemed to little and too much debris to be or seem likely. They aren't in the fish tank. I went ahead and added a bunch of salt to the filter water... it killed almost all if not all the worms under the water. I stirred it all up well with a stainless steel spoon... and doing so saw that in fact there were still thousands in there, just all broken down into small tiny worms. One of their tricks I've learned. I cut one in half to see if it would kill it. A long one about 1/2". The two pieces just continued on living, both wanting to get out of there, jusjt sliming off in different directions.

Back to the wells... ended up there is a giant worm in each well who may have eaten the majority. This worm is not slick and slim... no sleekness to it. At least not all relaxed or dead now... would be were it stretched out. And I've seen how far a 1/4" worm can stretch, these big mammas could probably stretch to inches. One of them is well over an inch and quite a bit thicker than the other one. I couldn't get a shot of it, may still before tossing them out. Will try.

While cruising through other threads on nematodes, I don't find photos!!! I really wish there were. Having images to reference, especially in this area could be of value. Especially if it turns out that what ever particular parasite or worm it is, proves dangerous. If you haven't googled i mages on nematodes and have a weak stomach, don't. Suffice it to say they can do much harm...

Thanks in Googolplexes Natural for laying out a plan I can work on. I get lost when I'm so worried and stressed... all thumbs physically and mentally. Just give a a list and I'll do it. Thanks more for recognizing that...

,
GF

[GoldenFeather]

Hi All...
... sorry about getting on the phone in the middle of our conversation back there. my bad 'M's! ... really just some sloppy finger work.

Nui and Li'i both have lost some appetite. It is definitely significant though because both of them have such voracious ones normally. Nui is also lethargic... more than just hanging out in his tunnels. He's sleeping more I think too.

My parameters are:

pH= 7.8; NH3/4=.10; NO2=0; NO3=20+

That's it, at least as far as I can test things yet. I need to get back to the tank. I'm going to do a gravel vac and water change. Try to pamper Nui out of this.... um Well I'm going to wake him up for one thing. BTW Natural, while he was sleeping this evening, he slipped out of his tunnel. Thus I was able to get some near perfect shots of his genitalia. Yeah! finaly....

GF

[MatsP]

The ammonia level is slightly worrying - it indicates that your filtration isn't doing enough of a job to clear the ammonia. This could be caused by your filter cleaning... I would say that whatever the worms are, they are definitely an indication of "too much food in the system" - in particular, it would appear that a lot of food is entering the filter. Are you feeding flake food that is entering the filter before the fish get to it? As suggested, some suitable fish that eat "bits of food left over" may also help.

Otherwise, your water quality seems to be good.

As stated before, fish don't necessarily need a huge amount of food, and they have a slower metabolic rate than warm-blooded animals. [Being warm-blooded is a compromise between the ability to be active in cold parts of the world (or cold parts of the 24 day cycle) and the need for food to keep the warmth - cold blooded anmials don't need to "waste" energy on warming their bodies, so can live on less food - but are then more limited in their "operational range" when it comes to temperature - they get sluggish when it's too cold].

Also, I would definitely make sure you have your filter running, with or without worms - because not running the filter media will just make things worse.

--
Mats

[GoldenFeather]

Hi Matts,

Thank you for the response and advice. I'll be able to get the other filter back on the tank either tonight or tomorrow morning. I have it apart and the parts have been salted. I need to make sure their rinsed well and am afraid rushing it I'll make an error some place.

Also, I have another filter on there that is more than adequate. It's an Aquaclear 110 / 60 - 110 US gallons. So filtration should be alright. I checked parameters this morning. The Ammonia had zeroe'd out and the others are the same as last night. I also added the little TetraW 20 on the end where this large Whisper came off just to agitate the surface.

Regarding the filter picking up flakes. I don't feed them the tropical flakes anymore. So no it isn't picking up there... it's picking up from the bottom of the tank. Its' intake tube sites about 1/8" from the bottom surface which means it catches food. I think bits of wafers and sinking pellets mainly. Which I'm now realizing I need to get to sooner as wella s needing to get the the filter more often as well. I also think it may have gotten a couple frozen bloodworms. I haven't always been 100% successful in retrieving what he doesn't get.

And when I cleaned it last, I didn't get everything out of there. I should have I realize that now. I just didn't imagine they would be in there.

