Can I keep a catfish i catch on the Mississippi in my dorm?

[mattattulane]

okay so maybe some catfish experts can help me out...my roomate never showed up and my room is looking sort of bare. what i'm wondering is, can i take a stroll down to audobaun park, catch a catfish, and keep it in an aquarium in my dorm room? and, should i be successful in catching a catfish, exactly what sort of aquarium setup would i need to have? Anxiously awaiting some advice.

oh you might ask, why a catfish?...cause this is Louisiana, of course.

[Silurus]

This depends on what kind of catfish you catch. If you end up with one of these or these, then housing it in a dorm room is very iffy. If you end up with one of these, then yes, it's possible.

[mattattulane]

thanks for the information silurus guess i should definitely know what kind of fish i catch. assuming i can't identify it on pulling it out of the river, any ideas for what to do till someone (probably on this site) can identify it for me? how should i house an unknown catfish?

[Silurus]

If you go fishing for catfish in a large river, you are more than likely to end up with the large species (either Ameiurus or Ictalurus). Go fishing in a small creek if you want madtoms (Noturus).

[apistomaster]

You can keep baby bullheads for quite awhile if you can find a school of juveniles. Small creeks are good places to search but your best bet will be a small shallow slough. Madtoms often take refuge inside a tin can! The chances are good for collecting either one from a small slough with clear water. Madtoms are the best because they stay just the right size. Nice part about natives is that you can relase the back where you caught them. I hope you can find some madtoms. They hide a lot doring the day more than the bullheads.

[MatsP]

Nice part about natives is that you can relase the back where you caught them. I hope you can find some madtoms.

This is indeed not such a good idea. I believe the guidelines is that if the fish has been "in captivity" for more than a few hours (perhaps even less), it should not be released into the wild again. When collectors are collecting fish for scientific studies, they will either release the fish immediately, or euthenaze it, and anyone capturing fish and releasing them again can risk spreading decease and illness from their home-environment into the wild.

--
Mats

[apistomaster]

MatsP,
It's a US fisherman's mentality. Believe me, we don't lose sleep over our native catfish here. They have been introduced all over the Country where the don't belong a 120 years ago. At least they are native to the Misssissippi basin. We could lose 50% of all the catfish in the US. That would be 100% of the ones that have been introduced where they don't belong. And now we have plecos to contend with in our waters. This has long past the point of being a naturalist's expedition. On top of that we have catfish farms where the fish are raised for market. Personally, when ever I've kept one of our own catfish and It out grows it's tank it gets a sharp rap on the head and then tossed in the garbage can. I forgot, when we had piranhas in our fish shop we would feed bullhead cats to them instead of gold fish. We had pretty big piranhas.

[MatsP]

Just because the current situation is pretty awfull doesn't mean that it's right to recommend doing "silly" things again. I'm not really worried about spreading the fish (although that would be a bad thing too), but rather spreading for instance new strains of Ich to a water that doesn't previously have any of that.

Releasing fish that has been kept in captivity is a bad thing, whether it's back to the same locality as it was captured, or elsewhere... It's just slightly WORSE if you move them around too.

--
Mats

[apistomaster]

Hatsp,
There is no significant danger releasing a catfish back into a slough it was captured from. There are much bigger threats imaginable and already realizes in this country from moving boats and trailers from one body of water to another or even fisherman (As myself) transmitting water plants like Eurasion Milfoil and Canadian Waterpest or the deadly virus that causes whirling disease although the US Fisheries Dept are most guilty of releasing infected fish from their hatcheries that has now spread from spread from coast to coast than putting a little catfish back where you caught him.
There isn't an Ich on earth that has and or ever will cost the billions as these other actions have. Then these same idiots turned Asian grass carp loose into US waters. I think we will just have to agree to disagree over this one.
There are, as we say, bigger fiish to fry.

[Nothonotus]

Mattattulane... if you are still interested and need help on the ID or would like to go out collecting with some fish nerds contact Hank Bart's lab there at Tulane; I'd try one of his grad students first, they're all more than competent and Hank's pretty busy. Even if you don't go out with them they may point you to a decent collection locality. Some of the madtoms will always be reclusive in captivity, like Noturus gladiator/stigmosus/munitus, but others adapt well and spend plenty of time in the open. Three of my favorites are N. hildebrandi, N. miurus, and N. gyrinus; all of which are usually locally abundant and do enjoy discarded cans and bottles or if the stream is still really nice check for intact, but minus original occupant, clam shells. Don't expect to get a madtom out of the mighty Miss., too many cities upstream for too long. Doesn't help that some people throw their trash out into the rivers following the mentality of "It's just a bag of trash. What's that compared to the damage factory X is doing?"

[apistomaster]

I discovered a small residiual population of an unidentified Madtom species in two widely separated tributaries of the Snake River System here in the PNW. They were appararently introduced to these non-native waters in the late 1890's when deliberate introductions were made of channel cat and bullhead cats.
I first found them in Sweetwater Creek on the Lapwai Nez Perce Indian Reservation and again a few years later in a slough of rhe Weiser River. I caught and kept some of the Weiser River madtoms for awhile. Only obscure academic papers have verified their prescence here and they are not as well adapted to the harsh winters so their numbers are very small up here.
I found these when I was only a about 11 years old back in 1961. A special permit would be necessary to investgate whether they are still present within the Reservation waters.
I just thought some might find it interesting that their range has been extended this far away from their native range.

