1320 liter clearwater biotope

[2wheelsx2]

I was just going to reply the same thing.

We use masonry saws with diamond embedded blades quite a lot in my business (mineral exploration). And if Haavard were to use that, he can attain a smooth surface to bond directly to the glass rather than using a glass backing. I'd imagine there'd be a number of divots/skips when cutting rock with an angle grinder.

[MatsP]

Yes, the drawback, I suppose is that Gary's diamond saws cost a bit more than £35 (about US $50-60) - the blade is additional on top of that, but if you know where to get that, it's about £20 or less (US $30).

It's a compromise between cost of tools and precision results.

--
Mats

[2wheelsx2]

Oh, I didn't mean for him to buy it. Not sure if you can do that in the UK, but we can rent them at the Home Depot for $20 a day, including the blades. The blades we use for cutting rocks are actually $100 even at bulk pricing, since the rocks we cut are actually much harder than most tiles.

[MatsP]

Ah, but the ones that you use for tiles/masonry and such are usually not cutting very deep. The stones that Haavard uses are often 10cm/4" thick, so you need a good cutting depth.

--
Mats

[2wheelsx2]

Yep, what you have to do is lower the tray and lift the blade. We use the same table saws to cut 5" diameter core. You do have to get blades with deeper diamond placement, which may or may not be possible. The other thing we do is cut on both side (for a rock to do a polished surface display).

Oops, sorry Haavard, going OT talking geology stuff. Back to your regular programming.

[Haavard Stoere]

Mats description is correct. Here is the first module with 4mm glass backing. You can`t see the sides of the glass because of the silicon.

[2wheelsx2]

I guess in your application, how the cuts look (for the backing) doesn't matter, as you cover it all with black silicone, is that right?

[Haavard Stoere]

Correct! I sand the edges so that I won`t cut myself on the glass. For final fixing to the aquarium I only use small amounts of silicone so that the modules can be pulled of later if needed.

[Flyfisher]

Thanks guys
I used to cut and core rock in a previous job and I wish I still had access to all the machinery but I live too fr from there now, or I'd be rolling up with atruck load of rocks for my old workmates to cut for me.
I will look to hiring or borrowing a rotary saw with suitable blades and of sufficient diameter when the time is here. But the glass backing use to get you a smooth surface to help bond is a very good idea.
By the way haavard, that last huge stone you added totally makes the display for me! It looked impressive until that was added but it's totally changed everything underneath from looking like a selection of rocks fixed seperately, to what now looks like an area of rock face with lots o cracks and crevises. Great addition and finishes it so well.
I always say pictures never do things justice, I'd so love to be able to stand inront of this tank of yours and witness the things you describe, especially the lighting. I will look back through , but have you a photo of the whole tank without flash to show the real light in all areas of the tank?
I was initially thinking of using a 3d background by AquaTerra. I have one in the tank I have now. But I really like a dark black background for the look of depth and I think the work and time spent doing something similar to yours and attaching rocks to the glass will be a rewarding way to go.
Cheers

[alleykat]

Hi Haavard,

i really like the serene look of your tanks:) i am currently designing my own very little aquarium (around 10% of this thing;-)), and i have a small question; i find the twigs and branches you use really nice, but i was wondering what kind of tree they come from.
i have considered various things myself in the past, but finding decent wood is difficult. and do you plan on renewing them regularly? or are they supposed to stay put? anyways, i always love reading your threads and the pics are great. Greets from the netherlands,

Tjerk

[Haavard Stoere]

Hi Haavard,

i really like the serene look of your tanks:) i am currently designing my own very little aquarium (around 10% of this thing;-)), and i have a small question; i find the twigs and branches you use really nice, but i was wondering what kind of tree they come from.

Thank you:) They come from the Lilac tree:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syringa_vulgaris
The twigs are fresh to start with, so I soak them for several weeks. They are then placed in a tank of 19 adult L204s for several weeks unntil they are strippet of bark.

