plecos and sponge filters

catfishguy3 · Post by **catfishguy3** » 22 Jun 2007, 14:05

I'm in the planning stage of a new 75USG tank and I'd like to use a high volume pump with sponge filters. I have it worked out on paper, but I have read that sometimes plecos like to munch on sponge filters. I can see why they might once it's been in the tank a while. Covered with bits of food, bacterial slime and who knows what else, I suppose it might be tasty. However, I can't imagine that it would be healthy for the fish and I don't want my setup to make my fish sick. Planned fish are queen arabesques, pimlodella pictus and an L-114, pseudacanthicus leopardus. Any thoughts???

MatsP · Post by **MatsP** » 22 Jun 2007, 15:18

The content of the sponge filter is probably not a problem to the plecos - it's very similar to the stuff that they would find in the slime at the bottom of a river for example.

However, the sponges themselves may not be suitable for their digestive system - as the sponges are artificial material (plastic) it won't dissolve in the digestive system, and thus can cause problems with blockage and perhaps also other problems.

I would recommend either enclosed sponges ("internal filter") or better an external canister filter (such as an Eheim Classic 2217).

I take it you mean as there is no species that has a speciesname resembling pictus.

--
Mats

catfishguy3 · Post by **catfishguy3** » 22 Jun 2007, 16:09

My thoughts exactly. The stuff ON the sponges would be fine. The sponges themselves, not so good. I'm trying to figure some way to cover the sponges that won't impede water flow or be esthetically unpleasant but that will keep the plecs from getting at them. Yes, I could go to an external canister, but I don't think it would handle my flowrate. I'm planning to use a MAG 9.5 in the tank, as the pump. I don't think I can push 900gph thru the fittings on any canister I've seen and I don't want to go with a wet/dry system underneath due to additional costs and complexity. I'm considering a small pond filter like the pondmaster 1000. It's 12x12x3, so I could lay it flat on the tank bottom and hide it pretty well with gravel and driftwood, and it would be fish proof. Not sure about how much hassle it would be to open up and clean in a tank though, since it's meant for a pond. Yes, I stand corrected about my Pictus, thank you:) It's great being able to bounce stuff like this off fellow hobbiests!!

plecoboy · Post by **plecoboy** » 22 Jun 2007, 22:54

I use the azoo sponges and the hydrosponges for all my tanks and have never had a problem the plecos eating the sponge material.

Fish Soup · Post by **Fish Soup** » 23 Jun 2007, 21:42

I use sponge filters in every tank. Whatever brand is cheapest in the LFS I happen to be in. Never had one get chewed up. But thanks for giving me something new to worry about!

In my living room display tank (55 gal) I put one in each back corner and pile gravel over them. I'm sure it impedes the water flow somewhat, but they still get nice and dirty.

Don

Bas Pels · Post by **Bas Pels** » 23 Jun 2007, 23:06

Fish Soup wrote: But thanks for giving me something new to worry about!

My thoughts exactly

I have Pt gibbiceps in taks with internal fiters ans never saw antthing even hinting towards problems

Post by **Shane** » 28 Jun 2007, 18:31

The only tanks where I have seen plecos turn to sponge munching were those that lacked other furniture. Very rare for a loricariid to develop a taste for sponges in a well laid out tank with driftwood, stones, and veggies fed from time to time.
-Shane

catfishguy3 · Post by **catfishguy3** » 28 Jun 2007, 21:18

Thanks for all the feedback folks. I feel better about "sponging" my tank now. Next question, and it's related. I want to run high turnover flow rates in this tank, 10x plus. My plec's seem to love that and are often parked in front of the nearest PH or filter outflow. Anybody have a feel for just how much water I can pump through a sponge filter, a larger one like a hydro V, before it starts to collapse or seriously restrict my pump(s)? I've been using aqua clear HOB's for 16+ years, but don't have any experience with sponge filters, so I have no idea what you can push thruough them.....thanks!!

plecoboy · Post by **plecoboy** » 29 Jun 2007, 02:38

I have mine hooked up to a Penguin 550.

