pl*co for a 55

[andywoolloo]

ok so I am going to wait the at least 4 mos rule to add a pl*co to my 55 gal. It just got started 3 weeks ago. I used one of the eheims from the syno tank, and replaced that one with a new eheim, so it cycled in one week. But will wait 4 mos for the tank to establish.

The tank has 4 otos, (iknow it's too soon for them but they were in the ten I broke down to put in the 55, i supplement there algae with algae wafers and zuchinni and cucumbers and fruit. Plus I make them algae on rocks in the back yard in the sun in used tank water with Seachem florish. They are always on it, plus they eat shrimp pellets. And there are tons of live plants in the new tank. I am hoping they make it, they all look plump still) anyways it has 4 otos, a male betta crowntail, 12 peppered cories, soon to be 16 cause 4 from another tank will go in there.

I want to add the correct small enough pl*co.

My thinking is I cannot add a BN even tho I love those cause they are 90% herbivore and I cannot control their protein intake in that tank cause my cories are canivores beyond.

Is this true? I should go with a more meaty omnivore pl*co? I was afraid to add a BN cause he might get too much meaty protein foods? I am also keeping in mind temp of tank.

I was thinking of one of these if I can find them and if the BN is truly inappropraite for that tank.

#1 Queen Arabesque
#2 King Tiger
#3 Leopard Frog
#4 Blue Phantom
#5 Green Phantom

Are these ok? As if I could ever locate any of them. But I can dream? Any other suggestions?

[aledk85]

for me a bn will be possible
with a omnivor species will be more easy but if you just keep attention about him and food, why not...

[MatsP]

Common bristlenoses will tolerate a bit of meaty food - as long as they have good access to other foods such as courgette (zucchini) etc.

The others are fine candidates too, but the Phantom variants may (eventually) get a bit too big.

--
Mats

[racoll]

Common bristlenoses will tolerate a bit of meaty food - as long as they have good access to other foods such as courgette (zucchini) etc.

I will second Mats comment. It is not the actual rich protein food that causes the problem, it is rather the lack of fibre to push it all through the guts. Unlike in a tank, in the wild, a very small proportion of what goes through the mouth is actually food, most is just detritus.

I feed my veggie plecos plenty of algae wafers, bloodworms etc, but always with vegetables so there is enough roughage to prevent blockages in the gut.

Having soft bogwood in the tank to graze on will also help greatly, as wood is pretty much all fibre.

I would also agree with Mats that the phantoms get a bit big and are a bit more specialised in their requirements. One for the species tank.

The

Hypancistrus

and

Peckoltia

will be fine, but remember they need warm water (27-30C), something that may not be appreciated by your cooler water

Corydoras paleatus

(20-25C).

[andywoolloo]

well, that's a relief that I can put BN in there! I really like them. Thanks guys. Could I get more then one?

All my tanks have lots of driftwood and hidey places and plants.

And I so understand now re the protein for the BN. It's ok and don't worry too much as long as they always have the vegetables and fruits along with.

Cause I was only giving him protein, ie; bloodworms and shrimp defrosted once a week? And then stressing out on all the algae/veggie rounds protein content?

I didn't want him to get too much protein and have stomach issues?

I feed him, in the 20 long, every day an algae and a veggie wafer plus he always have a piece of zucchini or cucumber or pepper etc and some fruit? Every day? Is that ok? Plus i put some shrimp pellets in there once every few days. He has a nice rounded tummy but not fat just not concave and a bit out. Plus he is always sucking along the wood and walls of the tank. Even up the filter intake. He is active.

[racoll]

well, that's a relief that I can put BN in there! I really like them. Thanks guys. Could I get more then one?

In a 55 you could have loads. Why not start your own bristlenose factory. They will surely breed.

I feed him, in the 20 long, every day an algae and a veggie wafer plus he always have a piece of zucchini or cucumber or pepper etc and some fruit?

Sounds like a bit too much wafer (depends on the size and brand I guess, Hikari are pretty big, but other brands are smaller), but if he eats it all and the water quality is good, its probably okay.

[andywoolloo]

many Bn's?

Sounds like a bit too much wafer (depends on the size and brand I guess, Hikari are pretty big, but other brands are smaller), but if he eats it all and the water quality is good, its probably okay.

well always I put it in before I leave for work, then when I get home I always take out the extra left over, with the small gravel vac, and suck up any poo, and boy is there poo!! looks like little wood shavings. So I need to cut down on that cause there is always some to suck up. Usually a oto on the crumbs also.

