Bushy Pleco Breeding - specifics on setup

[akb42]

Hi,

I've had a pair of Bushy Nose Plecos (Ancistrus sp. Pucallpa) in my 55g community tank for about 6 months now. They are great algae eaters, peaceful & very happy... Now my question is, how could I breed them? I keep reading how easy it is to get them to breed, but I was hoping to get some really basic info on the specifics that would make this work....

-what would be a good tank size? I have a male & female right now but thought expanding the colony into their own tank would be a good idea. I have a spare 20g -- would that be sufficient space, or too small?

-how many males:females should I have in a 20g (or if that's a bad size, how many for another size tank?)

-bare-bottom tank or gravel? I have seen conflicting advice on here regarding ease of clean-up vs. bacterial slime growth...

-caves... I read you should give lots of options - are any of them better than others? rectangular slate caves, ceramic cylindrical caves, etc... what to pick?

-they seem to love rasping on the driftwood in my current tank -- should I provide that to them in a breeding tank as well?

-any specific water parameters that should differ from a community tank?

-any other suggestions?

I am sorry for SO many questions -- I just want to get this to work, but feel like more info would be good, even if they are as prolific as rabbits!!

akb

[MatsP]

Are these actually, genuinely wild-caught fish from Peru, or are they the common bristlenose

Ancistrus cf_cirrhosus

- Just to clarify: I have no problem with you believing it is what you say it is. I do have a problem with breeders, wholesalers and/or shops knowingly selling captive bred fish as wild-caught, more exotic species.

Either way.

>>what would be a good tank size? I have a male & female right now but thought expanding the colony into their own tank would be a good idea. I have a spare 20g -- would that be sufficient space, or too small?
>>how many males:females should I have in a 20g (or if that's a bad size, how many for another size tank?)

A 20g or thereabouts should be fine for a trio: 1 male, 2 females, which is generally the ideal breeding setup.


>>bare-bottom tank or gravel? I have seen conflicting advice on here regarding ease of clean-up vs. bacterial slime growth...
>>caves... I read you should give lots of options - are any of them better than others? rectangular slate caves, ceramic cylindrical caves, etc... what to pick?
>>they seem to love rasping on the driftwood in my current tank -- should I provide that to them in a breeding tank as well?

My advise is definitely for gravel/sand. No fish in nature lives on a glass bottom - they may not live on sand/gravel either, but it's definitely closer. Others may differ in their opinion. I'll let you decide who you believe, but I think you'll find several experienced breeders say the same thing. But I'm sure you can also find those who prefer bare-bottom tanks.

Caves: Give them several choices. My Ancistrus breeding experience says that they aren't particularly picky about the material of the cave, as long as the size is the right one. I have had them breed in bamboo pipes, under rocks, terracotta saucers, wood hollows and probably three or four other things.

I'd definitely say put some driftwood in the tank - the fish seem to like hiding under it, as well as chewing on it. I see absolutely no reason why there should be no wood in there.

>>any specific water parameters that should differ from a community tank?
>>any other suggestions?
>>I am sorry for SO many questions -- I just want to get this to work, but feel like more info would be good, even if they are as prolific as rabbits!!

You haven't told us what the current water is like, so it's hard to advice on what, if anything should be different. The commons that I have definitely breed in any type of water (except perhaps REALLY soft water).

Don't worry about asking questions. That's what this forum is about - if there was no questions, there would be very little traffic on the forum...

--
Mats

[akb42]

Thanks for your reply Mats!

I am fairly sure that these guys are actually the Pucallpas -- they're from a breeder in Ohio (http://brianstropicals.com/ohio_tropical_fish.html). He only sells offspring born in his aquariums, so they may be a few generations removed from Peru, but I think that is the correct ID. If I expanded the group, I would buy from him again, as he was great to do business with.

I didn't include water currents, etc. because the tank is not currently set up. I have it empty & in the basement (a sad place for a fish tank!) I was thinking of setting the 20g up again, with an Aquaclear filter (either the 200 gph or 300 gph) since I have had good luck with them in the past.

