Acclimating syno granulosus

[toby]

I will be receiving 2M/2F, 6-7" in size syno granulosus next week and am considering my options for quarantining and acclimation. I have a 6 foot length 125gallon tank that currently houses 2 syno polli and 4 syno dhonti - all around 4" long - they have been in there 8 weeks or so, alone. My options are 1)to rework the waterscaping in this tank and add the 4 grannies, 2)relocate the polli and dhonti and put the 4 grannies in the 125 or 3)put the grannies each alone in smaller quarters for a couple of weeks (20gallon sized tanks). Eventually I would like to try and house the 4 grannies together if possible - otherwise they would be split up into petro and tropheus tanks, all 6 foot 150 gallon, 225 gallon sized tanks.
Any thoughts/considerations? would they do OK with the polli and dhonti? What about a 2 week acclimation in small quarters - thoughts on their behaviour,etc?
Thanks for any advice.

[Birger]

I have not kept these particular syno's but If it was me I would dedicate the largest tank possible for a quarantine and see how they react with each other. I know they can and do rip each other up at times.

I might even consider risking (against disease)a peaceful group of fish as dither's but would try alone first( the whole idea behind quarantine).

Putting them each in their own tank is not a bad idea but I think 24" is too short for active Tanganyikan syno's of this size and could very well add stress. I use some 36" by 18" footprint tanks and I would think these would work for singles but I realize not everyone has four 40 or 50 gallon tanks just waiting around empty.(which I certainly do not)

Richard and/or Sid should be along to add their bit as they actually have these.

To deviate from your subject a bit...I would be interested to see what you are calling dhonti (would add to another ongoing discussion) http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/view ... =3&t=27345 have we already seen pictures of yours or if we have not can we?

Birger

[sidguppy]

careful with this.....

4 is a small group. I had 5 until recently and when a very old and battered down granny died all hell broke loose and some of the fishes literally lost their fins....

i don't mean a nipped or teared up fin; I'm talking about complete absent adipose fins and 2" open wedges of bleeding flesh instead; lost tailfins until all the rays are chewed off making it end on the caudal stump, the other fins being pruned (cause that's what they looked like; pruned fish)

very slowly the healing process has begun, but still I'm not convinced 4 is a good number. better larger or split up.

given the growthrate on the finnage and the fact that all my grannies are eating well again and wounds are closed; I will still be looking at damaged fish for at least 6-12 months before all traces of that horrible fight are gone

granulosus is a truly vicious nasty piece when it wants to be.

[Richard B]

As Sid says, you need to be careful here.

I think part of your problem is that your new fish will all be the same size..... to expand, i have 3 individuals which are kept in "cramped conditions" along with a large selection of various other tanganyikan synos. Thus any aggression is spread between them & i have an "armed truce" in existence.This is far from ideal but has worked well for a number of years (we'll have to see how things go when i start to thin down the numbers.....). The 3 granny's are 8"(W/C), 5" & 4"(both T/B) - there exists naturally a granny pecking order which is not likely to change, due to their sixe differences.

A couple of things to mention though - if you are QT-ing i would do this with each individual separated from the others, else what Sid has quoted will most probably happen very quickly . When moved to whatever tank they're going in it won't be possible to provide refuge with some size-specific caves if they are all the same size so some very careful & intelligent decor layout will be needed - perhaps not best for viewing the fish but it should give you the best chances of success with them.

Perhaps most importantly initially, whenever you move them - ie into QT & then into the display, make sure you have a tight fitting, heavy lid/cover glasses - Granny's are surprisingly vigourous jumpers for the first day & a bit of introdction into an aquarium. Make sure if they do jump, there is nowhere for them to become stranded out of the water - like on top of exposed rockwork or ontop of a filter etc. My bigger one scared the crap out of me all night with the bang, splash - bang splash all night long - only stopping when she landed on top of the filter where she sat (dazed or tired out?). I thought i was in for some peace but i had to get up to see why the activity had stopped. She showed no sign of wanting to try & get back in the water, so i pushed her in & filled the exposed void with some scruched up polythene sheeting so she couldn't strand herself again. This sort of thing has happened everytime i have removed a granny...

[toby]

Thanks for the comments Sid/Richard. Always nice to hear some useful husbandry tips from keepers.
From what I am hearing I am going to go the QT in singles configuration for the first couple of weeks. I have some 20 and 40 gallon tanks - they'll have to do for the short term - hopefully this won't stress them out too much. Sid, you say 4 is a small group - would I be better off with 1M/1F configuration or is conspecific temperament just plain nasty all the way around with them being better in singles for the most part? Richard makes a good point about them being all the same size, which could be a downside to harmony within the group - but it all depends I guess - I run through the same type behaviour with my petrochromis groups - you just never know when one can go ballistic - and they do - and do a lot of damage in a very short time. Sid, have you had your grannies in with polli or dhonti - any issues I should be aware of and prepare for? or avoid?
Thanks again for your comments.

[Bas Pels]

Sids fishes have been staying at my place, and when the Synos started tearing each other apart, I had to separate them. The tanks are 250 L, with a separator on 1/3 the length - thus the small compartment is 80 L - and if I remember correctly, 1 US gallon =4,5 liters, thus 20 gallon is 90 liters

This was acceptable for the few weeks, but I got the idea the fish did feel a bit confined. So, if possible, use the 40 gallon tanks only. The 2/3 was a lot more happy than the 1/3 one

[Richard B]

The granny is top of the pecking order in a mixed group of Tanganyikan synos, certainly above polli. I am interested to know what your "dhonti" fishes are as this species is known only from the holotype, & we all presume those sold as such are tanganicae, irsacae or undescribed species - perhaps they are dhonti but for us, hobbyists, the whole ID of this clade is a bit of a mess! (any chance of pics?)

In short, in a 125G tank a mix of species should be OK - your problem is mixing the granny's.....

1M/1F sounds almost as bad as you can get ( 2 of the same would potentially be worse) as if one wants some aggro the other will suffer badly, in a group there is more chance of aggression being spread around, but of course, here's the rub, they are in a space-limited environment. If you look through the granny keepers in cat-e-log i'm sure there is someone who keeps a dozen (or thereabouts) of these split between 3? tanks - try PM-ing them for their experiences

I have seen a dozen 5" tank bred sub-adults kept together in a 48x15x15 (approx) with no real problems - this was at the importer/breeder down south, but their adult breeding stock are all kept isolated from one another.....

[toby]

Richard,
I will pm some of those folks - in the meantime, they will be kept in singles in a variety of mixed tanks - after QT. Yes, I will post some pics in the next little while as time permits - birger also asked. And yes, it seems the whole ID issue is a little confusing. I am just getting more involved with synos and am learning a lot on this site. I just ordered the Seegers Catfishes of Africa book and expect it to be a good reference - any other texts you can suggest, for the hobbyist and not the white lab-coat group, no disrespect intended.

[Richard B]

http://www.tropheus.com.pl/galeria/thum ... 0&page=118 the first 2 issues (maybe more???) of the cichlid magazine produced in Krakow but forum member Worton's friends [see link above] have some super stuff although in Polish.

The wright & Page revision of Tanganyikan synos is essential but maybe a bit too "white-lab-coaty" for you?

The Seegars book is tremendous but does have some dodgy ID's in there!!!

[caught1]

I would split them up if possible,they seem to be very different that most other synos.They change very quickly when they get nasty.