[Carp37]

Just to second everyone's comments on bristlenose diet- mine have either cucumber or courgette (zucchini) offered virtually every day, and will come to it pretty much immediately it's offered, but once they've been on it five minutes, they'll then preferentially take foods like catfish pellets, frozen bloodworm or even flake in preference to the vegetables. They seem to recognise that they need the vegetable matter (and mine seem to also eat a lot of bogwood- they're almost as bad as the Panaque maccus), but nevertheless prefer standard foods.

I'd be careful what you wish for with regarding breeding them though- I was chuffed to bits the first time my trio spawned, but now I've got around 200 of them it's wearing a little thin!

[andywoolloo]

I really have no idea what I would do with all the babies, I have never really considered them breeding. Just would be nice to have more then one in the same tank. But like you all have told me they do not get lonesome per say. I have read girl BNs can live together good? Just pretty hard to tell girls when they sell them so teeny pre bristles.

I can tell you for sure tho, around here, BNs are scarce. They have to be ordered. Actually it's entirely pl*co-less around here cept commons.

Once in a while this one privately owned pet store gets some diff ones in but its few and far between. Is it like that all over the world? Are they always special ordered?

[MatsP]

You can have several males and females in a tank, no real problem. They MAY fight over caves, but that's rare and if you just keep an eye on them (and give them plenty of cave-choices), it should be fine.

--
Mats

[pLaurent1251]

When I was feeding corys and my BN pleco, I would inject bloodworms, brineshrimp etc lightly into the gravel with a syringe. The corys dived into those and ate them all. I would also feed shrimp pellets in the front of the tank during the day while my BN was hiding in his driftwood. Then at night I would put out veg and sometimes algae wafers for my pleco. This worked out very well.

Too bad you have a hard time finding different species where you are. You could ask your local fish store to order some for you. You can also order some online, if you don't mind paying the shipping costs.

[andywoolloo]

thanks you guys!

BN's in every tank!!!

[MatsP]

Out of my 9 tanks, there's only two that doesn't have at least one small bristlenose in it.

--
Mats

[pLaurent1251]

BN's in every tank!!!

That's my motto!!

[andywoolloo]

could one go in with my synos?

[MatsP]

could one go in with my synos?

I don't see why not. By the way, I just realized my statement in the previous post is a(n unintentional) lie: there are THREE tanks out of my 9 that doesn't have a Ancistrus - my Malawi tank has a large common pleco, so no bristlenose there. My P. maccus tank doesn't have any bristlenose at present, as it was vying for the caves that I want my P. maccus to use for breeding, and my Sturisomas don't need competition for the algae in the tank, so no bristlenose in that tank either.

--
Mats

[andywoolloo]

ok so heres my tanks and stockings, can you tell me how many BN pl*co can go in what?

20 long : in habitants one BN, one male betta, 4 otos 76-78 temp

2 ten gals: one male betta in each and 3 otos 76 - 78 temp

55 gal: 16 peppered cories, 4 otos, one male betta 75 76 temp

75 gal: 5 syno eupterus 75 76 temp

[MatsP]

I personally wouldn't mix oto's with bristlenoses (same as I don't want to have a bristlenose in my Sturisoma tank - they both like the same sort of food).

Ignoring the Oto situation, the 55g tank can certainly hold half a dozen or more bristlenoses of adult size.

If we don't ignore the Oto situation, I would move the 4 Oto's from the 55g to the 20Long - they'll be happier in a bigger group anyways. Then put the bristlenoses in the 55g tank.

The 75g tank can hold perhaps up to a dozen bristlenoses without too much concern other than sufficient feeding. The synos may of course find the same food appealing as you feed the bn's.

--
Mats

[andywoolloo]

wow, thanks!!

Mats wrote the 55g tank can certainly hold half a dozen or more bristlenoses of adult size.

So put the BN I have in the 55 with the other inhabitants cept the otos and add more BN's in there? I am getting excited now!!

Mats wrote: If we don't ignore the Oto situation, I would move the 4 Oto's from the 55g to the 20Long - they'll be happier in a bigger group anyways. Then put the bristlenoses in the 55g tank.

So the Bn from the 20 long into the 55 with more BNs and removing the otos to the 20 long. So that will make 8 total otos in the 20 long. Can I move the otos from the two tens also? That would make 14 otos on the 20 long and the betta. Then the two tens would have just a betta in each. And the 55 still have the 16 cories be advd. Is that still ok?

