running current THROUGH the caves??

[shadowcat]

Hello Folks. I've been here before, but been away a while. I'm setting up a new tank, 58USG, 36x18x20H. It will house several Queen Arabesques, L260's and a juvenile L114. I want the tank well planted, although I expect as the L114 gets big he may have other ideas. Anyway, my idea is to incorporate several PVC caves across the back of the tank for the plecos, covered by gravel and rocks. I have a plan to use a 500gph pump for circulation/current. What I'd like to do and have worked out on paper, is to route the discharge from the pump under the gravel and have it connected to the bottoms of each of the caves, thereby discharging into and out of the cave mouths. That would provide a reasonably diffused flow for the plants and a more concentrated current, perhaps 80-90gph, through each of the caves themselves. My concern is do plecos actually LIKE current in the caves themselves or do they want it tranquil inside their nests with the current outside?? Please help if you have any experience with this type of setup. I don't want to go through a lot of trouble setting up the plumbing only to have the plecos not use the caves. It seems like a good idea to me, but I have never heard of anyone doing it that way, so I'm concerned that it may backfire

[MatsP]

My personal opinion is that the fish will NOT like that idea. It's an interesting concept, but I doubt it reflects well on the natural habitat in any form.

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Mats

[shadowcat]

Yeah, see that's why I came back to the site, INFORMATION. I've been keeping fish succesfully for 20 years, but I only started seriously collecting catfish about 2 years ago, so I'm still learning about their specific needs. I know plecos need and/or prefer substantial current and a well oxygenated tank, so I thought by pumping right thru their caves I could give them what they need without blasting the whole tank and the plants. Unless somebody has actually done this and been successful with it, I may have to rethink the plumbing layout....better now than after the tank is setup and running....thanks Mat

[MatsP]

One thing that probably WOUDL work is to run pipes and flow water right past the ENTRANCE of the cave - that certainly WOULD resemble the natural habitat.

I do something like that in my L128 breeding tank: I have a power-head mounted at the front of the tank, on the left side wall, running water past the front of the caves. An external Eheim 2217 runs water the opposite direcation (from the right), higher up and at a slight angle towards the back so that it hits around the back corner, so that I have a good circular flow in the tank, but also some still areas where the water isn't moving so much. At the back, I also have a 6" air-stone bubbling away.

It is not a planted tank, and in my personal opinion, plecos don't live in "green" parts of the rivers. There are other Loricariidae that does: Sturisoma, Otocinclus, Farlowella and such. This type of environment generally has less current.

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Mats

[shadowcat]

Yes, I s'pose that does make more sense from a habitat standpoint. Fortunately, although I have all the hardware and the fish are currently residing in one of my 75's with "friends", I'm still on the drawing board, so to speak, and it's easy to change layouts on paper. Thank you for the input Mats. Actually, you're confirming what I suspected, which is why I came here for feedback before pissing off my fish.....although with the best of intentions!!...It's good to be back online:)

[Dave Rinaldo]

so I thought by pumping right thru their caves I could give them what they need without blasting the whole tank and the plants.

Pleco breeding caves only have an entrance, with the back being sealed off.

[shadowcat]

Hello Dave. Yes, my plan WAS to have the backs closed. The water would have been plumbed up through the bottoms of and into the PVC caves, thereby forcing it out through the fronts. Apparently that configuration isn't likely to please my fish as much as I'd hoped, so I'll do something more conventional instead.....And I thought it was such a clever idea too!!!........should have asked the fish first:)

[MatsP]

It sounds like you have already decided that your brilliant idea might not be so brilliant after all, but I'd like to point out that if your fish ever breeds, the current may blow the eggs or fry out into the water, which is not what you want.

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Mats

[L number Banana]

Hi Shadowcat,

Don't give up on the plants if you really want them, some can take a pretty hefty current, my osirus swords and banana plants are almost horizontal from the flow! Grow like weeds and they fill in the blank space nicely, almost like I meant them to grow like that Plain wisteria is very tough too but you'll need to clip it about once a month. The higher water flow prevents all those stem roots from growing into a jungle.

Don't forget to show some pics when you're done

[shadowcat]

Mats, yes I think I got all caught up in the hardware and was so pleased with my "discharge the pump thru the caves" concept that I didn't think thru the needs of the FISH, which is what the whole thing is about to begin with. I'm rethinking the the plumbing thing now and I have a plan "B" that should work and be more suitable to the plec's.......Hello Banana!! Yes, I know there are plants that will do well in some current. My "new" plan will keep the original cave concept, with the caves being under/part of, a second story terrace arrangement that will also be planted. I'll be building the terrace walls from acrylic, with appropriate holes where the pvc cave openings will come thru. That way I can fill in over and around the pvc, hiding all but the openings and have a second tier of plants above them across the back of the tank. I'm thinking that if I run the discharge line from the pump along one end of the tank, thru a DIY spraybar, paralell to and just slightly above the gravel level, with the intake on the opposite end, it will produce a nice even current, left to right, across the floor of the tank where the plecs will spend their time and leave the rest of the water column relatively calm for the plants and livebears that will be inhabiting the upper levels. Sort of a river tank setup only with somewhat less current than I have in my larger tanks where I run about 20x the tank volume in pumping capacity.....does this sound like a better idea??

[MatsP]

Sounds like a good plan to me.

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Mats