Hi Haavard,i have considered various things myself in the past, but finding decent wood is difficult. and do you plan on renewing them regularly? or are they supposed to stay put? anyways, i always love reading your threads and the pics are great. Greets from the netherlands,
Tjerk

I will renew the twigs when needed. I bet they will last some time since there are no woodeaters in the tank. After some time the twigs get covered in algae and the wood itself turns greyish brown. Very cool.

Thanks guys
I will look back through , but have you a photo of the whole tank without flash to show the real light in all areas of the tank?

Sure. The foto is not new, but there will be more photographs as the tank progresses.

[2wheelsx2]

That's a great looking shot. I'm glad your shots are just like my whole tank shots where you see no catfish. I was beginning to think you had some kind of magic.

[whiteymoza]

That's a great looking shot. I'm glad your shots are just like my whole tank shots where you see no catfish. I was beginning to think you had some kind of magic.

I count at least 2 catfish!

[2wheelsx2]

That's a great looking shot. I'm glad your shots are just like my whole tank shots where you see no catfish. I was beginning to think you had some kind of magic.

I count at least 2 catfish!

After carefully looking again, I see one, maybe two. Either way, it's not like the other shots.

[cochito]

1320 litters ! Is it a normal size in Norway or other European nations? It's definitely a gigantic tank here in Japan. Not that many people in Japan can afford that kind of tanks and house to store them: the weight would damage the floor if not penetrate it.
I'm simply amazed !

[MatsP]

I'd say that a 1000+ liter tank is quite unusual in Europe too. There are a few members here that have large tanks, but most peoples tanks are relatively small. My largest tank is 400 liter, and I have one 300 liter, 3 x 200 liter and 7 x 100 liter - and my son has a 30 liter tank too.

--
Mats

[Bas Pels]

Although I never was in Japan, I understand the people in Japan are used to smaller houses then in most of Europe

Smaller houses imply smaller tanks, obviously. However, not everyone in Europe lives similarly, the south of Sweden is known for small houses too (because they are easier to heat) which resulted in smart furniture design, resulting in the IKEA furniture shops (whcih originated there), while in places more to the south many peole have more room

But personally I'm convinced in the northern half of Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium and Luxambourg combined, one will find over 1000 1000+ liter tanks, and I would not be surprized if it would turn out to be more than 5000

[MatsP]

But personally I'm convinced in the northern half of Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium and Luxambourg combined, one will find over 1000 1000+ liter tanks, and I would not be surprized if it would turn out to be more than 5000

But if you compare that to all the aquaria in that region, it's still a small proportion, right? I'd say the average aquarium sold is probably less than 100 liter (because most people buy a small tank, and never get anything bigger).

I had a look through the first 90 "my Aquaria" registered owners [alphabetically listed], which is 164 tanks in total, and I found 2 of the owners that had a tank of over 1000 liter. Of course, that's probably not very representative, for two reasons:
1. People who have big tanks, I think, are slightly more enthusiastic and more likely to put their tanks on the "My Aquaria".
2. A lot of "my Aquaria" has no size at all, and the title is not telling much either - so it may be that there are bigger tanks that just haven't been registered with a size.
3. Some people that HAVE large tanks may not have registered them (your name was in the list of names, but your big tanks are not listed - that's obviously your choice).

But I wouldn't say, from this, that 1000+ liter tanks are "common" by any meaning of that word.


--
Mats

[Bas Pels]

your name was in the list of names, but your big tanks are not listed - that's obviously your choice.

With my 30 tanks, installing the whole will take a while, and as quite often fishes are rehoused, updating it would take even more time

Luckely, nobody will mind my choice

@ common / uncommon

You are right pointing out 1000+ liter tanks are not everywhere, but I think they are less, perhaps even far less, then the impression i got

If one goes to a killyfish convention, one might find someone who has a 200 liter tank
If one goes to a cichlid convention, one will find people with large tanks - by any definition. I've heard about 10.000 liter tanks, but never seen one privately owned

[MatsP]

Yes, of course, tank-sizes vary depending on the interest of the fishkeeper. Some fishes, by definition, require very large tanks, others do not - many people prefer certain types of fish (e.g. Corys or Killies) because they can be kept in relatively small tanks. I suspect if you find the "European Freshwater Ray convention" or some such, the number of very large tanks will be pretty high in that group. But of course, there's only so many keepers of rays in any given country, because MOST people do not have very large tanks.

