Opinions for/against the Fluval "M" heaters?

[Aquafinatic]

Ladies and gentlemen:

I hope you aren't weary of heater discussions.
A new contender has come to my attention.

Do any of you have experience with the Hagen Fluval "M" heaters?

Likes?

Dislikes?

Thank you.

[MatsP]

I used to have a Fluval heater until it broke [due to me switching off ANOTHER gadget, thinking it was the heater, and then putting it back in when I had caught some fish - fzz-crack - no more heater - "they all do that, Sir!"]

I don't see much that makes it better than any other heater (other than the "computer calibrated" and "designed/built in europe" - which of course is all meaningless marketing BS).

An aquarium heater is a pretty simple device. They all do pretty much the same thing.

--
Mats

[2wheelsx2]

Instead of spending huge money on the fancy heaters that are coming out today (except the ones which have guards/are shatterproof), I would save my money and a proper temperature controller, especially if you have an expensive fish collection, as those controllers in aquarium heaters are really pretty unreliable. I mean, how many failures have you read about? On my local fish forum, there are at least 10 cases that I personally know of, and that's just too high an incidence for my comfort.

[MatsP]

Gary, that is really a good suggestion.

Most heaters get "stuck on". I have had this happen, and I've heard of lots of others that have the same problem.

Using a temperature controller outside of the heater, and setting the heater so that it always is one (e.g. set it to 34'C), then you will have much better control.

Having said that, I use pretty basic heaters of the Visitherm Deluxe brand. They aren't very expensive, but not low-cost either. They work well, however.

--
Mats

[2wheelsx2]

Yes, I reached a conclusion after talking to few people who had problems. I had to switch heaters as the seals in my visitherms started leaking so I went with Stealths, and at the same time got the ETCI-1R control from jehmco.com: http://www.jehmco.com/html/temperature_controller.html

This way, in my 125 gallon, both my heaters come on and off at the same time, instead of all the load being on one or the other depending on setting.

[Aquafinatic]

Hello gentlemen,

As always, thank you for your valuable input. I have a few thoughts regarding what you've offered:

......I don't see much that makes it better than any other heater...

...An aquarium heater is a pretty simple device. They all do pretty much the same thing......
Mats

Fundamentally, I would make no argument with you on that point. But even though they all pretty much DO the same thing -- heat water -- and generally heat it pretty well, I have seen significant differences between brands with regard to their reliability and performance.

I have owned many dozens of heaters; I can't how many, exactly. When thinking about those I've used, three repeat problems come to mind immediately. These are not isolated problems, but ones that I have seen repeatedly, with certain brands/models:

>>Rena heaters: When new, there was some desirable "resistance" that was felt when turning the adjustment knob, and also "clicks" could be felt, which assisted in making adjustments. With about (5) of these heaters, after just a few adjustments, the tension and the clicks were gone, never to return. So after that, making reasonably-accurate adjustments was virtually impossible, as the adjustment dial was "swinging in the breeze", so to speak. My attempts at two degree temp. increases often yielded (6) degree increases. Also, with this same model, a few of them quickly got to the point where turning the adjustment knob no longer turned ANYTHING inside the heater, (such as a metal shaft), so adjustments were no longer possible. Those heaters were stuck at one temperature setting. I think I purchased (14) of these heaters, and within 6 months, approx. (8) of them were useless.

>>Marineland Stealth Pro heaters - (this is the NEW version of the former Marineland Visi-Therm Stealth heaters): I purchased 20+ of these heaters, all at the same time. After a couple of days, I observed a peculiar "bubbling" going on near one of them. Upon closer examination, I saw that the plastic case had a crack in it, and water had gone inside and started to boil. Within two months, 8 of those heaters had developed this problem. All of the others, (that did not crack open), worked great. But (8) bad out of (24) is a pretty high failure rate. ***I would like to point out that I own several of the previous "Visi-Therm STEALTH" heaters. All of them have been a pleasure to use, and are still in use in my tanks.***

>>Penn Plax heaters - (NOT the current model): I owned a handful of these. At least three of these developed an annoying problem. I would reach into the tank and adjust the temperature slightly UPWARD, usually in an attempt to encourage my fish to spawn. When returning to the tank later, I would find that the temperature had DECREASED a couple of degrees, instead of increasing. I figured that this was a result of "user error" at first. But after this happened several times, with at least three different heaters, I realized that it was another one of those heater quirks.

It was because of experiences such as these, that I thought I'd query some other aquarists, prior to buying my next batch of heaters.

To 2wheelsx2: With regard to your idea:

"Instead of spending huge money on the fancy heaters that are coming out today (except the ones which have guards/are shatterproof), I would save my money and a proper temperature controller, especially if you have an expensive fish collection, as those controllers in aquarium heaters are really pretty unreliable. I mean, how many failures have you read about? On my local fish forum, there are at least 10 cases that I personally know of, and that's just too high an incidence for my comfort."

(The 2wheelsx2 quote doesn't have the "official" look to it, because I don't know how to properly use the "quote feature" more than one time, within a post.)

I like your idea. Thanks. I didn't know much about these controllers, until you wrote this, so I did some studying. I plan to add those to my two display tanks.

But beyond those displays, I have (28) other tanks, and they are scattered in (7) rooms around the house. That would be quite an investment, to go with the controllers for all of those. So I'll do my best to choose a reliable heater.

Good day everyone!

[2wheelsx2]

I like your idea. Thanks. I didn't know much about these controllers, until you wrote this, so I did some studying. I plan to add those to my two display tanks.

But beyond those displays, I have (28) other tanks, and they are scattered in (7) rooms around the house. That would be quite an investment, to go with the controllers for all of those. So I'll do my best to choose a reliable heater.

Good day everyone!

As long as the temp requirements are the same, just get a controller that will manage multiple heaters. Mine will do up to 1800 watts. I see ones there which will handle up to 3600 watts, so with a little creative wiring, you should be able to have specific plugs run through this controller in each room, but putting it in a centralized location. However, that will of course add to the expensive too.

[MatsP]

I agree, there are some pretty poorly designed heaters - what I really meant is that the Fluval M heater is a traditional heater with a heater guard and some "fancy features" - but I don't really think that's worth paying extra for.

I have owned those heaters that stop working in the adjustment after the first few weeks. Jäger doesn't seem to have that problem.

The Visitherm heaters I've been using (which are sold in the US under the Marineland label) that I've used are the glass model, not the "stealth" model. And they sometimes get a bit "sticky" on the adjustment, but never had any problem with the adjustment not working or not being able to know what I've adjusted it to. They have a nice big scale that is clearly visible too!

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Mats

[apistomaster]

Heaters are probably the most poorly engineered piece of equipment we have to have in our aquariums. Jager seems to be the most reliable but only in a relative sense.
I have a fish box full of original design unbreakable Stealth heater. They have failed in 3 ways, do not heat at all, do not ever turn off and some are stuck in the mid-70*F range.
I still continue to prefer them because they are hard to break. The most recent design now has an LED built into the control knob so at least one can tell at a glance whether or not they are on or off.
They really needed that feature.
On the whole, aquarium heaters are junk, albeit necessary junk.