Bas Pels · Post by **Bas Pels** » 29 Jun 2007, 07:51

I have an array of sponges - measuring 60 * 30 cm so 2 * 1 feet, followed by a pump pumping 3300 l/h

No problems. actually, today I will be docorating a 4 meter tank (2800 l) pumping 2* 4500 and 1 * 6000 l/h, total 15.000. That will be 5 or 6 times an hour, but with 4 meter length this will be an average waterflow of 20 to 24 meters/h

in fact still nothing

Steen · Post by **Steen** » 29 Jun 2007, 21:02

I use sponge in all my tanks and haven't had any problems, but I can see some chewing signs

on the sponge in a tank with Panaque sp. l204. No health problems yet, i hope that ingested materials come out again the natural way

Might be difficult to see on the pic.

Steen

catfishguy3 · Post by **catfishguy3** » 01 Jul 2007, 12:30

Again, thanks for the feed-back folks. It's very helpful to be able to talk to fellow hobbiests. I like to do as much "homework" as possible BEFORE I set up a new tank to try and anticipate any problems. As my plan takes shape, I'm thinking to run a 900-1200GPH pump through a manifold of 3 3/4" PVC pipes placed below the gravel bed and anchored with silicon so they stay put. The pump will be placed in the tank, also on the tank floor so I can screen it with rockwork, driftwood or plants. I'm not sure if the heat from the pump will be an issue yet, but for the sake of simplicity I'd like to have everything inside the tank. I'm looking at a trio of Hydro V sponges, one at the end of each 3/4" line. That should distribute the flow to a level that won't be a problem for either the sponges or the pump and give me a large filter area. If need be, I may build some sort of enclosure out of acrylic to keep the fish away from the sponges, just in case. I should be able to come up with something that won't impede water flow, but safely encloses the filter area. The pump will be at the opposite end of the tank, discharging thru PVC spraybars located a few inches above the substrate for maximum flow across the bottom, through the rocks and driftwood furniture where my "cats" can most appreciate it. It may take some tweeking to get everything right, but it sounds like a workable setup to me. When I start putting it together I'll post pics. Anyone have experience with this type setup???

Bas Pels · Post by **Bas Pels** » 01 Jul 2007, 13:14

catfishguy3 wrote: The pump will be placed in the tank, also on the tank floor so I can screen it with rockwork, driftwood or plants. I'm not sure if the heat from the pump will be an issue yet, but for the sake of simplicity I'd like to have everything inside the tank.

The pump will certainly produce heat, which will stay in the tank for a while, and the tank will require less heating. However, this heat can be more than required.

I myself have a 177 * 45 * 40 cm tank, in which I pump 2500 l/hr (the water goes 8 times an huor through the filter, a lot but the fishes need fast moving water). This pump consumes 38 watts, and the water is 5 degrees Centigrade hotter than the room.

To me this is acceptable, and I don't need a heater.

If you intend to keep fishes which require cool water, you best pay more attention to power consumption than the price for the pump (often advisable, at least with our power prices) in order to keep this potential problem as small as possible.

On the other hand, if you intend to keep heat loving fishes, you might select a bigger pump, moving more water, and producing more heat, istead of using a heater. In this case the heat is more or less free

catfishguy3 · Post by **catfishguy3** » 01 Jul 2007, 15:37

Thanks Bas, that's useful info. The pump I'm looking at, a MAG Drive 950, puts out about 93 watts, which may raise my tank temp a bit higher than I want. I'm keeping South American cats and I know they're comfortable up to at least 80F/27C, but perhaps not much beyond that. If you're getting a 5C rise from a 38 watt pump, 93 watts might be too much, even without a heater, at least in summer months. I may have to explore other pump options or plump it to the outside to keep heat gain down. I keep my tanks about half open at the top, only enough glass to protect the lights from splashing water, so that helps heat dissapation, but perhaps that wouldn't be enough.