I'm glad to hear that gravel is a good idea -- I've never had a bare-bottomed tank & I can only imagine how messy plecos would make it... and quickly!

-1 male, 2 females in a 20g setup (Would going for a larger tank and a larger group be beneficial, or overkill?)
-gravel, driftwood, lots of cave choices
-filtration -- would the aquaclear be enough turnover/current?

-If I find eggs, I see that many people leave them with the father so he can care for them, but what about the females? Do they stay in the tank, or would they be detrimental? Can dad stay with the babies for a while, or just until they've absorbed their egg sacs? Somehow I trust my bushy's parental instincts more than my own : p

-My town's water is generally on the acidic side (pH 6.5), and relatively soft, though not incredibly soft. Would it be worth it to try to 'harden' up the water, and if so, how? Or would you avoid monkeying with the water by adding chemicals, etc.?

-Thanks so much -- really appreciate it!
Akb

[Dave Rinaldo]

Here are the two pics of Ancistrus sp."Pucallpa" fom Brian's Tropicals




Here is the single pic from the Cat-eLog of

Ancistrus sp`pucallpa`

[MatsP]

I have no way of telling where Brians fish came from, so I can't say... I'm just aware that the very few pictures of this species look very similar to the common captive bred species, and there is an albino variant of them (although to confuse us they are called "golden"( . I wouldn't have expected albinism to turn up that easily in a wild-caught species.

I see no reason for more than a trio - more males will most likely reduce the chances of successful breeding. More females may give you more eggs, but I doubt you really need it.

I always prefer the father to look after the eggs. Humans tend to loose more fry... I have brought up a few bristlenoses in rearing nets, but they do better in with mum and dad. As long as there aren't any predators (and when they are tiny babies, that includes fairly small fish, e.g larger tetras, small cichlids, etc), it should be fine. Once their armour plates develop, they will be fine with fairly big fish - I have had sub-1" bristlenoses with a 6-7" Satanoperca leucosticta and 4-5"

Pimelodus pictus

. But the newborn are "soft", so they can get eaten surprisingly easily by all sorts of piscivores.

In my experience, bristelnoses do not need huge amounts of current. I'm not very familiar with the Aquaclear range. But for a 20g tank, I'd recomend a filter of about 50-100 gph flow.

As long as your water is stable at pH 6.5, I'd say that's just fine. I'd love to have that sort of water. Our water here is closer to 8 than any other pH. I use RO water for my more sensitive fish.

--
Mats

[andywoolloo]

I learned all my BN things from this forum.

I have 2 adult males and 2 adult females in a 40 gal breeder. And various teenagers and babies and fry. I started with one male one female both adults then thru trying to increase female adults accidentally one become a male. So 2 adult males 2 adult females. It not the best but I think the tank is big enough. It's just that the youngest male bothers the oldest when the oldest is tending eggs and fry, like he is jealous or something.

It has a sand bottom, driftwood, real plants, rocks, caves.

A Rena XP3 canister filter and a Tetra Whisper EX70 h.o.b. filter. A heater, I keep the tank at about 78- 82. Most times its a bit over 80 or close to 82. I cover the intakes with sponges, soon to be replaced by the media bags full of Eheim ehifix (thanks apisto). I change 50% water once a week, unless there are tons of fry then 50% twice a week. I add in the prime dechlor and the boyds vitachem and the Seachem florish.

They eat veggies and fruit and romaine lettuce, pellets and flakes and defrosted frozen. The wee ones get NLS Grow and Hikari first bites and Ocean Nutrition baby brine shrimp. But they are on the adult food from the get go trying to eat it.

I love to watch them devour the huge lettuce leaves. I also leave the babies in with the dad. I raised some in a net breeder only cause the egg clump was kicked out of the cave, on accident or unknown how. It's easier to leave with dad.

My fish store wants them at as close to 2 inches as I can get the, they are the hardest things to catch.