Can anyone please provide me with as much information as possible regarding L-236. I can possibly get hold of some but i need to be quite sure they actually are L-236. Things I'm curious about is how old can they get? How do i sex them? At what size are the sexually mature? How can i be sure they are not hybrids. I hear that most of the speciments in Europe probably are. Is this hypancistrus more difficult to breed than zebra pleco? And so on. Any kind of information will be greatly apriciated.
If this post is in the wrong catogory please feel free to adresse it to the right place.
Frode
L-236
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Frode Bakken
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Re: L-236
Yes. But it's not much information compared to other l-numbers. I'm wondering if there is someone in this forum who maybe has this l-number and have some information or tips on it.
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HaakonH
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Re: L-236
Hei Frode 
Du kan alltids sende meg en pm, men for andre forumlesere tar jeg resten på engelsk ;)
There is A LOT of controversy surrounding this label, L236. The problem begins with the fact that we have only been given a single photo of the first specimens found back in 1996. Since then, quite a few similar specimens of Hypancistrus have surfaced. If they are in fact the same species is very hard to tell. There seems to be more Hypancistrus species/varieties/crossbreeds out there (even in Rio Xingu itself) than we thought. The main problem is that since we only have that original photo to compare with, it's hard to answer questions like 'how much do L236 vary in pattern', 'how big do they get', 'does their pattern change as they grow' and so on. André Werner, who presented this fish to the world for the first time, claims it was found in Rio Iriri. And that's about all he had to say about it...
What we DO know is that some L236 seem to have been found in other areas in Rio Xingu, and most of them have been shipped to the Asian market for a large sum. Some major European importers with a good reputation, like Germany's Aquarium Glaser, claimed to have imported some L236 back in the early years of this decade. They have even presented them on their website. Now, usually you would trust those guys and their judgment. But it's mainly from these few imports offspring has been produced and spread all over the world, until they suddenly stopped listing the species a couple of years ago. This offspring appeared to be remarkably variable and to a large extent far from as striking in appearance as the original fish. This of course lead to many debates, and Glaser stopped listing them.
Since then, some specimens have grown up and produced offspring of their own. I have some. Are they really L236? How should I know... I've been told that Hans-Georg Evers bought a single pair from a fisherman in Brazil, shipped them to Glaser, they placed them at a trusted breeder (Robert Budrovcan, who says Ingo Seidel may have some pics of these 2 fishes - haven't seen these pics), Budrovcan bred them, returned offspring to Glaser, who sold them. Nice story, big names. If anything unknown happened somewhere along the way I have no idea. But I can tell you that the ones I have, they are not all as nice as the one in the original picture. Some are awesome, some are more drab. But if they are crossbreeds? Who knows? Who can you trust in this matter, and who can you not? Perhaps L236 is a crossbreed to begin with, which would make them produce extremely varied offspring?
The other thing worth noticing is that before the ban, many Hypancistrus were sold by Brazilian exporters as L236, because this made customers pay more. Most of these were H.sp."Lower Xingu" and other non-L236 Hypancistrus. Some people may have bought these, believing they just did a bargain getting hold of real L236. Not everyone out there knows they can't always trust their dealer. So, this has led many people to believe L236 is more common in the trade than it really is.
It's hard to be totally sure about anything regarding this l-number. It's a fish with enough similarities to other Hypancistrus that they can be close to impossible to tell apart. Some L236 on the world market are indeed real and very striking. But most of them are in Asia, like I mentioned. Whether or not the ones spread around Europe by Glaser are crossbreeds or not is yet to be answerd. But I'm personally working on that case ;)
-Haakon
Du kan alltids sende meg en pm, men for andre forumlesere tar jeg resten på engelsk ;)
There is A LOT of controversy surrounding this label, L236. The problem begins with the fact that we have only been given a single photo of the first specimens found back in 1996. Since then, quite a few similar specimens of Hypancistrus have surfaced. If they are in fact the same species is very hard to tell. There seems to be more Hypancistrus species/varieties/crossbreeds out there (even in Rio Xingu itself) than we thought. The main problem is that since we only have that original photo to compare with, it's hard to answer questions like 'how much do L236 vary in pattern', 'how big do they get', 'does their pattern change as they grow' and so on. André Werner, who presented this fish to the world for the first time, claims it was found in Rio Iriri. And that's about all he had to say about it...
What we DO know is that some L236 seem to have been found in other areas in Rio Xingu, and most of them have been shipped to the Asian market for a large sum. Some major European importers with a good reputation, like Germany's Aquarium Glaser, claimed to have imported some L236 back in the early years of this decade. They have even presented them on their website. Now, usually you would trust those guys and their judgment. But it's mainly from these few imports offspring has been produced and spread all over the world, until they suddenly stopped listing the species a couple of years ago. This offspring appeared to be remarkably variable and to a large extent far from as striking in appearance as the original fish. This of course lead to many debates, and Glaser stopped listing them.
Since then, some specimens have grown up and produced offspring of their own. I have some. Are they really L236? How should I know... I've been told that Hans-Georg Evers bought a single pair from a fisherman in Brazil, shipped them to Glaser, they placed them at a trusted breeder (Robert Budrovcan, who says Ingo Seidel may have some pics of these 2 fishes - haven't seen these pics), Budrovcan bred them, returned offspring to Glaser, who sold them. Nice story, big names. If anything unknown happened somewhere along the way I have no idea. But I can tell you that the ones I have, they are not all as nice as the one in the original picture. Some are awesome, some are more drab. But if they are crossbreeds? Who knows? Who can you trust in this matter, and who can you not? Perhaps L236 is a crossbreed to begin with, which would make them produce extremely varied offspring?
The other thing worth noticing is that before the ban, many Hypancistrus were sold by Brazilian exporters as L236, because this made customers pay more. Most of these were H.sp."Lower Xingu" and other non-L236 Hypancistrus. Some people may have bought these, believing they just did a bargain getting hold of real L236. Not everyone out there knows they can't always trust their dealer. So, this has led many people to believe L236 is more common in the trade than it really is.
It's hard to be totally sure about anything regarding this l-number. It's a fish with enough similarities to other Hypancistrus that they can be close to impossible to tell apart. Some L236 on the world market are indeed real and very striking. But most of them are in Asia, like I mentioned. Whether or not the ones spread around Europe by Glaser are crossbreeds or not is yet to be answerd. But I'm personally working on that case ;)
-Haakon