pangasius sanitswongi/paroon shark/dolphin shark

scottydog · Post by **scottydog** » 08 Sep 2003, 16:43

I have recently procured 3 of these fish. All about4" in length. I know they can reach 100" as adults and am making plans to supply them to a public aquarium when they out grow my set ups. I intend to keep them species specific as I believe they eat everything including pet dogs!! Just now they are in a 3ft tank with a lovely marine blue background against which their sharky cruising looks very VERY cool... Has anyone out there any experience of keeping these guys: feeding habits, behaviour, water prefs etc... In fact anything you can tell me about them. Just now they're in a tank of fresh water, slightly hardened by a small amount of coral sand and a handfull of aquarium salt, but no more. I estimate ph to be around 7.5-8.0 just now but need to check this to be sure. If anyone can help that'd be great...

Thanks
Scottydog

Caol_ila · Post by **Caol_ila** » 08 Sep 2003, 16:52

Hi!

Imo they will outgrow your tank in a couple of months, if you leave out that a 1 m? tank is too small for 3 highly active 10 cm fish. A 40 cm Pangasius is a scary sight even in a 2 m tank.

scottydog · Post by **scottydog** » 08 Sep 2003, 16:59

I was well aware that they'd out grow that tank, but did not realise it would be in a few months! I do have a spare 5ft tank I could set up as a temporary home. They are going to a public aquarium when they grow but I hoped I'd get a bit longer before I had to say goodbye!!! Oh well, we'll see- we live and learn. Any more info out there gratefully recieved...

Post by **Silurus** » 08 Sep 2003, 16:59

Just now they're in a tank of fresh water, slightly hardened by a small amount of coral sand and a handfull of aquarium salt, but no more.

Issues of size aside, the water parameters you are providing are entirely wrong. They need neutral to slightly acidic water (pH 6.5-7.0) that is very soft.

scottydog · Post by **scottydog** » 08 Sep 2003, 17:20

Thanks. It's all been absolute guess work up until now. I didn't even know what the things were called when I took them in. I have a fish breeding/keeping programme in my school and just took them in blindly cos they looked cool. Fortunately I have plenty of room for development and good links with a large public aquarium so I knew I could cope with big guys to a certain extent... I do think they're great to watch and plan to get full enjoyment out of them before they move on. The kids in the school love em also, but are desperate to chuck all the other fish in with them and watch the resulting masacre. Kids eh???

pturley · Post by **pturley** » 08 Sep 2003, 18:53

What makes you think that a public aquarium will want them? IME, Public Aquariums are very controlled and calculating in the fish they will take in(or should be). They do not just accept fish from anyone who walks in off the streets.
Not only do thay have to plan and (more importantly with your fish) budget for the long term care for the fish in question, they cannot provide for the VAST number of fishes imported and sold in stores.
Take the Cleveland Zoo for example: They will (very rarely) take oversized Pacus, Myttennis and similar species (from SA only). However, all of these are most likely to be added to the Spectacled Caiman tank and not to a display. They have a clearly defined list and a clear polocy on these species.

Public Aquariums usually have a clear "wish list" of target species they will accept and generally, that list is kept very short.
Even if your fish are on their list, they will still likely have to certify the health of the possble donations prior to acceptance. Most Public Aquariums take husbandry responsabilities EXTREMELY SERIOUSLY (their AZA certifications depend on it). If anything about how you are keeping your fish is not up to par(like too small of accomodations), acceptance would be questionable if not unlikely. Your fish will likely be TOO BIG before you can even get approval to accept the fish from the Curators. I wish you luck... I hope those links you mention are VERY strong.

To just EXPECT you can drop them off like the local dog pound in just DAMN IRRESPONSABLE. I have seen the same

mentality in the Herp. community regarding Burmese and Reticulated pythons.

Good luck with your new fish,
Sorry for the tone, this is just a bit of a pet peeve with me.

Sincerely,
Paul E. Turley

BTW: Your long term plan for these fish should be to avoid all chemitherapeutics, feed and care for them VERY WELL, and should end up including some Thai' Chili-Garlic sauce, rice noodles, coconut milk and perhaps some lemon-grass. UMMM, Soup!

scottydog · Post by **scottydog** » 09 Sep 2003, 09:45

A very very good friend of mine is a fish curator!! I take his amphibs for research, he will take the paroons... This is not poorly thought through. Your chip must weigh heavy!! If you need any workout tips to help your shoulders cope, I'd be glad to help. I'm delighted to be patronised by yourself. I understand your point but you are jumping the gun significantly, even for a colleague from accross the pond. I refer to earlier points- these fish were dropped on me by someone who didn't want them (the reason I know not). I liked the look of them so took them in - I would have taken them even if I didn't like them, but would probably have looked at moving them on quickly rather than enjoying them for a while. For info, one of my 5 ft tanks is maturing for their short term move, this will be ok till further arrangement can be made. I do have a 15 ft set up in my entrance lobby but do not want to re-home from this tank if poss. As I say, your point is valid but undirected- shooting from the hip comes to mind. My main expertise is with amphibs but do love keeping fish also, and have been doing so for over 20 yrs- these are a species not at all common in Scotland- hence my confusion. Your point still gives me little direction on correct husbandry- my main concern at the moment- I am trying to create a good natural environ for these guys and am bogged down by YOUR office politics. Thank you and good night. Feel free to reply-