So I'll get the other filter on it when I return from my trip to the other side today. Thanks again for the advice and lesson in cold-blooded beings as it relates to diet portions. Makes more sense now, I hadn't know any of that. googols..!

Aloha,
GF

[naturalart]

Did I say teaspoon? sorry, late nite delirium. But it sounds like you have a handle on it anyway.

I'd shorten my up tubes for my filters about an inch above the bottom of the tank. That way you dont get so much 'heavy' stuff in the filter.

look forward to more pics.

googolplexi

[GoldenFeather]

look forward to more pics.

googolplexi

Hello after a long long day... phew,

I've some photos for you Natural. Hope Nui is a boy for real. I'd like you to take a look at the largest image. That was a close as I could get. The little nub area above the pointed area...? ... there's like a swiggly thing going across the nub like a quarter of the way up. I'm worried it's a worm. Tried to find an arrow in Photoshop...? I can make one if needed... but thought I'd see if you could pick it out first. What is that? I'm hoping its something like a fold in the thin flesh around that hole. God I hope so.

Nui's (Euptera) genitalia (image 1 of 3)

Nui-g_03.jpg (53.68 KiB) Viewed 3090 times

Nui's (Euptera) genitalia (image 2 of 3)

Nui's (Euptera) genitalia (image 3 of 3)

I hope this area is what you were describing. It isn't exactly a profile... no it's more a portrait angle. I'm so glad he did this. It was funny, I looked up and he had just slipped out of his tube sleeping.

I look foward to your responses...and When can I see your Euptera Natural? Can you post some here or in a new thread? Please....

Now that I look at the photo again with that thing I'm worried about going across that nub area – I think it is a worm. Is it... It's huge if it is...


Thanks a Googols, GF

If it is... what do I do?

[GoldenFeather]

Happy Thursday All.

Well, Nui's appetite has dwindled. He doesn't have one. Didn't want to eat last night. I tried even though I need to not feed right now because I was worried... I thought I had noticed it tapering off so wanted to confirm. He wouldn't eat even bloodworms. He'd probably eat frozen ones but it shouldn't take that and I don't even want to put frozen food in right now.

As I look at that photo I think that thing is a worm. I mean I can see it traveling under the skin beyond th e orifice upwards into his belly area. Am I imagining this? It does not seem normal. And while it does look worm like, I have to admit it doesn't look like these worms... but that may be maturity. It is much thicker and a darker shade. It also looks relaxed so not stretched smooth as they look swimming or even dead. But I'm without a scope so can't really say what they truly look like. And I don't want to know either. They gross me out to no end. But I'll do whatever it takes to get rid of them... ESpecially if they are internal.

If they are internal, there must be medication I should use. Though I had read that one post I mentioned regarding using garlic to flush our parasitc nematodes. What is the risk if this is what they are? And what shall I do... how quickly can I do it? I have garlic. I also have Quick Cure, but that is all. I think I may have a friend on our main island that could perhaps pick something up for me there and get it to me fairly quick if needed.... ?

Googols...

GF

PS: I'm not feeding them but am also keeping a close eye on things due to Li'i. She's tried once so far that I saw to get on Nui... he knocked her off. But also he's a sound sleeper and if he isn't feeling well. Today finally she's back to scavenging around the gravel that's in there. Hopefully she's eating them. There's not enough algae in the tank yet for her... is another issue for her to deal with. Not easy I'm sure. I may have to give her a wafer today. We'll see...

[GoldenFeather]

Hello the evening...

I wanted to let you know that Nui ate... 7 sinking catfish pellets (the little ones).

I have these other sinking pellets a seller sent me in their stead at first called "massivore". They're giant... but I think the same stuff. He wouldn't touch it.

I'm wanting to know from Matts what a normal amount of the sinking pellets would be? Given the cold-blooded needs or lack of them. Is seven too many, too little? My experience so far with Nui is that he'll eat the number of these I put down first. If I were to give him three, he'd eat them but no more if I were to add a couple more. He then wants a different food if he's still hungry. But too, I suppose tonigt he may have built up an appetite.

Anyway I'm thrilled he was hungry and needed to let you know since I gave him a bad symptom in my last post. I don't suppose a Syno Cat that is ill, and has lost his appetite because of it, would eat like this, right? Still, I remain concerned over that little cord of flesh or wormy parasite in that last photo.

Looking very forward to some opinions, advice etc. when you're able with time available.

Googols,
GF