Mats wrote: The 75g tank can hold perhaps up to a dozen bristlenoses without too much concern other than sufficient feeding. The synos may of course find the same food appealing as you feed the bn's.

So 6 BN's total in the 55, along with the 16 cories and 1 male betta. And 12 BN s in the 75 along with the 5 synos!!

wow.... cool... Wow it's like christmas!!

p.s. I don't think my filters could handle the amount of poo that many would make! Just my one BN makes so much poo i clean it out every day! But I am happy to know I can keep a couple more!!!

[Birger]

And 12 BN s in the 75 along with the 5 synos!!

Keep in mind the BN's and the eupterus will enjoy the same hidey holes and will squabble over them . I keep a trio of ancistrus sp. 3 in with my angelicus(angelica), the male has his spot but the females are fairly low in the order and pushed around by the syno's if they think it necessary, even by the smallest of the syno's.
I think 12 in the 75 along with what soon will be grown eupterus is too much, that is a large bio load as well, wait till you see what 12 ancistrus does to your filters .
Birger

ps. I keep at least one ancistrus in most of my tanks as well, ancistrus 3 in with the larger and

Ancistrus claro

in the smaller

[MatsP]

All stocking should be based on "what looks right and what works (keep an eye on nitrate levels)". Don't go out and buy a dozen fish and just plop them in (unless the tank can CERTAINLY take it). A dozen large males in a 75g tank together with 5 large synos may well be too much for it. Filtration will also be a matter here - most plecos are "poo-machines", so good filtration is a must for all of them. This will ALSO affect the stocking level, of course.

--
Mats

[Carp37]

Personally I wouldn't stock the bristlenose to their maximum capacity to start with; they're so easy to raise and breed that it's more fun to just buy (say) four or five youngsters, raise them to adulthood, let them breed, then keep some of their fry and try to sell the rest on. My adults went from <1" long to looking after their own fry in not much more than 6 months. Be warned that one of their favourite activities is trying to climb out of aquaria or into filters when they're small.

[MatsP]

Agreed - I only ever bought two Ancistrus sp(3) - now I've got a few dozen, and I've sold some 150-200 of them [and I'm no longer "trying" to breed them - it just happens, and the some fry will survive even if I don't specifically "try" to keep them alive].

--
Mats

[andywoolloo]

I will just be on the look out for a few more, maybe two. thank you all for ans' ng.

[andywoolloo]

uhmm I saw these at the fish store and they were so cute and small and zippy fast I got them.

Chaetostoma sp_aff_milesi

But the tank said this: Chaetostoma thomsoni

they are adorable and fast and so cute. I am giving them the rocks with algae on them to supplement along with other food. I got two originally and only one made it it to the next day. I think the lady at the counter did something to him as I was purchasing him. She kept doing somethign to the fish bag and I was all what are you doing? And she said trying to get him out of the corner and I was all why? So maybe she squished him I don't know or maybe he was starved, they all seemed starved poor things.

I just got that replacement yesterday. So there are two. We shall see.

[MatsP]

My only comment on that is that

Chaetostoma

generically require cooler water (around 20'C (~70'F) rather than above 25'C (77'F+) for most other tropical fishes.

--
Mats

[andywoolloo]

They love to be on rocks and are all over the tank. They do not seem too terribly shy .

Mine look exactly like this from planet catfish pic under, maybe a little lighter.

Chaetostoma sp(1)

I am keeping the tank at 75 76. Can they be ok there? My betta is happy there and so are the cories? I could figure something else out tho if need be.

[MatsP]

Should really be in the lower 70's or even upper 60's for ideal conditions. Like all fish, they do tolerate some amount of "above ideal" and "below ideal", but prolonged exposure to the wrong temperature will be detrimental to their health.

--
Mats

[andywoolloo]

ok. I will figure something out. I can remove the betta and lower the tank temp? My peppered cories like it chilly?

What do you think? He is being a glutton in there anyway.

[racoll]

I can remove the betta and lower the tank temp?

I think that is a wise idea. For optimum health and longevity, Betta and

Chaetostoma

need totally opposite water parameters.

Betta need really warm (83F) and still water, while

Chaetostoma

need cool (72F) fast flowing, well circulated water.

A lot of people compromise (perhaps not knowingly) and then wonder why their fish don't live very long.

My peppered cories like it chilly?

The peppered cories (

Corydoras paleatus

) will do great in the cooler water. In fact they prefer it. Have a look at the temperatures on the cat-elog page.