[Nothonotus]

That would be interesting to see if they are still there. Did the papers ever mention anything about abundance or the species? It seems like it could be N. gyrinus as they tend to tolerate aquacultural conditions pretty well and look relatively (to other madtoms) similar to bullheads. There are odd populations in the southern Appalachians, so it seems they have the capability of living in more upland habitat. There are a lot of things that have been introduced out west. One of the oddest in my mind is Percina macrocephala which has been introduced to California, probably with Micropterus species.

[Shane]

There is no significant danger releasing a catfish back into a slough it was captured from.

Larry,
With all due respect, that is a statement that flies in the face of everything responsible aquarists try to teach. NANFA and the Native Fish Conservancy have clear "Once caught never released" policies. The issue here is not doing some collecting in a certain locale and putting back the animals that you do not intend to keep. The issue is placing a native fish in a fishroom where it can be potentially exposed to diseases not present in US waters and then releasing the animal. Escaped/released snakeheads and Clarias certainly do not do the hobby any favors as far as our reputation, but the introduction of some very nasty Brazilian parasite, West Africa fish virus, or SE Asian fungus sp will really get lawmakers lined up against us.

There isn't an Ich on earth that has and or ever will cost the billions as these other actions have. Then these same idiots turned Asian grass carp loose into US waters. I think we will just have to agree to disagree over this one.

I will certainly agree with you that introduced fishes do lots of damage, but they are a drop in the bucket compared to introduced diseases. Do a bit of research on the topic and you will find many grave examples among all animals. To use our own sp, how many Native Americans were physically killed by Europeans? There are several estimates, but it was only about 2-3% of the number killed by the diseases they brought from the Old World.
-Shane

[apistomaster]

I lost my copy of Inland Fishes of Washington but I was able to find a document surveying all the fish, but all species were listed by common names. The Tadpole Madtom is the species that managed to establish itself in our NW Snake/Coumbia River drainage, primaily at lower elevations ~ 1000ft above sea level. I'd have to switch places to search PC madtom catfish species information, if it's the same as the species you listed. I have always wanted to capture some for a cool water aquarium.stocked with locally occurring fishes as an adult.

[Shane]

Here is the NANFA Code of Ethics. I believe it is a good code for any collector. Please note my emphasis below.
-Shane

NANFA Members who collect native fishes from the wild and maintain them in private aquaria are encouraged to comply with the following Code of Ethics:
It is the responsibility of NANFA members to acquaint themselves with, and abide by, the collecting, fishing and fish transfer regulations of each Country, State or Province in which they collect, transfer, or ship fish.

Collecting must be done in an environmentally sound and responsible manner, which includes, but is not limited to: a) not removing numbers of fishes beyond that which one requires or is capable of sustaining; b) taking all reasonable actions to prevent negative impacts on the habitat in which one collects; c) respecting private property rights; and d) complying with any law-enforcement, natural-resource, or other conservation officer or agent encountered in the field.

NANFA members who enjoy collecting and maintaining fishes do so of their own accord. Except for specific programs funded and/or sponsored by the Association, NANFA does not sanction any specific collection and/or captive maintenance of native fishes.

Not all native fishes are suitable for aquaria, and some species may test the skills of even the most experienced aquarist. Therefore, members are encouraged to research the biology and captive requirements of each species before an attempt is made to remove them from the wild.

Fishes or other aquatic organisms must not be relocated or introduced into any outdoor bodies of water, even to places where they were originally collected (except catch and immediate release), including specimens raised in private aquaria, without permission from the appropriate governing agency. Members must realize that there are complicated and often unknown ecological processes at work in aquatic systems which may make fish introductions detrimental to the system. Potential problems from such introductions include displacement of native species, spread of disease, and the loss of genetic diversity via hybridization.
All reasonable attempts should be made to maintain fishes with the utmost regard for their safety and health, which includes, but is not limited to: maintaining sufficient water quality; providing water chemistry, temperature, oxygen levels and foods appropriate for each particular species; species compatibility; and the safe and humane transport of fishes from the wild to the aquarium. Sick or infirm specimens should be euthanized in a humane manner and disposed of properly.

[apistomaster]

Hi Shane,
As a life long flyfisherman who has lived in an area of the USA with some if not the finest native trout fisheries I am well informed of the damage done from non-native species and asscociated diseases. The majority are the results of actions taken by agencies of the Federal government.
These folks brought us native salmon and steelhead run killing dams, whirling disease, spiney ray and carp to our waters. Replaced the salmon an steelhead with genetically homogenized hatchery fish further spreading bad genes and deadly viral diseases.
Locally, the Government and big business of logging, mining and farming have delivered the coup degrace to our native fishes and their waters.
While I do not disagree in principal to the recommended policicies it is too late here to worry about returning an introduced catfish to the waters whence it came, locally.
And look at the furor the bleeding hearts kick up when the talk turns to killing a fish. Shane, a guy can't please everyone, all the time about everything.
For what is worth, I use single barbless hooks on all the flies I tie and I release all native wild fish I catch unharmed back where they are caught, both because of my own ethical reasons and it is the law here to do so.
This seems like an old topic to be raised here since I thought I was discussing the type of introduced non-native madtom now found in the lower elevations of the Columbia and Snake River drainages of the PNW which, by the way, were introduced in the 1890's by the US Fisheries Department to provide Easterners with the fish from back home. The hell with the existing native fish which are perfectly adapted to these waters. I suggest we vent on those doing the damage.
Respectfully,
Larry

[apistomaster]

For some reason the site won't let me edit my previous post!
I just wanted to add that there are a few hundred Native American Tribes that are upset enough with the US Government fisheries and dams to keep hundreds of cases in he Federal Courts to remediate as much of the damage their policies have caused to the environment.