--
Mats

[Flyfisher]

Thanks for showing that tank pic Haavard. Very nice shot, and I look forward to seeing more.

[Flyfisher]

With so many plecos in this little 1320 litre tank of yours, even with all those hiding places, have you seen any bickering for territory from any fish?
And are there catfish that show themsleves more than others in there? And with so many high fin L200s do some hide more than others? Feed harder than others? And what size difference do you have from within this group?

Cheers.

[Lloydy]

If you want to find people with large privately owned tanks, you can probably find quite a few at http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com. Some of the fishrooms on there, are basically normal rooms made into tanks!

[Haavard Stoere]

The 13 L200s are adults or close to adulthood. They are not shy and eat a lot (especially green food). At times they get aggressive towards the smaller L240s
The 10 L240s are young adults, are not shy and eat a lot of green food and discus granules. At times they get aggressive towards the L200s
The 4 L160s are one adult female and 3 sub adults. The adult female is very aggressive towards the other plecos (she bites), but I don`t think this is a real problem. They are moderately shy.
The 4 L25s are moderately shy, but always comes out to eat. They measure around 8cms sl.
The half grown L24 is moderately shy, but always comes out to eat. I really wan`t to get more of this species. They are super cool.
The around 20 sub adult (5-6cm) Ancistrus sp L107 are shy.

There is some aggression, but none of the fish seem to hurt each other in a bad way. I can usually find scrathes on some of the fish, but nothing serious.

[Flyfisher]

Interesting Reading, thanks for that. Have you kept standard L200s to compare behaviour and feeding etc?
There's a great range of colours and sizes in your choices for this tank. And it's interesting to watch the difference in how they all
exist together. A few scrapes and scratches is nothing to worry about is it. You are indeed re creating a natural environment and in nature these feuds and territory stand offs are part of life. Great stuff! I do really like L124 but I have a feeling that a group of L200 may be the way I go one for my next big tank.
Cheers

[Haavard Stoere]

Interesting Reading, thanks for that. Have you kept standard L200s to compare behaviour and feeding etc?

I have kept both species for several years. Hemiancistrus subviridis are very shy (mine at least. I only feed them at night as they refuse to come out during the day). Baryancistrus demantoides is not shy at all. Both species are easy to feed and they eat large quantities of peas, algae wafers, krill. etc.

A few scrapes and scratches is nothing to worry about is it. You are indeed re creating a natural environment and in nature these feuds and territory stand offs are part of life.
Cheers

As a larger part of the population grows and matures I will have to take out a lot of the fish to avoid inury. Some can get potentially nasty with size. The tank will probably end up as a species tank for my 8 L25s in a couple of years.

[Flyfisher]

That sounds like another good reason to pay the extra for the high fins then I wonder if anyone over here in the UK has had success in breeding these????
It's still early days but I'm going to start trying to organise rock and appropriate saw fairly soon I think. The trouble is that most of the inert rocks that will have no effect on ph are as hard as he'll, so I guess that diamond blade is the only way to go huh?
And I bet it takes a fair few tubes of silicone!?

[MatsP]

As far as I'm aware

Baryancistrus demantoides

have never been bred. Very few Baryancistrus are being bred, in general.

A 9" blade for angle grinder from Wickes, Screwfix and such is about £20... Slate is not very hard, but yes, most others are hard types of stone.

--
Mats

[2wheelsx2]

I find the opposite from Haavard. Of course I only have 2 of each and not the crowd that he does, so that may account for the behaviour difference. My

Baryancistrus demantoides

are very shy compared to my

Hemiancistrus subviridis

.

[Haavard Stoere]

As far as I'm aware

Baryancistrus demantoides

have never been bred. Very few Baryancistrus are being bred, in general.

They have been and are being bred by Torsten Hartung, Germany.

Next winter I intend to breed mine. They are becoming sexually mature.