How much overcrowded is my tank??

[chrisinha]

Can someone please tell me how bad it is? I dont want to get rid of any of my fish, and I cant get another tank for now...

It's a 55 gallon tank

Cats:

Pl*cos: (1) 8.5" L021, (1) small chocolate pl*co, (1) adult L147, (1) rubbernose pl*co.
Corydoras: (5) albino corydoras aeneus, (9) Brochis Splendens, (1) Corydoras San Juan

Other fish:
(3) Rasbora heteromorpha (harlequin rasbora)
(4) Colisa Chuna (honey gourami)
(1) Colisa Lalia (dwarf gourami)
(2) Hyphessobrycon erythrostigma (bleeding heart tetra)
(5) Aphyocharax anisitsi (bloodfin tetra)
(10) Pimephales promelas (rosy red minnows)

I would really like to get at least 2 more of the San Juan Cory, but if it's already overcrowded obviously I cant do that.

[Richard B]

Someone correct me if i'm way off here but i think you are very overcrowded

If a 55g tank is a 48x12 inch surface area it holds about "58inches of fish" - ie 58 one inch fish or 29 2 inch fish or any combo of sizes up to the max of 58". I'll quickly guestimate the size of fish you have

Pl*cos: (1) 8.5" L021, (1) small chocolate pl*co,4" (1) adult L147,4" (1) rubbernose pl*co. 3"
Corydoras: (5) albino corydoras aeneus,2" = 10" total (9) Brochis Splendens, 2" = 18" total(1) Corydoras San Juan2"
Other fish:
(3) Rasbora heteromorpha (harlequin rasbora) - 1" each is 3" total
(4) Colisa Chuna (honey gourami) 2" each is 8" total
(1) Colisa Lalia (dwarf gourami)2"
(2) Hyphessobrycon erythrostigma (bleeding heart tetra)2" =4" total
(5) Aphyocharax anisitsi (bloodfin tetra)1" =5" total
(10) Pimephales promelas (rosy red minnows) 2" = 20" total

Maybe 87" in total which exceeds the max 58"!!! This is allowing for growth & adequate territory, swimming space etc. Recommended totals can be exceeded a little tiny bit by having massive filtration & good water quality regimes but if pushed too far the consequences can be disasterous

[chrisinha]

Yeah I was afraid it was very overcrowded. I guess I just have to start getting rid of them...

anyone in NYC who wants some fish?
can't part with any of my pl*cos or albino corys though. Most of them have been with me for a very long time (L021 was my first fish in 2004), I brought them with me when I moved from California to NY.

preferably i can give away the rasboras, bleeding heart tetras, gouramis, some of the brochis I guess. I dont think anyone would want the minnows. They were supposed to be eaten by my turtles (not the same tank obviously) but when I saw them hyperventilating I just couldnt do it and now they are all happy and getting fat

oh and of course my only cory san juan. i absolutely love her but i cant find mates for her and i want her to have mates!

[MatsP]

There are certainly more than one way to determine stocking levels, but aside from highly technical ones, the "1inch per gallon" is about as good as any other. And yes, you are overstocked, no matter what method we'd use [unless you literally do water changes every day, and you have a massive, industrial size filter that makes the volume much larger].

You would probably get the "best reduction of stock effect" by getting rid of those minnows.

And you are not alone in being greedy and getting more fish than the tank can hold. I'm pretty sure nearly every member of this forum has tried that (and nearly always unsuccessfully) at one point or another...

--
Mats

[chrisinha]

Thanks for trying to not make me feel like sh*t, Mats. That's why I've always loved this board (even though I disappear sometimes for a long time...). I'm pretty sure if I had posted this in another forum I would've been immediately "attacked".

Unfortunately daily water changes are not an option for me right now (believe me, i've done it in the past!) since I have a 2 year old (human) to take care of and boy let me tell you, it is a lot of work! Maybe I can find someone to take the minnows, without using them as feeders.

If anyone here is interested in any of the fish I mentioned, please shoot me a message. Gotta live in NYC though, I can bring the fish to you or you can pick them up. I just cant ship them. Oh they are for free, of course and only experienced aquarists, please.

[Timberwolf]

MatsP commented that you're not the only one who's overcrowded a tank. Mea culpa, too. Sometimes it's just better to be lucky than good. I also have a trio of minnows (mine are amerald shiners) and, if any one is giving any thought to chrisinha's, don't hesitate! They're wonderful little guys whose only shortoming is needing lots of room. I've been considering getting rid of mine, but my wife won't let me. Upside? I do have permission to set up a larger tank now

[chrisinha]

Thank you for your help, Timberwolf
I gotta say I like your wife I wish I could upgrade to a larger tank myself but hubby already said no and honestly I dont have the space right now. I do have my old 65 gallon tank sitting in my parents' house in Nebraska... if I ever move to a bigger apartment, I'll bring the tank over here. Very tempting, petsmart is selling a 125 gallon tank for 370.00 which I dont think is expensive at all, but I'll have to pass it. Darn lack of space!

