Strange L-183 behavior (video and pics included)

[bsmith]

I recently put a bunch of caves in the tank. The first day after putting them in I found my larges male in the largest cave. No big deal, thats to be expected. Then just a few minutes ago I went down to do my nightly feed/viewing and the big male was still in the cave he picked out with about half his body hanging out of the cave but the strange thing is that the female in the tank was doing pretty much the same thing just across the tank. Bristle nose plecos have got to be the easiest plec to determine sex for sure. I believe this other plec is a female because I have males that are only slightly larger who have a whole head full of bristles and this one still only has them on the edge of face in the front, like females do.

Big male


Female (imo)



Video
http://vimeo.com/17482497






Am I just reading too much into this because she is a female that is doing the same as the biggest male in the tank? Or is this actually pretty normal?

Thanks.

[kouen]

Its OK. They like to seat in caves, all F/M

How old they are? What size (sm)?

If you want to breed successfully you need to by 1 strong Male and 2-3 females in adtion. You will understand “why” few months later ;)

[bsmith]

I have been trying to get as many females as possible but there harder to get in relation to males than I would have thought. You dont happen to have a good source of females do you?

I understand the 1m to 2-3-4f ration just makes more sense for the dominant male to have a nice harem. The big male I have is about 4 years old and about 12cm from tip of nose to the tip of his tail. The female I really have no idea how old she is but about 8-9 cm tip to tip.

[apistomaster]

I must have gone through at least a couple orders of a dozen of a single species of plecos when I decided to try to breed them in order to end up with "harem" sized breeding groups. Between the male heavy skewed sex ratios and initial high losses, it took dozens of specimens to end up with the groups I wanted.
I did not know much about who was or wasn't a source of healthy fish at first and would receive entire orders of severely diseased specimens. I bought the majority of my present stock 6 years ago.
The wild Ancistrus are often very male heavy because the collectors think we want bushy nosed fish and then there is the issue of plecos in general where males may be so reluctant to leave their nests that it may make them more easily captured than the wandering females.

[bsmith]

Yep, im sure there are a bunch of factors contributing to the males being more attainable. I thought I read somewhere that there are more males period even in the wild. Could have been another fish I dont know.

Much like Dario Dario when they first came out. The people who had them only kept the females so breeding would be hard or near impossible for the normal hobbyist and then that the males are the only ones that have the magnificent coloration. Females on the other hand look as plain as a bait minnow.

It would be great if the big male and that mature female could just run into each other. I try my hardest to get down and watch them when the tank lights are on but there are no other lights on in the basement and its dark outside. I feel like im a lot less visible then. But it always amazes me when I sneak down there and am 15-20 feet away from the tank walking very slowly and they seem to react to my movements. They must have some pretty good eyes or at least be able to detect movements well.

[trebor69]

Are you saying its curious that the female is caving?

I have several pairs....and for sure most females avoid the caves except when interested in breeding. They usually hang out behind driftwood. I do have one though that I am pretty dam sure is a female but it always hangs out in a cave like the males.

[bsmith]

Are you saying its curious that the female is caving?

I have several pairs....and for sure most females avoid the caves except when interested in breeding. They usually hang out behind driftwood. I do have one though that I am pretty dam sure is a female but it always hangs out in a cave like the males.

That is the exact reason. I have never tried to breed plecs but was always under the impression (perhaps falsely) that only males will claim/search for caves.

[apistomaster]

The only way caves help in sexing a group of plecos is if you only provide a couple of caves do it this way then it is almost always the most dominant males which claim them.

[exasperatus2002]

I have a pair (1:1) of ABN's and they both claim a cave of their own. I like watching my male with his. If one of my fish comes to close to his cave he'll flare out his odontodes.

Grrr...

[bsmith]

Just to be clear. I didn't put the caves in there for sexing purposes. I put them in there to hopefully get some spawning activity started.

The reason I posted this thread was because I was under the impression that only males would exhibit this type of behavior. When I went down to the basement right before I started recording what I saw was two fish in caves on opposite sides of the tank doing the exact same thing (bobbing slightly, raised dorsal and caudal fins and also sweeping the caudal fins back and forth with their tails where I know for certain that one is a male and the other is a female. Whats more is that this female is in a tank with a pretty big male and another male that is certainly larger than her and another male that is slightly smaller.

Again I just didnt expect to find a male and a female exhibiting the exact same behavior.

Re:exasperatus2002

The female will pretty much scurry off under the wood if I get too comfortable and approach the tank. The big male will hang in there quite a bit longer though. I did a WC on Thursday and only when I was prodding around with the gravel siphon did he exit his cave, not going too far from it either.

[andywoolloo]

me BNs girls sometimes went in a cave or two to check it out.

My males, once mature were always staked out in one, one under driftwood.

But my females did venture in and out.

Mostly they were all over them when the male was inside and they were ready to do their thing.

Maybe she just wants to inspect them. Or maybe 'she' is a young 'he'?

[apistomaster]

BN of both sexes seek the best hiding places they can find so if you give them enough caves all will use them.
For spawning these I recommend reducing the number of caves down to just one and removing all the extra males. They should get spawning in no time.
Be sure to feed them frozen blood worms, all they want in addition to whatever vegetarian type fish food you have been using. The protein will help bring the fish into breeding condition. Maybe increase the size and frequency of your regular water changes while you are at it.

[bsmith]

me BNs girls sometimes went in a cave or two to check it out.

My males, once mature were always staked out in one, one under driftwood.

But my females did venture in and out.

Mostly they were all over them when the male was inside and they were ready to do their thing.

Maybe she just wants to inspect them. Or maybe 'she' is a young 'he'?

There is no way its a female. I have smaller males in the tank that have a head full of bristles. Hers are just as in female bristle fashion, only around the tip not going up towards the eyes.