Plecostamus?

[slakey]

*Ok this is probably the wrong place to post this, but couldn't think where else to put it*

Ok in the past I have kept baby plecostamus' and all have died.
So I'm thinking that the whole "them being very hardy" is a load of BS, as my guppies outlived them in the same tank at the same time...

So I was wondering what would be best for me to get?

Either no plecos and find something else to eat the algae?

Get a more mature pleco?

I currently have in the tank:

Loads of guppies
2 German Blue Rams
3 Three-Lined Corys
2 Black Columbian Corys? *correct name?*
About 2 Zebra Danios

The tank is a Juwel Rio 125, it has two filters the original Juwel fitted filter and a REna Kid Maxi Light filter. Also has a airpump, two pieces of bogwood, half sand half pebbles, and currently one small plant...

Now when the next water change comes along I would be hoping to get some new plants in there... Any idea?

And would a second smaller air pump do the fish favours?

Water Stats:

pH: 7.6
Ammonia: 0.25-0.50
Nitrie: 0ppm
Nitrate: 40ppm

But I done a 25% water change on Thursday... so it may still be settling.
Ive added some seachem prime in to help.

And will consider to use 7.2 pH buffer over the next week to get that down.

Thanks

[Richard B]

Don't go for a common pl*c - get a bristle nose instead (Ancistrus sp(3)) are a far far better option.

If you going for more plants i suggest anubias - they are a bit more expensive but very tough & long lasting - plus you can get it to gow on the bogwood if you wanted.

As an aside are you tank readings right? If you have zero nitrite I would expect to see zero ammonia but you have a reading for that - any ammonia reading is not a good thing

[slakey]

it's weird i only done a 25% water change on thursday! how can it be at that?

[Richard B]

1st thing - did you check the readings on the water you used for the water change? Did you treat it before hand & if so what with?

There are so many variables that there could be lot's of explanations for this

[slakey]

i treated the water with easybalance, aquasafe and nitratebalance, all put in while water was being added.

and i put in some seachem prime today, so ill see what it read over the next few days...

any idea on what pleco or algae cleaner i should get?

[Richard B]

An ancistrus (bristlenose) or a pair 'cos they're not hard to breed would be your best bet. See the cat-e-log

Ancistrus sp(3)

.

It's not a cat but you could opt for a garra species if that took your fancy - the panda garra is a great lookin' fish

[Mod edit: add clog-tags to cat-elog to simplify the searching --Mats]

[slakey]

Ok would you advise that I get mature ones or babies?
As the babies I buy seem to die after a few days-a week...

[racoll]

How long has the tank been set up slakey? And what kind of plecostomus have you tried to keep?

[slakey]

I think I got my tank in November 2007 so it has been running for a while.

I've tried the hillstream loach and some pleco that gets to max of 5" forgot what the man called them. But it looks like identical to a common plec.

And after that one died I stopped buying them.

So since I have only lost a few fish to old age I'd expect, 1 guppy and few danios, I am willing try to a older pleco.

If GBRS and Corys can live in the tank Im sure a pleco would easily be able to since they're "very hardy" :/

Not the ones I've bought so far.

[DutchFry]

when blue rams survive, but plecs die, it's time to check your water on copper. catfish are very sensitive to copper, it's like poison for them

[slakey]

Ok just tested my Nitrate and Ammonia, still the same and I tested it fresh out of the tap and it's the same as what it is in the tank!!! WTF!

Basically everytime I do a water change it's not doing anything?

What can I possibly do about this? I add the water conditioning stuff like aquasafe,easybalance,nitrateminus and seachem prime.

Also for filters? Can you just wash them or do you have to replace them?

Currently I have a Blue,Green and White foam filter parts in there, anything else I need in there?

[racoll]

I tested it fresh out of the tap and it's the same as what it is in the tank!!! WTF!

The ammonia test kit must be picking up the chloramines (the chlorine+ammonia) that is added by the water companies.

Does your dechlorinator deal with chloramines?

[owenj]

It sounds like you might have to start bubbling your change water prior to putting it into your tank to gas off the ammonia. & you're using quite a few water conditioners, Seachem Prime alone should be enough. I'm not familiar w/either of your filters, but generally you can rinse them in old tank water or conditioned tap water. Don't rinse in water straight from the tap or you're likely to kill off any beneficial bacteria. As has already been mentioned, try & get a copper test done to see if that is contributing to your pleco deaths.
~Jaime

[slakey]

where can i get one of those from?

[racoll]

Before worrying about copper, I would worry about the ammonia. The Seachem Prime does get rid of chloramines (and will also detoxify any copper as well), so test some tapwater for ammonia after treating with Prime. If you are still getting an ammonia reading you must have a dud test kit. If not, carry out 50% water changes daily to dilute the ammonia in your tank.