[Timberwolf]

The two biggest factors in having tanks too small (after $$$, of course) are WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor, not intentionally sexist; it carries over from the Stereo sales industry) and AS (Available Space). Right now my issues are $$$ and AS, not to mantion a mother-in-law who could inspire a whole new generation of Sam Kinnisons and Robin Williams ! Soon, though! In the mean time, close monitoring, aggressive maintenance, live plants and lots of luck keep everybody healthy.

[chrisinha]

haha
i guess mine would be HAF (husband acceptance factor) and AS, then
on hubby's defense though, besides the lack of space, he's worried i already have too much on my hands: a 2 year old son, a 55 gallon overcrowded tank, a 90 gallon tank with 2 turtles, a dog and 5 cats. Not to mention all the strays and ferals I feed every day. lol. What can I say? I'm animal lover!

[Timberwolf]

Our manic menagerie includes 2 horses, 4 goats, 4 dogs (that just became 6; if it breathes, my better half will rescue it), 4 cats, 4 chickens, 2 pheasants, 2 geese, and a quail, in addition to a hundred, or so, comets in a stock tank (for mosquito control) and two small aquaria. Here's a thought: What's to keep you from doing a tank swap? I'd be surprized if the turtles understood the difference between the 90 and the 55 and your piscene family members would rejoice at the extra space.

[Bas Pels]

@ HAF, a small tank with too much fishes takes much more time than a bigger one with the same fishes

If you husband worries about your time, HAF will not be the problem

[chrisinha]

Our manic menagerie includes 2 horses, 4 goats, 4 dogs (that just became 6; if it breathes, my better half will rescue it), 4 cats, 4 chickens, 2 pheasants, 2 geese, and a quail, in addition to a hundred, or so, comets in a stock tank (for mosquito control) and two small aquaria. Here's a thought: What's to keep you from doing a tank swap? I'd be surprized if the turtles understood the difference between the 90 and the 55 and your piscene family members would rejoice at the extra space.

wow, Timberwolf, i hope you dont live in a 2 bedroom apartment like I do Back in the day when I was still living in my country, my family used to have lots of animals, too. My mother always says I took after my grandfather! Aww you have chicken AND horses!! That's my dream right there!!
I can't really take my turtles out of the 90 gallon. They actually need more space. My dream is to build a pond for them but again, dont have the space for it. My female is 10 inches long and is still growing!! She's a monster!! The male is a lot smaller. He's probably 6 or 7 inches only. The rule of thumb is 10 gallons per inch of turtle.

[chrisinha]

@ HAF, a small tank with too much fishes takes much more time than a bigger one with the same fishes

If you husband worries about your time, HAF will not be the problem

I know right? Too bad my husband doesnt fall for that

[Timberwolf]

I know right? Too bad my husband doesn't fall for that

Teach him to read and get him some books (sorry ), something that can explain to him the simple rule that a larger volume of water will always be more stable, both chemically and in temperature.

[Bas Pels]

It's not only the stability of the tank, but let's refer to cattle.

One can keep 10 pieces of cattle on a field the size of an acre, but the same flock can also fill a square mile. The first option is colled intensive cattlekeeping, while the second is called extensive cattlekeeping.

The same goes for fishkeeping

Your tank, with the current population requires some 25 % waterchanging a week. Tat is 19 gallon. Were the tank 25 % larger, with the identical population, the weekly waterchanging could be reduced to 10 % - that would be 10 % of (55 + 25 %) g = 7,4 g - less than a third

How is this possible? A larger tank has more capacity to clean its own water, there is less stress form overcrouwding

[Timberwolf]

Thank you, Bas. One of the reasons why I am finding myself more and more addicted to this site is the immense level of knowledge among the members and their willingness to share it without talking down to those of us at the "dumb look" end of the learning curve. Your explanation of fish crowding goes so much further than any I've ever heard before, while at the same time being simple enough for even the likes of me to uderstand. It makes me realize that, even though my tanks are staying clean and stable, with everybody getting along well, it really is more a matter of being lucky than good. It also gives me hope that, if I pay close enough attention here, I can be that good, too.

[Bas Pels]

In my case, I got 30 tanks - which is too much is one cares for them normally. So, yes, I had to learn how to make some shortcuts, in order to have time to do my work

[chrisinha]

ok, for some reason i felt relieved that i only have 2 tanks (fish and turtle)..

here's an update. a friend of mine took 1 honey gourami and 4 minnows. not sure if im happy or sad though