scottydog · Post by **scottydog** » 09 Sep 2003, 12:39

For Info

Situation now sorted. The fish will live in 5ftx3ftx3ft tank until around 8" long, at which time they are to be transferred to a large display tank with suitable conditions. There will be a period of quarantine to ensure specemins are healthy but the eventual home are overseeing their interim care along with me so things should be ok. If anyone out there has or does successfully keep these guys I would be very interested in hearing how they manage mature specemins??? I am lucky in having the space and finances to keep many fish but these must be the largest fish appearing on the common freshwater market-- 8feet long is a big fish to have for anyone but the most astute private fishkeeper. I'm surprised that in the UK there's no permit required for these fish as other large cats (wels, channels etc) all require permits... If anyone has info further to this please let me know. Anyway, for the next few months I'm gonna enjoy their shark style anctics and watch them flourish..

Cheers

Dog

pturley · Post by **pturley** » 09 Sep 2003, 14:07

All patronizing aside;
Just as there is the rare owners of Burmese pythons that plan accordingly for their long-term care, I guess there is at least one rare individual that actually planned ahead for the long term care of this large catfish species.

Simply put, you initial post didnâ??t provide enough information regarding your long-term plans for these fish. To simply state you were â??making plans to donate the fish to a public aquariumâ?

scottydog · Post by **scottydog** » 09 Sep 2003, 14:25

Hmmmmm, ok, good fight though eh!! If you've any spare boots I'd take a couple of pairs if you want. If not, I wonder if my big old fish would eat a burmese?

Love

Dog

pturley · Post by **pturley** » 09 Sep 2003, 15:31

Bravo, thanks for a good laugh!

Cheers,
Paul E. Turley

Tammy · Post by **Tammy** » 25 Sep 2003, 05:10

Scottydog
I sent you and email... I believe I have a Paroon shark. Growing period is slow otherwise I am at a loss. Let me just tell ya how I came about mine...
My son has a 100 gallon tank and our neighbor gave him a 50 gallon acrylic with a Koi and this sharky looking fish. We named him "Wired" As he is a middle dweller and frantically goes side to side in the middle of the tank. Goes ape crazy every once in a while (more so when I vacuum the livingroom where the tank is. ) Knew it was a catfish but that is all. I never gave it a second thought. Well it came to me about 6 inches and is now a foot long and that has been a year and a half. It has lived in a tank with the Koi and two kissing fish. The tank temp is 78 degree's and we have only fed it fish food.
Because of freshwater we never worried about alkaline or ph or anything else. This tank has been disease free and we have never had any issues. My son constantly cleans it and after filling it up pours the required amount of neutralizer in it. That is all the care we we have given it. Since I have now learned it is a Paroon shark... I have learned that it likes shrimp and bloodworms. Not about to feed it more stuff as I cannot afford for it to grow any larger. My biggest time problem is that it is just about a foot if not 13 inches and the opening on the top of the tank is a foot. "Wired" goes crazy when you try to get him and we are in trouble trying to get it out. When we took the Koi out he went ape and split his lip bouncing off the walls of the tank.
That is my experience with this fish.

Any help would be appreciated. As to the gentleman who said you can;t dump on a aquarium... he is right... cause that is what everyone keeps telling me to do but no one will take it and none of the fish stores know what it is so they will not take it.

I am in a tough call here!

Fantasia

scottydog · Post by **scottydog** » 26 Sep 2003, 16:26

Yep, cetainly a tough one. As you can see above, I've struggled with my paroons but am in the fortunate position of being able to move them on... In my reply to your e-mail I said to return to the store you bought them, but as with me, you were an adoptive parent... I did not realise this at the time of writing. It's hard to know what advice to give- try and start a new topic asking for help from other forum members. Meny people will have missed your post as it's on the end of this one which is a bit old now... most folk will already have read it. If you do know who sold them in the first place or your neighbour remembers, I would take them back on the principle that they probably should not be sold to home aquarists in the first place- we must make dealers responsible. Apart from that, I'd appeal to others who access this site for more advice. I don't want to say euthenasia is the only answer, so I won't

Tammy · Post by **Tammy** » 27 Sep 2003, 05:54

Scottydog
Once again.. THANK YOU for your additional help and support. I shall post a new one and continue my plight. I was thinking of going to the newspaper with this one especially after reading in Yahoo news about the snakefish that was found in Wisconsin and they are wondering how this Asian fish was left there. DUHhhhhh not to hard to figure out why. I know when I spoke to Fish and Game their only concern was it was not a carp or a piranha. Otherwise they could care less but told me not to dump in the nearest lake.
Well... keep a watch out.. as any news now concerning Paroon shark if not from you is from me.

Regards
Tammy

pangasius sanitswongi/paroon shark/dolphin shark

pangasius sanitswongi/paroon shark/dolphin shark

that quickly!

water parameters

public aq.

Hey ho

Been there done That... argghhhhhh