In my opinion you are adding way to many chemicals to the water.

You only need a quality dechlorinator (e.g. Prime). Nothing more.

[slakey]

Okay I shall try that... Should I get anything for my filter to help get rid of the nitrate?

[racoll]

High nitrate is a pain, but everyone in the southeast of England has the same, so I wouldn't worry about it. Just don't don't overstock and keep it at bay with weekly 40-50% water changes.

[slakey]

Hopefully a water softner fitted for the pumbing will sort that out abit...

[MatsP]

Hopefully a water softner fitted for the pumbing will sort that out abit...

Bad idea to use water softeners to fish-tanks. Whilst it will reduce the hardness, it will just replace the hardness with the same concentration of salt - which is, in the long term, no good for the fish. If you want to purify your water, RO or DI is the only way to actually REMOVE the bad stuff - you can plumb that in either before or after the water softener, it makes little difference [it may actually be better after - but I would think it's a marginal difference].

Just remember that the RO/DI filetered water is so pure that the fish are going to be "unhappy" with pure water - you need to add re-mineralization salts to keep the water pure.

And, before you add any more fish to your tank, make sure you know why the others have died. Your LFS should be able to get you a copper test-kit, or even run a test for you. However, if you are supplied by the local water-board (rather than an individual well), I'd be very surprised if there's harmful levels of copper in your water. Possibly, but unlikely.

--
Mats

[racoll]

The water softener will also not affect the amount of nitrate in the water.

It is best to just give the fish the water you have, and not mess around with pH and chemicals etc. They will adapt, provided you do your homework, as to which species will be best.

If you:

Buy quality stock;
Have a suitable environment, diet and tankmates;
Do not overstock;
Carry out regular water changes;

Your fish will live a long healthy life.

[slakey]

Hmm okay, I think we're getting it anyway so the kettle etc don't get clogged up with limescale.

Would 50% a week be ok?

[MatsP]

Hmm okay, I think we're getting it anyway so the kettle etc don't get clogged up with limescale.

That's fine - just don't use that water for your fish, it's not going to make them any happier, and most likely just "worse".

Although for the amount a water softener costs, you can buy many kilos of citric acid to descale a kettle.

Would 50% a week be ok?

Sure, I do 50% a week changes on some of my tanks (even with RO water - but I guess my stocking might be a tad high anyways). The other week I got side-tracked emptying one of my tanks, and there was only a little bit of water (approx 20%) left in the tank when I got back to the siphoning. Fish are fine...

As long as the water you are putting in isn't too different from what you took up (with regards to pH or hardness), large water changes isn't going to be a problem for the fish. If you are "modifying" the water (e.g. reducing hardness), it's best to do it in steps, so say, five changes of 10% or two changes of 25%, rather than one 50% change. But if you have had tap-water in the tank, and replacing it with plain tap-water, then doing 80% water changes shouldn't cause a problem, but I would recommend doing that as two changes. I read somewhere about a discus breeder doing 2 x 40% per day (so 80% per day in two changes).

--
Mats

[slakey]

Well the water from tap is same as water in tank nitrate wise... and I'd expect itd be same from all taps in the house?

Reason for why im asking this is because i tested the water from the tap on the sink, when I actually use the water from the bath... So ill test that too and do another test on my fish tank now.

But from what I can see all my fish seem fine...

I'll do a 50% change thursday and then if I have time a 25% sat or sunday

[racoll]

As far as nitrates go, it will be the same from any tap in your house.

If your nitrate levels are the same in your tank and tapwater, it means you are changing the water frequently enough (provided you test the water just before you change it, not after!).

I would be more concerned about the ammonia at this point though.

[slakey]

I'll test it again before I turn the lights off, and they've had chance to eat

[ZedMuir]

I have had a Rio 125 for almost 3 years now and I had untold problems in the first 6 months with fluctuations of all elements. I was lucky enough to keep all the fish alive but on a few occasions I nearly lost them. However, after the settling period I have never had a problem with it. I monitor the water weekly and the results show I don't need to change for at least a month or so. It is running at almost a perfect equilibrium.

I had a common pleco from scratch but he out-grew the tank as did my clown loach. I now have 2 polkadot loaches and a golden zebra loach. I also have a Queen Arabesque and a Snowball plec, 2 hybrid synos, 3 Glass catfish, 2 sharks and some other more mundane fish that the wife loves.

Never had a problem and although small (but ideal for my current circumstances) I love my Rio 125. I hope it all settles down for you, just bear with it my friend.

[slakey]

I done a test on my nitrate and ammonia today and they were the same, so I done a tiny bit over 50% water change, water in tank looks crystal clear and I will do another water test tomorrow to see if anything has changed